[larkone]

Originally Posted by jreed110

So what's the actually loss in sound quality with the apple tvmover apple express? Is it going to be noticeable? Has anyone with both an apple express and tv compared the two?

They have here: New Apple TV is NOT bit perfect | Computer Audiophile

[wysinawyg]

Originally Posted by larkone

They have here: New Apple TV is NOT bit perfect | Computer Audiophile

And to quote:

"I did have to listen closely, with headphones (AKG K702), and in a quiet environment"

So someone found a slight artifact in piano recordings when specifically listening for it with headphones in a quiet environment.

Aside from that artifact, or with speakers or in a normal environment with a bit of background noise - they couldn't tell a difference. i.e. for most real world purposes you aren't going to tell the difference.

[larkone]

Having spent a lot of time ensuring my rips are as good as they can be and that the data stream is bit perfect to the DAC, I would be very unhappy to have my music re-sampled using one of the more complicated re-sampling algorithms, on the fly by a device with low computational power (44.1->48 is not integer based so requires some complicated maths to achieve the re-sampling). The main loss will be around transparency and soundstaging. If that doesn't bother you then its fine and go for it.

[GSARider]

Have tried both and can't say I can notice a difference in normal use. I have two atv 2's and three airport linked speakers.

Most of my music is saved as apple lossless.

[jreed110]

Got my atv today and have to say I'm a little disappointed and considering taking it back. In stereo the sound seems fine, but as soon as I switch to surround it's horrible. With film or tv I can't make out the speech at all, it's very quiet and muffled, and with normal music any singing is again muffled and strangely spread around all the speakers. It seems to be unable to interpret the 5.1 signal as this is fine with the aex. Anyone any thoughts or similar experience?

[jtrascap]

Are you using the optical output? I understand that's 5.1...

[amcluesent]

Apple is pushing to ditch docking and just use Airplay for accessories.

If Apple gets their way, wiring up your music player to speakers may end up going the way of the Walkman.

Tech website Pocket-Lint has been told by accessory makers that Apple wants the next generation of docking stations to be wireless, rather than plugging an iPhone directly into a dock to play music.

[Autopilot]

Originally Posted by amcluesent

Apple is pushing to ditch docking and just use Airplay for accessories.

If Apple gets their way, wiring up your music player to speakers may end up going the way of the Walkman.

Tech website Pocket-Lint has been told by accessory makers that Apple wants the next generation of docking stations to be wireless, rather than plugging an iPhone directly into a dock to play music.

Massive can of worms which leaves me wondering many things, such as...

• Docking stations will likely cost more to build, thus costing more to buy.
  
• Not charging your iPhone at the same time could be a big problem.
  
• I take it Airplay has the ability to create an ad-hok connection, because you wont always have a full wireless network (car, camping, park, etc...)?
  
• What impact does Airplay have on sound quality if using high bitrate files? Does it use some kind of compression?

[larkone]

This is Apple dumbing down quality and hiding it behind new technology - Airplay!! They did this with compressed music formats, hiding the loss of sound quality behind the wonderful portability of i-pods. Agree with Autopilot here, but the Apple fanbois will buy it, because Apple will tell them how good it is and they will believe it.

Other thing to consider is that on portable devices using wireless will kill the battery quickly as well, but Apple will not mention that of course.

[wysinawyg]

Build Cost - I'd doubt there is much in it when you're comparing the proprietary dock connector and all the gubbins associated with that vs the proprietary chips. I suspect there is more license costs than hardware, particularly for "Made for iPod" or whatever it is.

Charging - presumably this will be at the same time Apple moves to inductive charging so although there won't be a dock you'll have the choice of an inductive pad where you sit or on the more expensive speakers there may well be one built in. I've never seen battery life as an issue even with my iPhone (and its certainly not an issue for the iPad) using Airplay and I'd much rather have the touchscreen remote in my hands rather than plugged into the speaker.

Ad-hoc - don't know, I've only ever used Airport Expresses which create their own network.

Compression - there isn't any, plenty of tests have been done to show Airplay is bit perfect (albeit that the AppleTV isn't) so it will really be implementation by the vendors that controls sound quality.

[davidavdavid]

Having just seen/experienced/heard one too many SONOS commercials on television and billboards on the Underground, i just had to say "c'mon people, buy a vowel, grow a limb"

I have just set up Airport Expresses in each room of the flat and connected to each of those are paris of AudioEngine A2 speakers and with Airfoil and Airfoil speakers I am sending music to each and every pair of speakers as well as my main audio system. The beauty of Airfoil is that I can effortlessly turn music off and on in rooms of the flat, and with the Airport Wireless Extreme Base Station at the very heart of all this, I can attach my terabytes of lossless High Definition tracks to the network and have the source content be available to any device connecting to the network.

[signs]

Yeah , but the Sonos does look cool

[larkone]

and doesn't necessarily need the pain that is iTunes

[andy1249]

An airport express unit is nowhere near as good as any Sonos unit in terms of performance , see here ....

Computer Audiophile - Measurements: First and Second Generation Apple AirPort Express

First generation units were OK , Second generation was approx a 41% drop in quality , so any unit you can buy now is poor compared to the likes of a Sonos.

Last Time I checked the Sonos didnt do high res audio , i.e. anything better than 16bit/44khz , however the distortion on this material with the airport express is so bad you may as well not have it.
Quoted from the article above ...

WAV, AIFF, Apple Lossless, MP3, and AAC files at 16 bit / 44.1 kHz are bit perfect (without data loss) from iTunes to the AirPort and through the AirPort's optical output. All other sample rates including 48 kHz, 88.2 kHz, 96 kHz, 176.4 kHz, and 192 kHz are converted to 44.1 kHz. All 24 bit content is truncated to 16 bits. The phase remains correct even with bit truncation from 24 bits to 16 bits. Both 16 bit DC and Walking Zero tests were bit true as well. 24 bit Walking Zero was truncated to 16 bit.

So while they may "play" high res material , that is not what is output ....

I Spent most of 2011 travelling , and have both Airport express and an Airport basestation for easy access in various hotels , this being their main purpose after all , but as music units or as part of a quality Home entertainment system , they suck big time.

Presumably if your into high res music your something of a connoisseur , in which case Airport Express units cannot be recommended.

[davidavdavid]

For the purposes of satellite systems with powered speakers the Airport Express can suit nicely.

[amcluesent]

Arcam launch Airplay linked DAC -

The Arcam airDAC is a perfect way to connect your Apple music device to any high quality music system using the Airplay system. Connecting to your home network by wired or wireless connections the airDAC will be the the first dedicated, audiophile Airplay DAC available.

[kevj58]

I am seeking advice on a wireless speaker system to be used in an open plan lounge dining area, approximately 6mts x 6mts. It is a remote holiday property, so does not have a phone line. For Wi-Fi, I am using a 3 My-Fi mobile broadband devise and generally get a good signal. We are wall to wall Apple, so Iphones, IPods and Ipads will be used as sources. Airplay would be the obvious choice to stream.
The models I am considering are:
B&W A5/A7
Cambridge Audio Minx Air 100/200
Budget ideally around £400, but would be prepared to push to the A7 if the performance warranted the extra outlay.
I think the first question is, would the Minx 100 and the A5 be powerful enough in a 6 x 6 meter room? If not this narrows my choices to the larger models.
Are there any other suggestions? I looked at a Sonos Play 5, but I am not sure if this would work with my mobile broadband.
I have not auditioned any of the models as yet, (I don’t think the Minx 200 is available yet, but the 100 gets good reviews).
Any advice would be appreciated.
Cheers

[amcluesent]

Any advice would be appreciated.

Hi-end AirPlay speaker choices - don't 'need' sonos

[rybu]

http://www.libratone.com/live/intro/

Libratone live

A friend has got one. He's very happy with it.

[Autopilot]

Originally Posted by rybu

Intro - Wireless AirPlay speakers for your iPad, iPhone, Mac, Windows and Android devices.

Libratone live

A friend has got one. He's very happy with it.

Wow, expensive. As good as the B&O? Looks nice though.

[rybu]

Never listened to the B&O so can't comment. Very nice looking speaker.

Appears to have some good reviews.