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10-11-2005, 12:29 PM
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#1 (permalink)
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Thanks: Gave 0, Got 0 | 1024 displays are not HD The HD Ready logo is misleading!
720P is 1280x720 resolution, the minimum HD resolution. 1024x.... displays can not show that resolution without the resolution being degraded down to 1024x.... resolution. The HD ready logo allows such tvs to be called HD Ready which gives the false impression that such tvs can actually show the minimum established HD resolution when in fact they can not.They can give a nice picture but it is not HD, it is not 720P 1280x720, the minimum established HD resolution that you are likely to see being broadcasted throughout Europe.
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10-11-2005, 12:45 PM
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#2 (permalink)
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720p is not ALWAYS 1280x720. Just as 1080i is not ALWAYS 1920x1080. They are maximum standards.
In the US 1080i is often broadcast in 1280x1080. In Aus 1080i is broadcast as 1440x1080.
Non-SR HDCams operate at 1440x1080 on tape. DVCPro HD operates at 960x720 or 1280x1080 on tape. (That includes a LOT of material shot on the Varicam camcorder)
A lot of HD material has little HF energy above a certain level - so the perceived resolution of an HD display running in 1024x720 compared with a 1280x720 display may be far less than many people imagine - and certainly not look 20% softer. MPEG2 and MPEG4 work by progressively ditching HF detail, and often pre-soften to reduce compression artefacts.
Sure if everything else is equal a 1280x720 display is preferable to a 1024x720 display. However if things are not equal - you may get a far more watchable picture by chosing the lower resolution display, if things like black level, chromaticity, gamma, greyscale handling etc. are superior on the lower resolution display.
If you particularly want a small plasma, rather than an LCD, because the plasma benefits appeal to you, you may have a choice between a 1024x720 line plasma, or an SD panel.
If there isn't a 1280x720 panel in the technology you want, or at the price point you can afford, then you should still chose an HD Ready logo device rather than one that doesn't.
I would also be slightly wary of 1366x768 panels until you've seen them displaying a 720p native source - just so you can evaluate the quality of the vertical scaling compared to a 720 line native display.
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10-11-2005, 12:46 PM
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#3 (permalink)
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It's a good job that the human eye doesn't notice much change in resolution in the vertical res as it does in the horizontal then.
Same as current SD 16:9 which is 4:3 digital ratio. Don't think anyone can see any quality loss if it's shown in 16:9 or squashed 4:3. Stretcit the OTHER way and the quality loss is cleraly there to see.
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10-11-2005, 3:38 PM
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#4 (permalink)
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10-11-2005, 5:21 PM
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#5 (permalink)
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Bothered?
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10-11-2005, 6:10 PM
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#6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MikeK | I think its worth pointing out (again) that 1024x plasmas are not being marketed as "HDTVs", they are being marketed as "HD Ready" and comply with that standard fully. Its also worth noting that they are only marketed as HDTVs in the USA, along with a lot of panels that lack any digital inputs with HDCP.
Whether you agree with the standards set out for the HD Ready logo or not, its better having it than not, as before we faced the same situation as the US when it comes to connectivity (or lack of) and compatability with standards likely to be broadcast in this country.
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10-11-2005, 8:20 PM
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#7 (permalink)
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Am I bothered?
StooMonster
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10-11-2005, 8:29 PM
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#8 (permalink)
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I have to follow that with "Huh, what a f****** liberty" as said by the old Gran......
H 
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10-11-2005, 9:09 PM
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#9 (permalink)
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10bii, this subject has already been covered at length in another thread. Why start a new one? Do you live under a bridge? I already explained that 1024 x 720/768 plasmas are labelled HDTV in the US.
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11-11-2005, 12:35 AM
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#10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Quickbeam 10bii, this subject has already been covered at length in another thread. Why start a new one? Do you live under a bridge? I already explained that 1024 x 720/768 plasmas are labelled HDTV in the US. | HD uses square pixels but on display panels pixels are not always square. 1024x768 is exactly 16:9 using rectangular pixels. 1280x720 is 16:9 using square pixels.
You need to learn more about different display technologies. Good place is here. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=40
Last edited by CKNA; 11-11-2005 at 12:42 AM.
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11-11-2005, 12:39 AM
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#11 (permalink)
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Thanks: Gave 1, Got 4 | Code: In the US 1080i is often broadcast in 1280x1080.
That is innacurate statement. There is only one provider that does this. It is Directv. They take 1920x1080 and downconverted to 1280x1080 to compress better. There is no HD in US that originates as 1280x1080. Besides it is only temporary as they are switching to Mpeg4 now.
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11-11-2005, 10:35 AM
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#12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Stephen Neal 720p is not ALWAYS 1280x720. Just as 1080i is not ALWAYS 1920x1080. They are maximum standards.
In the US 1080i is often broadcast in 1280x1080. In Aus 1080i is broadcast as 1440x1080.
Non-SR HDCams operate at 1440x1080 on tape. DVCPro HD operates at 960x720 or 1280x1080 on tape. (That includes a LOT of material shot on the Varicam camcorder) | Care to give any examples of less than 720P shows being broadcasted?
Also, as far as I know, the resolution 1280x1080 you keep mentioning is not the norm. Quote: |
Originally Posted by Stephen Neal A lot of HD material has little HF energy above a certain level - so the perceived resolution of an HD display running in 1024x720 compared with a 1280x720 display may be far less than many people imagine - and certainly not look 20% softer. MPEG2 and MPEG4 work by progressively ditching HF detail, and often pre-soften to reduce compression artefacts. | HD on 1024 displays and HD on 1280 displays is a noticeabe difference. I can also clearly see it on my PC monitor.
People here need to stop selling 1024 displays as HD because they are not.  | |
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11-11-2005, 10:36 AM
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#13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by CKNA Code: In the US 1080i is often broadcast in 1280x1080.
That is innacurate statement. There is only one provider that does this. It is Directv. They take 1920x1080 and downconverted to 1280x1080 to compress better. There is no HD in US that originates as 1280x1080. Besides it is only temporary as they are switching to Mpeg4 now. | Darn CKNA, I was waiting for a response and you blew it!  | |
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11-11-2005, 10:41 AM
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#14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MikeK | Well then I hope you are happy with your 1024x720 EDTV broadcasts. 
Also, do me a favor, don't change what people write to make a point. Not everyone will understand or realize that you have done so. Many forums don't tolerate such things. It's also rather childish. | |
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11-11-2005, 10:44 AM
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#15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Quickbeam 10bii, this subject has already been covered at length in another thread. Why start a new one? Do you live under a bridge? I already explained that 1024 x 720/768 plasmas are labelled HDTV in the US. | Yep, and what is being labeled as HDTV in America is absolutely irrelevant to an official European HD Ready label being misleading and flawed.
I started this thread to make it clear to people that are new to HD. The other thread's title does not necessarily do that.
I actually live above a bridge, by the way. | |
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