Lumagen HDP Questions

[Jong1]

Hi Lumagen experts. Can I ask a few questions?

1. Does the Lumagen output on both the HDMI and component outputs at the same time?

I am trying to get round the Telewest TV Drive's limitation that when in HDMI mode it does not output on any other ports. I want to connect HDMI to the scaler, then HDMI to the TV and component to an HTPC. As sometimes I will want to set a recording on the HTPC, rather than the TV Drive, I do not want to have to change the TV Drive's settings each time I want the component outputs to be active.

I do understand there may be HDCP limitations on what goes down the component outputs at some point.

2. To make the whole system as easy as possible to use I want to route all HDMI via an AV receiver, so sound and vision can all be changed in one place. This means there will only be one HDMI connection to the scaler for potentially three sources. One will be 1080i (TV Drive) and one/two will be 1080p (an HTPC and maybe a blueray player). The screen will be 1080p native and supports 1:1 pixel mapping.

Is it possible for the scaler to automatically treat the 1080i and 1080p sources differently - for image correction and overscan - even when both are connected to the same physical input?

The 1080p sources may need little or no adjustment by the scaler (not sure, you will probably have a better idea what you might do). The TV Drive will probably need some overscan setting and probably some image correction apart from the obvious de-interlacing.

I do not want to do the obvious of running two HDMI cables to the TV because a) this would mean changing sources on both the TV and AV amp when switching and b) the HDMI cable run is around 10M.

3. Although I know I have asked this several times before I would like to take another stab! Do you think the Lumagen is going to do a worthwhile job when converting SD material upscaled to 1080i by the TV Drive to 1080p? I did see on another forum that Liam has set at least one up with a TV Drive.

Thanks for any help you can give!

Jon

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Jon,

The analogue output is active at same time as digital output as long as there is no HDCP present on the incoming source signal. However, when the digital output of the scaler is live and the scaler sees it is connected to a digital display the analogue output is limited to RGB and cannot be YPrPb. If you are not going to have both displays on at same time then you could set it up to do DVI to one and YPrPb to other. Just last week I did this for a client with 720P going to an HS51 and 576p going via component to a CRT TV.

Currently the DVI inputs do not support 1080P input signal.

I think it'll do a fine job and Lumagen are working on a new de-interlacing mode that may help clean up artefacts caused by the internal de-interlacing then re-interlacing of SD to 1080i in these new HD boxes. It is unknown at what time or whether it'll make it in to the Vision range at this point though, so no promises.

Gordon

[Jong1]

Thanks a lot Gordon.

So if no 1080p input at the moment I would obviously need to put the HDP between the TV Drive and the AV amp and connect the AV amp direct to the HTPC/Blue-ray devices. Right?

Is your assumption that this new de-interlacing mode would need a complete box swap, or might it be a firmware change? Safer to assume the former?

Jon

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

It wont be a box swap. If it's do-able it'll just be a firmware update. Depends if there is enough space left in the FPGA to fit it in I guess.

They are looking at adding 1080p24 support for DVI inputs as well to support BluRay. At present the best solution for that sort of source and HD-DVD is to send 1080i out and let the scaler make it 1080p. The film detection in the HDP/Q is very very good for 1080i sources and it's reported that the cadence is very reliable on the new disc based HD formats so you should get artefact free 1080P frames reconstituted in the scaler anway.

Gordon

[Jong1]

Interesting, but 1080p/24 would still not allow me to route the 1080p signal from the av amp through the Lumagen (as this will often be 1080p/50/60). Still haven't decided if I will use the HTPC for Blue-ray or get another player. If the former the output would certainly be 1080p/50/60 if the later I'd need to be really wow'd by the Lumagen's 1080p/24/25 to 1080p/50 over that done by the Blue-ray player.

I'm guessing this may be more of interest to a US audience where telecine comes into it. In the UK I would guess all blue-ray players would find it pretty easy to turn 1080p/25 to 1080p/50, no?

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Jon,

It's all speculation until actual hardware appears. Ideally you want to get 50Hz or 48Hz refresh rates from 1080P dependant on whether you are using R1 or R2 film sourced material. Lumagen can do either from 50 or 60Hz 1080i sources. How different it'd be to the players themselves outputting 1080P we just have to wait and see......of course Radiance is coming and it'll take in 1080P on all it's HDMI inputs.....at a price....

Gordon

[Jong1]

Just read about Radiance for the first time. Sounds great. Shame its so highly spec'd for home use. Don't suppose they are thinking of a scaled down version (no. of inputs)?

[gorman]

Originally Posted by Jong1

Just read about Radiance for the first time. Sounds great. Shame its so highly spec'd for home use. Don't suppose they are thinking of a scaled down version (no. of inputs)?

They actually are thinking about that, if I'm not mistaken.

[andrewfee]

Over at AVS Forums, someone from Lumagen has said that they are considering a "RadianceXS" model in addition to the announced XD. It's likely to have a single HDMI output and four HDMI inputs instead of six, while still having the same processing etc as the XD.

This isn't solid info though - he just said they were thinking about it, not that there will be one.

[Mr THX]

Originally Posted by Gordon @ Convergent AV

as long as there is no HDCP present on the incoming source signal.

Gordon

Sorry for the silly question but.............

How/when do you know that a HDCP signal is/will be present ?? Is it on all HD stuff that follows a digital path ??

[creative-av]

No, HDCP is down to the content owners and the manufacturers of the equipment that has a digital connection.

I believe all HDMI connections have to have HDCP but DVI doesn't. The other side of HDCP is the disabling of the analogue connections which is dependant on certain flags in the signal and again the manufacturer.

Steve

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Steve: HDMI doesn't have to have HDCP. The copy protection system mandated for HDMI is HDCP but if the copywrite holder doesn't want copyprotection on the signal transmitting their content then the source device doesn't need to encrypt. Of course, as that involves a little work on the side of the source manufacturers it appears that alot of HDMI devices just have an ALWAYS ON attitude to HDCP on HDMI output....but they don't have to. You can read elsewhere that Arcam for instance only enable HDCP on HDMI when they are supposed to.

Radiance lite......It's not heasay it's a fact. Jim has already stated on the record that there will be a Radiance family, just like there is a Vision family. The lower spec'd unit is still going to be much more than an HDP or HDQ though.....but it'll be lovely.....

G

[baritone]

gordon any timescale mentioned for the radiance lite family

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

I'll let you all know when I can....my money would be on news around mid Sept....ie CEDIA USA 06. That's where the press releases usually start happening from everyone. (that's news about the range and timescale, not that it'll be out in Sept)

G

[creative-av]

Thanks for the HDCP clarification Gordon.

Steve