AVForums

Our philosophy in our forums, reviews, podcasts and feature videos is to promote audio and visual excellence by gathering and sharing the best information and resources available.

Help

To begin please visit our help section »

Not a Member Yet?

It only takes a minute to start enjoying the benefits of AVForums membership, and it's free!

Member Log in

Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Post Reply
Old 04-08-2008, 8:10 AM   #1
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: London, U.K.
Experience Points:
6,176, Level: 18
Points: 6,176, Level: 18 Points: 6,176, Level: 18 Points: 6,176, Level: 18
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 100, Got 47
Posts: 1,091
Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I guess it was inevitable given the media spec and his current batting form.

I can't believe Pieterson is in the frame. The guy desperately needs to concentrate on his own batting... convert some good starts to proper Test scores with more consistancy.

Rob Key for me . Worth his place on current batting form, and a canny and unflappable captain at county level...
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 10:07 AM   #2
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Reading
Experience Points:
7,140, Level: 20
Points: 7,140, Level: 20 Points: 7,140, Level: 20 Points: 7,140, Level: 20
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 297, Got 244
Posts: 2,828
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

They may well choose KP because he is a (and the only) dead cert for both Test and 1 dayers, and they clearly stated they want 1 man for both jobs.

I'm not too sure on him either- he has the capability to be one of the great batsmen of all time, and the captaincy could be good or bad.
The responsibility could either spur him on to be more 'thoughtful' in his play, but at the same time we might lose that style of play which can win us Tests as no one wants to see 13 runs of 90 balls from him.

Look what happened with Botham...

Edit: For the record I'd like Rob Key too, but its a bit strange to bring a guy in who hasn't played internationals for a while to be captain
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 11:39 AM   #3
Prominent Member
 
Scholes18's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Republic Of Mancunia
Experience Points:
8,344, Level: 21
Points: 8,344, Level: 21 Points: 8,344, Level: 21 Points: 8,344, Level: 21
Activity: 3.7%
Activity: 3.7% Activity: 3.7% Activity: 3.7%
Blog Entries: 25
Thanks: Gave 109, Got 229
Posts: 3,181
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I agree with the point lezman made about botham deteriorating when he became captain and i think the same would happen to KP. He's picked , supposedly , for his run scoring and i think he's the sort of player who should just get on with that and not have to worry about the captaincy.

In the same vein as Flintoff went downhill when he did both.

Having said all that out of the current squad its hard to see who you would have and i suppose that would mean someone like Andy Strauss who didnt to badly when he did it short term.

Rob Keys also a good shout but i cant see the ECB picking him anytime soon.
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 1:26 PM   #4
Conspicuous Member
 
domtheone's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Nottingham
Experience Points:
15,026, Level: 29
Points: 15,026, Level: 29 Points: 15,026, Level: 29 Points: 15,026, Level: 29
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 327, Got 333
Posts: 7,862
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

KP Named Captain.

Fairly neutral on this.

Great Batsman but it seems that every decent Batsman who takes over the batting has a significant drop of from with the bat
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 2:05 PM   #5
Moderator
 
Leej's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Birmingham
Experience Points:
9,345, Level: 23
Points: 9,345, Level: 23 Points: 9,345, Level: 23 Points: 9,345, Level: 23
Activity: 8.1%
Activity: 8.1% Activity: 8.1% Activity: 8.1%
Thanks: Gave 860, Got 971
Posts: 3,432
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I think the selectors have lost the plot over more or less every decision they make and have made a decision that could ruin our best player. Only time will tell.

Strauss should have been given the job. He proved before that he has what it takes.
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 3:06 PM   #6
Prominent Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Medieval Warm Period
Experience Points:
3,668, Level: 14
Points: 3,668, Level: 14 Points: 3,668, Level: 14 Points: 3,668, Level: 14
Activity: 3.0%
Activity: 3.0% Activity: 3.0% Activity: 3.0%
Thanks: Gave 218, Got 388
Posts: 3,578
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

We're far too reliant on Pietersen as it is. If he gets out easlily we're in deep do do.

Last edited by Wild Weasel; 05-08-2008 at 7:19 AM.
  Quote
Old 04-08-2008, 3:42 PM   #7
Veteran Member
 
DJT75's Avatar
Join Date: May 2005
Experience Points:
9,202, Level: 22
Points: 9,202, Level: 22 Points: 9,202, Level: 22 Points: 9,202, Level: 22
Activity: 0.3%
Activity: 0.3% Activity: 0.3% Activity: 0.3%
Thanks: Gave 211, Got 504
Posts: 6,092
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

As the only man guaranteed to be picked in any batting order & who doesn't have any significant duties in a fielding side, I don't think they had any other choice.
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 5:17 AM   #8
Prominent Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: North Yorkshire
Experience Points:
8,995, Level: 22
Points: 8,995, Level: 22 Points: 8,995, Level: 22 Points: 8,995, Level: 22
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 6, Got 162
Posts: 3,435
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJT75 View Post
As the only man guaranteed to be picked in any batting order & who doesn't have any significant duties in a fielding side, I don't think they had any other choice.
I agree

Time will tell
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 6:49 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Spligsey's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: UK
Experience Points:
5,896, Level: 18
Points: 5,896, Level: 18 Points: 5,896, Level: 18 Points: 5,896, Level: 18
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 0, Got 12
Posts: 1,384
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Very sad to see Vaughan resign from the England captaincy. Along with Stephen Fleming of New Zealand, he has been the best captain in world cricket bar none. It's clear that the ECB wanted 1 captain for all forms of the game, and Pietersen really was the only choice. There are doubts, but there's no denying he is an exceptional cricketer.
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 9:10 AM   #10
Moderator
 
Steven's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2005
Experience Points:
61,783, Level: 60
Points: 61,783, Level: 60 Points: 61,783, Level: 60 Points: 61,783, Level: 60
Activity: 33.1%
Activity: 33.1% Activity: 33.1% Activity: 33.1%
Blog Entries: 42
Thanks: Gave 2,014, Got 4,412
Posts: 32,415
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Quote:
Originally Posted by leej View Post
Strauss should have been given the job. He proved before that he has what it takes.
Would he even get into the team often enough?
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 1:55 PM   #11
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Reading
Experience Points:
7,140, Level: 20
Points: 7,140, Level: 20 Points: 7,140, Level: 20 Points: 7,140, Level: 20
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 297, Got 244
Posts: 2,828
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Whats the ECB obsession with having 1 captain for both teams anyway?
They are completley different forms of the game- its alot of pressure for 1 man. Especially one who happens to be our best player as well.
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 6:03 PM   #12
Moderator
 
Leej's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Birmingham
Experience Points:
9,345, Level: 23
Points: 9,345, Level: 23 Points: 9,345, Level: 23 Points: 9,345, Level: 23
Activity: 8.1%
Activity: 8.1% Activity: 8.1% Activity: 8.1%
Thanks: Gave 860, Got 971
Posts: 3,432
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Quote:
Originally Posted by LFC_SL View Post
Would he even get into the team often enough?
Fair comment. He seems to be playing better now than he was but saying that his average for this series is pretty poor.

I still think it would have been worth giving him a go. This shows how desperate a team we have at the moment.
  Quote
Old 05-08-2008, 6:24 PM   #13
Moderator
 
Steven's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2005
Experience Points:
61,783, Level: 60
Points: 61,783, Level: 60 Points: 61,783, Level: 60 Points: 61,783, Level: 60
Activity: 33.1%
Activity: 33.1% Activity: 33.1% Activity: 33.1%
Blog Entries: 42
Thanks: Gave 2,014, Got 4,412
Posts: 32,415
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Well how tenable would it be to be captain when by all rights you do not deserve to be on the pitch? It would be unfair to Strauss imo
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 5:12 AM   #14
Eminent Member
 
Ian J's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Midlands
Experience Points:
71,654, Level: 65
Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65
Activity: 0.8%
Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8%
Blog Entries: 3
Thanks: Gave 3,114, Got 4,720
Posts: 23,949
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I'm one of the sceptics here as I don't think that Pietersen is a team man. I would have preferred to see a continuation of the split captaincy with Strauss taking over as Test captain as he did a good job in the short series against Pakistan whern he took over on a short term basis.

I don't think that Peter Moores and his co selectors are doing a particularly good job at the moment as their thinking seems to be muddled. A good example seems to be wicketkeeping where Moores seems unable to select any wicketkeeper that hasn't played for his ex county Sussex and now that Ambrose is about to be dumped it's back to Prior again. What does James Foster have to do to get a look in.

Collingwood is dropped then re-instated, Broad is droppped as he "needed a rest" and promptly played for Notts the following day bagging loads of Durham wickets and the less said about the Darren Pattinson affair the better.
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 9:27 AM   #15
Prominent Member
 
kendoll's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sydney
Experience Points:
21,304, Level: 35
Points: 21,304, Level: 35 Points: 21,304, Level: 35 Points: 21,304, Level: 35
Activity: 7.8%
Activity: 7.8% Activity: 7.8% Activity: 7.8%
Thanks: Gave 159, Got 557
Posts: 3,670
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I would have doubts about Pietersen as captain. I will hold my hand up and admit that I haven't seen many England games in the last year so he may have changed, but he does not posses the temperament to be a captain. He plays his own inning and does not seem to modify his style/aggression dependant on the situation.

During the last Ashes series there were a number of occasions where he was needed to buckle down and stay at the crease for as long as possible, but he just played his usual all out style and got out.

I just don't see him as being able to play that 'Captain's Knock' that can drag the team out of a bad situation, or play an anchor role when needed to grind out a draw or snatch a win.

You never know though, it may be the spark that he needs to grow as a team player and take on the responsibility that his talent entails.

Last edited by kendoll; 07-08-2008 at 9:30 AM.
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 3:19 PM   #16
Illustrious Member
 
JohnG's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Nottinghamshire
Experience Points:
41,480, Level: 49
Points: 41,480, Level: 49 Points: 41,480, Level: 49 Points: 41,480, Level: 49
Activity: 14.2%
Activity: 14.2% Activity: 14.2% Activity: 14.2%
Thanks: Gave 2,203, Got 1,080
Posts: 19,655
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Vaughan hasn't played a "Captain's knock" for ages though as he ? He's also looked lost as a captain to me as if it's all going on without any great captaining from him. I could forgive Vaughan if he was a great captain like Brearley was, but he never excelled in my view.
One thing about Pietersen is that he'll always give his all. He wouldn't have been my first choice as captain, but I'm prepared to let him have a go
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 4:25 PM   #17
Eminent Member
 
Ian J's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Midlands
Experience Points:
71,654, Level: 65
Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65
Activity: 0.8%
Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8%
Blog Entries: 3
Thanks: Gave 3,114, Got 4,720
Posts: 23,949
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I must disagree John as I thought that Vaughan was a great captain. He had that instinctive knack of knowing when to change the bowling that often produced a wicket as did some of his innovative field settings but I think that his greatest achievement was to forge a bunch of individuals into Team England as under him the lads played as a team for the first time in donkeys years and you could see a team spirit that had been missing for a good many years. I very much doubt whether we would have regained the Ashes in 2005 without his astute leadership.

Things started to change when he was injured and the resultant mismanagement in Australia did a lot to destroy everything that he had built up with the best finger spinner in the world at the time carrying the drinks so that Ashley Giles could play and Chris Read told that he wasn't wanted as Flintoff's mate Geraint Jones would be back in the side. If that wasn't enough Sajiid Mahmood was picked in the starting 11 and left down at fine leg for most of the games as Flintoff didn't want to bowl him. Not only did we lose the Ashes spectacularly but all of the team spirit that Vaughan had so patiently built up was destroyed too.

It can't be easy to be a successful captain when your own form has deserted you and I suspect that falling on his sword was the sporting thing to do just as it was for Nasser in similar circumstances in the middle of a previous South African tour.
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 4:27 PM   #18
Illustrious Member
 
JohnG's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Nottinghamshire
Experience Points:
41,480, Level: 49
Points: 41,480, Level: 49 Points: 41,480, Level: 49 Points: 41,480, Level: 49
Activity: 14.2%
Activity: 14.2% Activity: 14.2% Activity: 14.2%
Thanks: Gave 2,203, Got 1,080
Posts: 19,655
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I think we'll have to agree to disagree then
  Quote
Old 07-08-2008, 7:21 PM   #19
Member
 
Toon-man's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Newcastle
Experience Points:
3,502, Level: 13
Points: 3,502, Level: 13 Points: 3,502, Level: 13 Points: 3,502, Level: 13
Activity: 0%
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Thanks: Gave 3, Got 3
Posts: 103
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

I still can not understand why they didn`t play Harmison in the last test??, love him or hate him , he is still our quickest bowler over 90 mph today.
Can you imagine the Aussies telling Brett Lee the pitch won`t suit you???
  Quote
Old 08-08-2008, 6:41 AM   #20
Eminent Member
 
Ian J's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Midlands
Experience Points:
71,654, Level: 65
Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65 Points: 71,654, Level: 65
Activity: 0.8%
Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8% Activity: 0.8%
Blog Entries: 3
Thanks: Gave 3,114, Got 4,720
Posts: 23,949
Re: Vaughan quits... Who's the next England Captain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toon-man View Post
I still can not understand why they didn`t play Harmison in the last test??,
I think that most of us don't understand quite a lot of the recent selectorial decisions in this series but I have a sneaking suspicion that Pietersen won't put up with having players foisted on him that he doesn't approve of
  Quote
Post Reply

Powered by  
 Latest popular product prices
Vivotion Sport & Fitness / Fitne... 
1 price
 £69.00 Click to show/hide the offers

Carl Lewis Fitness Sport & Fitne... 
1 price
 £88.00 Click to show/hide the offers

Vivotion Sport & Fitness / Fitne... 
1 price
 £99.00 Click to show/hide the offers

Carl Lewis Fitness Sport & Fitne... 
1 price
 £109.00 Click to show/hide the offers

Vivotion Sport & Fitness / Fitne... 
1 price
 £119.00 Click to show/hide the offers

Body Sculpture Sport & Fitness /... 
1 price
 £139.00 Click to show/hide the offers

York C102 Heritage Upright Cycle 
1 price
 £152.00 Click to show/hide the offers

York Fitness Sport & Fitness / F... 
1 price
 £161.98 Click to show/hide the offers

 Updated February 13th at 1:30am. Prices include delivery.


Thread information and display options
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off