[RMCF]

For a few years now it has become apparent that the gap between the 'haves' and 'have-nots' in football has been widening.

A good example are Chelsea. Each year they are moving ever so slightly away from the group that used to dominate the EPL. They are now 4/9 to win the EPL even before a ball has been kicked!! And Arsenal can now be got at 9/1 - who would have thought that with the team of 'invincibles' a few seasons ago?

It now seems to be spreading to the pan-Euro stuff as well.

Barca and Chelsea are now in a little group of their own to win the CL at 7/2 and 4/1 respectively. The rest of the 'also rans' start at 10/1 for the minnows of Real Madrid, Man Utd and Inter - with the real bums of Arsenal, Liverpool, Bayern Munich further back at 14/1.

Considering the bookies are never far wrong, is this the beginning of the end?

[JohnG]

This is one of the reasons why I don't watch much football these days. These days it seems that there are a maximum of 4 clubs with a chance of getting into Europe, with one team that's bound to win the league and the rest are just trying to avoid being relegated from the Premiership. This makes for a boring season of football again

[Bristol Pete]

Originally Posted by JohnG

This is one of the reasons why I don't watch much football these days. These days it seems that there are a maximum of 4 clubs with a chance of getting into Europe, with one team that's bound to win the league and the rest are just trying to avoid being relegated from the Premiership. This makes for a boring season of football again

Well, evidently, the EPL has become a parody of a league in that it is now a three tier thing, perhaps ever four. Lets face it the sole aim for most teams is now Europe or survival.

Shame really, but at least it makes supporting Bristol City interesting. Now, thats a division and a half. You watch us storm it next year.

Pete.

[ash]

But the last 2 years was good stuff near the top end, last year Arsenal, Spurs, Bolton and Charlton fighting for 4th spot throughout the season, and the year before Everton and Liverpool.

[overkill]

Originally Posted by ashmufc

But the last 2 years was good stuff near the top end, last year Arsenal, Spurs, Bolton and Charlton fighting for 4th spot throughout the season, and the year before Everton and Liverpool.

Hardly. The 'outsiders' never looked like challenging for the major honours (or top places) and haven't for well over a decade. 'Fighting for fourth spot' in itself is a misnomer. For about a week Bolton and Charlton were 'involved', Everton as one of the traditional 'big five' are hardly among the lesser lights. I think we're clutching at straws here.

SOK (and the bookies) is correct. The gap between the have and have nots has reached dangerous levels, and, if the big Italian clubs areforced to sell, it may become terminally worse as the two NW vultures are looking to pick the bones off them and make themselves (along with Chelsea) practicaly invincible.

Another season with Utd, Liverpool and Chelsea roaring away and the NL pair riding on their shirt tails could finally see the big switch off thats been gathering momentum and looking more and more likely in recent years.

Looks like you were right SOK, the impact of the match fixing scandal is set to have damaging repercussions outside Italy as well as in.

I must admit I'm looking forward to this season from the lower leauge interest more than the top end. That's set to be a dreary repeat of the last X amount of years. Pick a winner of the leauge and FA cup from Chelsea, Utd and Liverpool and on the last two years, the Leauge cup likely to head their way as well.

Utterly boring and depressing, and it may finally switch me off bothering to watch even the highlights.

[shay0]

That's the joy of watching Conference football, even when teams do have money to spend, it doesn't mean winning the league or even promotion. This has been proved year on year down there and they don't tend to bother with the theatricals as much either for some reason

[lostinspace]

Until squads are limited to 20 players or so, the big teams will just buy up anyone worth having.
So until an artificial control on things is brought in, you can expect the few to get further ahead of the rest.There isn't even a chasing pack really now, just maybe one or two clubs a season play above their weight, but really flatter to deceive. They don't seem able to stay there for more than a season or two.

[midiman]

Originally Posted by lostinspace

Until squads are limited to 20 players or so, the big teams will just buy up anyone worth having.

That would be a good starting point but another issue I think is the number of foreign players in the premiership. Limiting the number of foreign players a team is allowed to have in its squad would make a difference. Also setting a limit to how many foreign outfielders on the pitch would also be a good thing. Undoubtably players from overseas is a good thing and our young players can (and are) learning from them. But teams like Arsenal make a mockery of it when they field teams which dont even contain one English player. (Imagine if they had won the champions leage and hadnt even had an English player on the pitch). Admitedly it wouldnt stop teams like Chelsea from buying all the best players but it might help bring them a bit closer to the rest.

[shay0]

What about a salary cap? It works in both the Conference and Rugby League. Granted it would have to be initiated world wide to give English teams a chance though.

[JohnG]

Another thing I reckon is having an affect on the atmosphere in games these days is the lack of away support tickets available. The grounds are getting bigger but they don't seem to be allowing more tickets for the visitors. We all know that the atmosphere improves 100% when there's a good following there, look at the FA Cup matches at Old Trafford when there are 7-8000 away fans, much better.

[lostinspace]

Originally Posted by midiman

Limiting the number of foreign players a team is allowed to have in its squad would make a difference.

The problem with this is Europe and the "Right To Work" legislation. I like the idea of limiting the number of on- field foreign players, though. FIFA could do this as it's just a rule change to the game. But they won't.

I'd like to see only home- based players eligible for internationals, too.

[overkill]

Originally Posted by lostinspace

The problem with this is Europe and the "Right To Work" legislation. I like the idea of limiting the number of on- field foreign players, though. FIFA could do this as it's just a rule change to the game. But they won't.

I'd like to see only home- based players eligible for internationals, too.

FIFA won't do it because it infringes not only EU rules but the labour rules of non EU nations as well. As for 'home based players' well that would hardly ruffle too many feathers these days would it? Only Beckham and Hargreaves would be affected.

The idea of a salary cap is the way to go, for all sorts of reasons. However, it would need to be FIFA wide, otherwise we would see a flood of players to whichever nations do not subscribe to it. It made me laugh when someone claimed that players 'aren't mercenary'. Just why do they flock here at the moment then? Because of the fat pay cheques sponsored by Sky that's why.

It would also need to be set a lot lower than the current ludicrous levels. They aren't sustainable.

John, I agree totally. It's yet another cynical move to try and maximise success for the 'bigger clubs' by both cutting down on lost revenue, and on vocal support for the away team.

[Pezerinno]

Watch out for Portsmouth this season

[lostinspace]

Originally Posted by overkill

As for 'home based players' well that would hardly ruffle too many feathers these days would it? Only Beckham and Hargreaves would be affected.

It would also need to be set a lot lower than the current ludicrous levels. They aren't sustainable.

Anything to get the useless Beckham out of the team, but really it would affect other countries more.

Agree totally on the salaries. They are unsustainable, and the sooner sense prevails the sooner we might get decent footie again played by people who want to play the game, and not imitate weebles.

Roll on £100 a week.

[gosties]

I have noticed that over the last ten years that you can virtually be able to name the top clubs in each of the major league's in Europe. You may not be able to predict the order they finish in each season.

In Italy it is always Milan, Juve, Inter & Roma/Lazio
In England Manure, Arsenal, Chelsea & Liverpool
In Spain its Barcelona, Real Madrid & Valencia
In Portugal its Benfica, Porto & Sporting Lisbon
In Holland PSV, Ajax
In Germany Bayern Munich, Bayer Leverkusen & Borussia Dortmund.

The money (commercially + prize) these teams generate through their usual yearly participation in the Champions League means they can pull away from their competitors in their domestic leagues. In my opinion they are actually more or less taking part in a league amongst a league. When a team Arsenal are able to generate over double the income of a team like Tottenham it shows how big the gap is becoming.

Unless some other teams force these teams out of their league positions the "status quo" will continue. Unless these lesser teams get a benefactor like Abramovich they will never compete. I believe unfortunately the incumbents of the top positions will not be shifted.

I am fan of Dundee Utd and don't believe that Utd will ever be able to win the League ever again as financially the chasm between Utd and the In-firm(Celtic & Rangers) is far too huge.

You just get same-old same-old season out now.

As for a salary cap it will never work as teams will find ways of getting around it. A few years ago in one of the american sports, a salary cap was introduced but was removed not that much longer after its introduction, as the teams were ignoring it. As a gesture it's a good idea but that's all.

[overkill]

Originally Posted by gosties

As for a salary cap it will never work as teams will find ways of getting around it. A few years ago in one of the american sports, a salary cap was introduced but was removed not that much longer after its introduction, as the teams were ignoring it. As a gesture it's a good idea but that's all.

It worked for 60 years in England. It has to be binding, and enforced. The salary cap in the US failed as there was in actual fact little support for it from the off, and clubs blatantly offered 'inducements'. Yes, there are always clubs who will try and get round it, but in the past it worked because the benefits where there for all clubs. I.e. no-one had a crippling wage bill, whether big club or small. It's noticable that since the scrapping of the maximum wage in England, wages Europe wide went ape, and the current 'us and them' was felt within a decade. By 1971, pundits were warning that todays situation would occur - to the detriment of the game. That was without the fore-knowledge of Bosman etc.

You are correct (and a few pundits have mentioned this recently as well) that Europe wide, the gap between the top three or four and the rest has been opened up dramaticaly by the CL placings. It's also noticable that as a result:-

a) corruption has now got a real grip on the game
b) less and less games have any meaning
c) success is now limited to a pitifully small number of teams
d) the standard of the games both domesticaly and in the CL has decreased exponentialy in recent years

While a limited number of teams grab all the players, all the money funnels their way, success funnels their way, and support funnels their way. It's a vicious circle for those outside the loop.

In the end we may all up like Scotland. A big 'two' with a couple of lesser, but still streets ahead of the rest, clubs hanging on behind them, the rest allso rans. Jeez, what a depressing thought.