[neenan]

Hi recently had VM installed, just the normal box not V+. I've plugged it upto my Samsung - PS50Q97HD via scart but the picture quality is not great.

Is this due to my scart connection and has anyone got an answer for how to get good picture quality please?

[Tkrockeruk]

I had the same model TV but the 42" version prior to the Pio 50" that I now use.

I had the normal Vbox and the V+ box with the samsung and have to say the picture was great with both, and even better on the pio.

Make sure the box is set to RGB in the menu and not composite.

[Arfa]

I recently got the standard SD box (Samsung 2110C I think), and yeah was also quite disappointed by the picture quality. Wired up using SCART RGB, made sure TV settings were exactly same as the Freeview input on my Bravia and yes the difference was considerable. Much more compression artefacts and the whole sea of blocks mess you get for busy sequences (flock of birds, water waves etc), happens a lot more. I guess they're just a lot more aggressive on compression with a lower bitrate. Also found some channels aren't wide screen, where as they are on Freeview (BBC News 24 springs to mind).

BTW we're pretty close to our TV transmitter - about 15 mile from Crystal Palace, so even with aerial in loft, Freeview is pretty good.

That said the SD box, does have optical out, so I can route that to our AV amp, which will probably have a better DAC than the Bravia (32V2000). Not that I could really notice much difference - probably lower bitrate on the audio stream too. Wish I had one of the newer Bravia's with digital audio output.

As we've only gone for cheapest option, with few (if any) extra channels over Freeview, the only thing I like about it, is the on-demand stuff and the BBC iPlayer. iPlayer quality is bad (as bad as PC version, I'm not sure), but its less phaff and hassle than using the PC iPlayer thing (especially as I'm running Linux...)

[mike7]

Originally Posted by Arfa

I recently got the standard SD box (Samsung 2110C I think), and yeah was also quite disappointed by the picture quality. Wired up using SCART RGB, made sure TV settings were exactly same as the Freeview input on my Bravia and yes the difference was considerable. Much more compression artefacts and the whole sea of blocks mess you get for busy sequences (flock of birds, water waves etc), happens a lot more. I guess they're just a lot more aggressive on compression with a lower bitrate. Also found some channels aren't wide screen, where as they are on Freeview (BBC News 24 springs to mind).

BTW we're pretty close to our TV transmitter - about 15 mile from Crystal Palace, so even with aerial in loft, Freeview is pretty good.

That said the SD box, does have optical out, so I can route that to our AV amp, which will probably have a better DAC than the Bravia (32V2000). Not that I could really notice much difference - probably lower bitrate on the audio stream too. Wish I had one of the newer Bravia's with digital audio output.

As we've only gone for cheapest option, with few (if any) extra channels over Freeview, the only thing I like about it, is the on-demand stuff and the BBC iPlayer. iPlayer quality is bad (as bad as PC version, I'm not sure), but its less phaff and hassle than using the PC iPlayer thing (especially as I'm running Linux...)

There is a clue in all of this that you have not made the correct settings. BBC News 24 certainly is in widescreen on the Virgin system and has been for some considerable time. This also applies to Virgin1 and Dave, although some older programmes are still shown in their original format. Lower bit rate problems exist with some channels. Make sure you have set the box to RGB mode.

When you are talking about the audio output of the Samsung it is restricted to stereo or Dolby pro-logic sound. There is no way that any true surround sound system can be outputted, indeed the programmes don't have it. When I had a Samsung box I found the normal L/R channels fed into my Yamaha amp satisfactorily. From experience I have not found the audio output on a new model Sony any better. Of course, if you want Dolby Surround, which only exists on some BBC HD programmes, then you need to change to a V+ box. Incidentally you will find that its upscaling feature considerably improves the SD performance. The difference between sound through an optical cable as opposed to a wire one is negligable in domestic circumstances.

[Tkrockeruk]

I have heard from several people that their free-view picture is better than their virgin picture. It's all down to location, my V+ and normal V box both put out a superb picture all the majority of channels and my free-view picture is dire in the west midlands.

[smilingcrow]

Originally Posted by Tkrockeruk

... my free-view picture is dire in the west midlands.

Is Freeview broadcast at the same bit-rates all round the country? If it is then surely the picture quality should be the same everywhere provided your signal quality is good enough!

[Arfa]

Hmm, fair enough, will double check that wide screen thing, I probably got the TV settings to preserve original aspect ratio all muddled up...

Yep the optical out from VM SD box, of course is just stereo. I was just postulating that the DAC in the AV amp would be better than the one in the Bravia - maybe. But agreed with the source in question, the differences are probably negligible and differing bitrates will be the bigger issue.

You say the box must be set to RGB, how do you do this, I've simply plugged the SCART in and that's it. Does it feed composite over SCART by default?

[mike7]

Originally Posted by Arfa

Hmm, fair enough, will double check that wide screen thing, I probably got the TV settings to preserve original aspect ratio all muddled up...

Yep the optical out from VM SD box, of course is just stereo. I was just postulating that the DAC in the AV amp would be better than the one in the Bravia - maybe. But agreed with the source in question, the differences are probably negligible and differing bitrates will be the bigger issue.

You say the box must be set to RGB, how do you do this, I've simply plugged the SCART in and that's it. Does it feed composite over SCART by default?

Go into the Settings menu then select Display and Audio settings. From here you will see the alternatives for the SCART output. Ensure that is set to RGB. Also you will be able to check if the screen output is set for for 16:9 or 4:3. Can't remember exactly how this is shown as I no longer have this model. If you have a widescreen set then set it for widescreen/16:9 output. This might be why you are getting News24 as 4:3. I've a feeling that as a default the boxes are set to 4:3. It's a lazy installer who has not changed this for you.

[mike7]

Originally Posted by smilingcrow

Is Freeview broadcast at the same bit-rates all round the country? If it is then surely the picture quality should be the same everywhere provided your signal quality is good enough!

I would think they are. The variations come between the various channels. BBC and Channel 5 seem better than anything else.

[Arfa]

Originally Posted by mike7

Go into the Settings menu then select Display and Audio settings. From here you will see the alternatives for the SCART output. Ensure that is set to RGB. Also you will be able to check if the screen output is set for for 16:9 or 4:3. Can't remember exactly how this is shown as I no longer have this model. If you have a widescreen set then set it for widescreen/16:9 output. This might be why you are getting News24 as 4:3. I've a feeling that as a default the boxes are set to 4:3. It's a lazy installer who has not changed this for you.

Haha! Bingo! Spot, box was set to 4:3 and composite...
Yep better now. Currently watching Sophiatown on BBC4, was coming through a 4:3 on cable, but wide on freeview. Now its wide on both.
Picture quality difference is not as great now, shall have to critically study it some more to gauge which is best. Up close you see big compression artifacts on both, hard to say which is worse.

Back to Sophiatown, definitely notice the difference in sound quality via the optical out. Lots of Jazz from South Africa, sounds much fuller and detailed via optical.

Thanks anyway!

[browney]

Althought my VM picture is good the picture on freeview is better I have found that films on VM seem to be better quality than a normal channel

[nialli]

Comparisons between Freeview and VM via SCART depend very much on the channels' bitrates. If you're watching BBC 1-4, there's little between the two if you've got your box set up correctly, but if you're watching any of the C4 stable or ITV 2-4, the lower bitrates should prove the VM box superior. Five's channels seem to be marginally better on VM too, and Dave and Virgin1 are again better on cable.
The best picture on cable though is a V+ box via HDMI, and personally I'd recommend that for any TV 32" or larger. The upscaling's every bit as good as you may have read about on other threads. It's not HD, but it ain't far off to most folk's eyes.
Unfortunately, a lot of installers (both cable and Sky) don't set up even the basics on a box right - I've a friend with Sky who'd been watching a zoomed 4:3 frame for six months on his 37" Samsung and he'd rightly complained bitterly about the PQ. Five minutes with the remote and I'd reset it for him properly - the difference was considerable. Not as good as a V+ mind, but still a big improvement.