Sonos system component choice?

[Empgamer]

Having decided to go the Sonos route I'd be grateful for a few pointers on equipment that I might need to go with it, and such things as cables etc (and being a complete newb I mean brand and type, or even model number).

First two big questions for me are the NAS and whether to use the Z80 or Z100 Zone Players.

With the NAS the Buffalo LS or even Terrastation seem to be very much favoured by Sonos forumites and re-sellers. I do however fancy the QNAP TS109 on the basis that it is silent and, I believe, has won quite a few awards etc. Now, on the basis that one of the reasons I'm going down the Sonos route is ease of set up and use, I wonder if I am buying into a load of compatibility problems that I'm actually trying to avoid with going the TS-109 route? There do seem to be quite a few forum users on the Sonos site that use them without problems though. I also wonder if there are any other issues with going the non-Buffalo route that I may have missed? Many re-sellers also seem to do the TS109 pre-loaded with Slim Server. I suspect I should find one that doesn't or ask the seller not to put it on. Also, the TS 109 comes with many drive options. I plan on going for a 500G for now. Is there any preference over the hard drive model/brand etc and, would the TS 109 Pro be a significantly better product than the vanilla 109?

On the speaker front I'm unclear on what might be the best option for the rooms without legacy systems. Do I go for the Z100 with un powered speakers or should I go down the Z80 route and use powered???? I'm just wondering what option will give me the better choice, and possibly cost, in speakers. Matt pointed out the BR2 and the Mordaunt Short 902i and indeed hinted that something else may be coing out soon. The BR2 seems good (which I think are unpowered so would need a Z100) but I see Peter Tyson online is doing a free pair of speaker stands with the Mordaunts worth £58 which is perhaps not to be sniffed at. There was a temptation to go for a pair of AudioEngine A5s for one of the rooms given that they have the direct MP3 plug in and play capability but, as the Sonos will be so easy to use (I hope), there seems little point in plugging in a player to play MP3 when the Sonos can boot up and access a FLAC version dircet from the NAS.

Now, is there anything else I'd need (cables, or indeed anything else I've overlooked, etc and if so any recs) other than the below:

Sonos £699 starter bundle (the Z80 for the office near the wireless router and PC), the 100 for a room needing only non-powered speakers, and the remote.

Pair of speakers for the 100 (likely BR2)

Z80 for connecting to the lounge cinema system.

Z100 and pair of unpowered (likely BR2 again) for another room.

Like I say, it's the cables that concern me too. Not sure what will come with the Sonos or any speakers I buy, which cables are the best to get, to connect to which of the outlets on the Sonos ZPs and a rough price?

Ripcaster are doing a seemingly good deal on Sonos at the moment - it is basically the 2 x Z100/speaker package + a Buffalo 320G LS for £1219. I think though it may be false economy (given the sums involved in this little venture of mine!!!) in that I suspect the 320 GB may not be big enough long term (and I wonder if the TS-109 is more versatile) and the speakers can, it seems, be bettered, even for the same outlay? Time to scour the net for other deals (but there don't seem to be TOO many!!!).

Finally, there has been suggestion of an option which doesn't tie a Z80 into the router? Any pointers on whether that is really feasible would be useful and if so, how. Tying £250 into what is merely a router connection doesn't seem like the most cost effective use of pennies but I'll go that route if I have to, or if the option is too much time and hassle.

Any help appreciated.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

Finally, there has been suggestion of an option which doesn't tie a Z80 into the router? Any pointers on whether that is really feasible would be useful and if so, how. Tying £250 into what is merely a router connection doesn't seem like the most cost effective use of pennies but I'll go that route if I have to, or if the option is too much time and hassle.

A pair of the Solwise 86Mbps Homeplugs will solve that problem. I have a single zone Sonos system with my only Zoneplayer (ZP80) in my Living Room wired thorugh the mains using these to my router.

http://www.homeplugs.co.uk/acatalog/...HomePlugs.html

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

Sonos £699 starter bundle (the Z80 for the office near the wireless router and PC), the 100 for a room needing only non-powered speakers, and the remote.

Pair of speakers for the 100 (likely BR2)

Z80 for connecting to the lounge cinema system.

Z100 and pair of unpowered (likely BR2 again) for another room.

With configuration you might want to consider getting two of the BU130 bundles which would gain you an extra controller for only an extra £100.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

First two big questions for me are the NAS and whether to use the Z80 or Z100 Zone Players.

With the NAS the Buffalo LS or even Terrastation seem to be very much favoured by Sonos forumites and re-sellers. I do however fancy the QNAP TS109 on the basis that it is silent and, I believe, has won quite a few awards etc. Now, on the basis that one of the reasons I'm going down the Sonos route is ease of set up and use, I wonder if I am buying into a load of compatibility problems that I'm actually trying to avoid with going the TS-109 route? There do seem to be quite a few forum users on the Sonos site that use them without problems though. I also wonder if there are any other issues with going the non-Buffalo route that I may have missed? Many re-sellers also seem to do the TS109 pre-loaded with Slim Server. I suspect I should find one that doesn't or ask the seller not to put it on. Also, the TS 109 comes with many drive options. I plan on going for a 500G for now. Is there any preference over the hard drive model/brand etc and, would the TS 109 Pro be a significantly better product than the vanilla 109?

I personally would recommend the Buffalo Linkstation Live 500Gb. It is ideally suited for use with the Sonos is is very easy to set up. The Sonos website itself has documentation detailer how to configure one for use with the Sonos.

https://sonos.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/s...hp?p_faqid=610

The instructions that come with the Bufflao also detail how to integrate it with the iTunes library.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

Now, is there anything else I'd need (cables, or indeed anything else I've overlooked, etc and if so any recs) other than the below

You will need speaker cable and speaker stands for the BR2s. I would recommend Monitor Audio's own cable, Purefolw Silver, which retails for £5.50/metre. For speaker stands the Atacama Nexus 6 would be ideal and retail for £69/pair.

You will also want to buy a charging cradle for each Controller you intend to have which are £29.99 each.

I would also consider getting a separate 500Gb hard drive, either internal for your PC or a USB drive, to provide a back of everything that is on the NAS drive. For the sake of an extra £50-60 this would be advised. You would be very annoyed if you have to manually load your entire collection back onto the NAS if it ever fails.

[Empgamer]

Thanks Crusty. I did actually look at the prospect of 2 x the £699 bundles and it does seem by far the best. Like you say, ectra controller for £100 v £279 if I want one later, or to put it another way, £356 saving on buying the separates.

This business with the Buffalo LS does concern me. Only reason I got distracted with the TS109 is its winning of awards AND it being silent. That said I don't know how noisy the Buffalo LS is? Power consumption would be a consideration so I may check that out. The Buffalo LS is certainly cheaper (Amazon do the 500 for £156 versus I think £179 at some of the Sonos dealers). I know the TS-109 is very flexible but I just have to watch i don't talk myself out of money, buying flexibility I'm unlikely to need.

How do those plugs work? Would I still not need to be connected to the router to receive internet radio etc. I'm not sure what the plugs actually do?

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

That said I don't know how noisy the Buffalo LS is?

I cannot normally hear it until I am within 6" of it. It's a lot quieter than a few other NAS drives I have heard.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

The Buffalo LS is certainly cheaper (Amazon do the 500 for £156 versus I think £179 at some of the Sonos dealers)

Whilst that is true, for the sake of £25 it might be worth considering if you will require any technical support from your Sonos dealer with the NAS drive. For example, asa Sonos and Buffalo dealer myself I will only provide free telephone and in store technical support on products that I have sold myself. Even if the customer has bought the same drive elsewhere I will not provide assistance if it was not bought from me.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

How do those plugs work? Would I still not need to be connected to the router to receive internet radio etc. I'm not sure what the plugs actually do?

The Homeplugs create a wired network connection between two points in your house using the existing mains wiring. So what you do is:

1. Connect your NAS drive to your router.
2. Connect a Homeplug to your router with CAT5
3. Plug the Homeplug into a mains socket and turn on
4. Plug a Homeplug into your Zoneplayer with CAT5 in another room
5. Plug the Homeplug into a mains socket and turn on
6. Plug your Zoneplayer into the mains and configure the system. This is now your first wired Zoneplayer and it doesn't even have to be in the same room as the router or NAS drive.

Here are more examples of how they can be used.

http://www.homeplugs.co.uk/acatalog/diagrams.html

[Empgamer]

That's great Crusty, thanks. I'd prefer avoiding making my own cables if possible, particularly as the speakers will in all cases only be a few feet apart. Presumably there are branded, pre-made packed leads that would do the job.

Good point on the Buffalo LS. Given the cost of investment in this £20 is neither here or there. There is a temptation to try and find a Sonos dealer that does the lot; NAS, Sonos, cables and speakers (albeit I'm not struck on those Sonos ones and I suppose as a non-technology part of the system the speakers are less critical to get from the same place).

I'm not sure at all on the speaker side. Those BR2s seem very good, and I suppose again, penny pinching on speakers when compared to overall system costs may be stupid. That said the BR2 are around £180-200 and yet the Mordaunt 920s are about £150, and with those free stands from Peter Tyson (which IIRC are Altacama 5), it seems like a good deal. Even the F1s may be an option for the bedroom perhaps, rather than BR2s or Mordaunts for each room (I stress I like my music but I'm by no means an expert/audiophile so I might not tell the difference). I would like some speakers with a bit of belt in them for the kitchen though for when we are in party mode!! The kitchen speakers will likely need to go either on top of a unit or even on a book case so I wonder if BR2s will be wasted there? There's nowehere to put any stands at all so that's not an option.

As a total aside, I'm also a little dissapointed with how little volume I can get out of my Sony DAV S500 Home Theatre. It's old now and I'm half considering upgrading the satellites with some of the F1s.

BTW, presume the controller comes with a charging cable? I'm not sure I'm keen on the cradle.

At the moment I'm looking at buying through Ripcaster who seem to have some good deals. Is there any online trader that anyone would recommend? Ripcaster seem to be well thought of though, from what I can gather.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

That's great Crusty, thanks. I'd prefer avoiding making my own cables if possible, particularly as the speakers will in all cases only be a few feet apart. Presumably there are branded, pre-made packed leads that would do the job.

You dealer will be able to make up cables of the right length for you and with the correct terminations. You will want 4mm banana plugs on one end for the speakers and bare wire for the Zoneplayer end.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

There is a temptation to try and find a Sonos dealer that does the lot.

It is for this specific reason only that I do stock things such as Buffalo NAS drives and Homeplugs. Being a Hi-Fi dealer they are not normally the sort of thing I carry in stock. However since becoming a Sonos dealer, quite some time now, I thought it would make sense for customers to be able to purchase everything they needed to get the system up and running from one dealer. It means that I am familiar with every part of their system and am in a much better position to troubleshoot if they have any issues. It also means this if it myself installing the system for a client, this is something I do a lot of, then there are usually no surprises sprung on me. I can go out to a job knowing that I already have pretty much all the hardware I need to complete the system without having to worry about whether I can figure out how to use what the client has decided to buy elsewhere for a few quid less.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

I would like some speakers with a bit of belt in them for the kitchen though for when we are in party mode!! The kitchen speakers will likely need to go either on top of a unit or even on a book case so I wonder if BR2s will be wasted there. There's nowhere to put any stands at all so that's not an option.

The Monitor Audio BR1 would also be a good option. Another even cheaper option would be to use ZP80s instead coupled up to the Acoustic Energy Aego M Active Sub/Sat system. This is a very cost effective solution that is also very discreet; all you need to do is find a place to hide the subwoofer which is not that big anyway.

http://www.acoustic-energy.co.uk/Pro...ies/Aego_M.asp

Originally Posted by Empgamer

As a total aside, I'm also a little disappointed with how little volume I can get out of my Sony DAV S500 Home Theatre. It's old now and I'm half considering upgrading the satellites with some of the F1s.

That will be down to the speakers and the poor quality amplification in the system itself. Changing the speakers alone is not likely to help, in fact it may cause problems if the amplification struggles to drive the new speakers. I would suggest looking seriously at some more upmarket discreet home cinema solutions. The Arcam Solo Movie paired with the new Arcam Muso/Logo speaker package is superb and is not shy volume-wise.

http://www.arcam.co.uk/prod_Solo_movie_intro.cfm

http://www.arcam.co.uk/prod_muso_logo_intro.cfm

Originally Posted by Empgamer

BTW, presume the controller comes with a charging cable? I'm not sure I'm keen on the cradle.

Yes, the controller comes with a charging cable, but I can assure you that the cradle is far more convenient to use and gives you a useful place to store the cradle. It can even be wall mounted.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

At the moment I'm looking at buying through Ripcaster who seem to have some good deals. Is there any online trader that anyone would recommend? Ripcaster seem to be well thought of though, from what I can gather.

I would recommend you buy from a reputable retailer where you can buy everything to need from one place and is likely to have the technical knowledge and experience with the products to be able to offer you any technical support should you need it. I would probably recommend buying from somewhere that can demonstrate the system with the speakers you intend to purchase. Speakers are something I would never recommend buying without listening to them first, and ideally with the electronics you plan to use them with.

[Empgamer]

That's useful, thanks Crusty. I'm in South West Wales, near Carmarthen so the Hi-Fi dealer options are a little thin on the ground, let alone finding one that does Sonos (albeit I haven't strated looking yet).

You surprise me with the speaker cables. From the back it looks like the Z80/100 accept plugs of some description on the speaker cables. I assume sonos do not supply any speaker connection cables at all?

That Arcam kit looks nice for Home Theatre. Given the cost of this little lot though I may leave the cinema upgrade a year or so. Albeit weak, my wife thinks the DAV S500 goes loud enough as it is, suppose it does really, just lacks a bit of oomph for the times Mrs Emp isn't in the room and again, if you want some loud party music.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

You surprise me with the speaker cables. From the back it looks like the Z80/100 accept plugs of some description on the speaker cables. I assume sonos do not supply any speaker connection cables at all?

You do not get any speaker cable supplied with the Sonos Zoneplayers. If you buy the Sonos speakers they do come supplied with some pretty basic cable.

The terminals on the ZP100 are push-in sprung terminals. They are a lot better than nast spring clip terminals, but they are not designed to accept 4mm plugs. Once pushed fully open the sprung terminals can be made to take a 4mm plug but they are not designed for that so you'd be just as well using bare wire. I am sure of you were buying all of this from one dealer you might be able sort out some kind of deal on speaker cable.

[Empgamer]

Thanks. I might well drop you a PM. Not sure if you are able to do any deals at all? I have seen an offer at Bluestream with a controller, 2 x Z100 and 2 pairs of 920i speakers for £1039. That seems a good price too!!!! I suspect I'd be quite happy with the 920s. I'd also likely need one, or possibly two, Z80 (dependant if I go down the plug route - I don't have many spare sockets though - not sure if they work on extensions). I'd also need the NAS.

I know what you say re getting everything from the same dealer and it's very appealing but costs do come into it, I was wrong with the price comparision for the 500 LS Pro as it's £199 at one Sonos dealer and £156 at Amazon. That's quite a saving. I accept there's always the technical support side but I would this system isn't quite so problematic to use, that's the whole idea of stumping up the extra cash really, otherwise I may as well go with the SB3.

[Crustyloafer]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

Thanks. I might well drop you a PM. Not sure if you are able to do any deals at all? I have seen an offer at Bluestream with a controller, 2 x Z100 and 2 pairs of 920i speakers for £1039. That seems a good price too!!!! I suspect I'd be quite happy with the 920s. I'd also likely need one, or possibly two, Z80 (dependant if I go down the plug route - I don't have many spare sockets though - not sure if they work on extensions). I'd also need the NAS.

The Homeplug devices in my experience work just fine on 4 way extensions.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

I know what you say re getting everything from the same dealer and it's very appealing but costs do come into it, I was wrong with the price comparision for the 500 LS Pro as it's £199 at one Sonos dealer and £156 at Amazon. That's quite a saving. I accept there's always the technical support side but I would this system isn't quite so problematic to use, that's the whole idea of stumping up the extra cash really, otherwise I may as well go with the SB3.

The NAS I was referring to and keep in stock is the Linkstation Live and not the Linkstation Pro. The Linkstation Live lends itself to be more easily used as a multimedia streaming NAS rather than just a passive network storage device. It also integrates seamlessly with iTunes. See here for comparison chart. Although there may be a price difference on one or two of the components, I would be surpised if those differences couldn't be absorbed by the dealer if you were buying the whole lot from them, including speakers.

http://www.buffalo-technology.com/co...e/linkstation/

[scooby_doo]

Originally Posted by Empgamer

I do however fancy the QNAP TS109 on the basis that it is silent and, I believe, has won quite a few awards etc……………Many re-sellers also seem to do the TS109 pre-loaded with Slim Server. I suspect I should find one that doesn't or ask the seller not to put it on. Also, the TS 109 comes with many drive options. I plan on going for a 500G for now. Is there any preference over the hard drive model/brand etc and, would the TS 109 Pro be a significantly better product than the vanilla 109?

I appreciate you’re now not going for the QNAP so this is for the benefit of others. The QNAP is much more powerful and flexible than the Buffalo. I bought mine purely to feed my squeezeboxes but now use it for plenty of other functions too. Infact streaming to the squeezeboxes is probably the thing it’s now used least for! For example, we’ve just the one printer in our house and if we wanted to print anything from a laptop or other desktop we’d have to transfer the file across to the main pc and print from there. Now we just print wirelessly or across the network. Of course you still have to go into the room where the printer is to collect your output The killer for me tho is Twonky. We now stream photos/videos to various devices dotted around the home. As I said in my other post it’s now our central server and I don’t know how we managed to live without it!

In terms of the Pro verses the Non-Pro, the difference is the Pro supports Windows AD & NFS.

If you don't want Slimserver pre-installed you could always ask them to not install it or buy the diskless version. It's a doddle to put a drive in there. Just a couple of screws.

Originally Posted by Empgamer

There was a temptation to go for a pair of AudioEngine A5s for one of the rooms given that they have the direct MP3 plug in and play capability but, as the Sonos will be so easy to use (I hope), there seems little point in plugging in a player to play MP3 when the Sonos can boot up and access a FLAC version dircet from the NAS.

If you’ve read the reviews you’ll know that the A5s are a waste if all you want to do is plug an MP3 player into them. I’d prefer them to not have the connectors on them since they look better without. You can always plug something into the USB port to charge it up, saves turning on a computer to do it