[Paulie-W]

Being that there are some obvious problems. What would your best formation and selection be?

I was thinking weather or not Beckham could play on the left and put Lennon on the right, with Lampard and Gerard in the middle and Cole in the space behind a striker.

As for the back end. Cole, Terry, Ferdinand and ?????

[GBDG1]

Originally Posted by Paulie-W

Being that there are some obvious problems. What would your best formation and selection be?

I was thinking weather or not Beckham could play on the left and put Lennon on the right, with Lampard and Gerard in the middle and Cole in the space behind a striker.

As for the back end. Cole, Terry, Ferdinand and ?????

Gary Neville obviously, he is one of the worlds best right backs. Abseloutly reliable and good at getting forward.

[sjackson]

I was watching the game last night with a mate, and we were discussing yer (Englands) chances. Overall, I think England have one of the stongest teams, and have a great chance. Obvious weak spots are right back, and perhaps left mid, but Cole has looked great this last season. Player for player, ye are up there with Brazil and the Argies, but I think you need to play more as a "team", ie. a league team.

As for formations, depends on who is fit. I quite like the way France used to play. Not sure if they still do, not seen them in a while. The 4-2-3-1 formation.

With Rooney:

-----------Owen-----------
Cole------Rooney-----Beckham
-----Gerrard---Carragher-----
Cole---Rio-----JT-------ABN*

Without Rooney, put Gerrard in his place, and either Carrack or Lampard in Gerrards spot. I'd go with Carrick. Lampard is not that good as a holding player.

ABN* - Anyone But Neville. I think he's useless and was rubbish lastnight.

[Paulie-W]

Originally Posted by Lawrenzini

Gary Neville obviously, he is one of the worlds best right backs. Abseloutly reliable and good at getting forward.

He slipped my mind for some reason.

[Paulie-W]

Originally Posted by sjackson

Without Rooney, put Gerrard in his place, and either Carrack or Lampard in Gerrards spot. I'd go with Carrick. Lampard is not that good as a holding player.

ABN* - Anyone But Neville. I think he's useless and was rubbish lastnight.

I know Gerrard is new to this new position, but i thought he was a bit too busy last night.

Also i think without Rooney, JCole would be better suited to play in that central role, mainly because he seemed to be the only one willing to dribble the ball. Gerrards long balls are far better than his touches i think.

[dc007]

[QUOTE=Paulie-W]

I was thinking weather or not Beckham could play on the left and put Lennon on the right[QUOTE]

Beckham on the left ?! He has NO left foot !

The team is beginning to pick itself. The 'holding role' that Erikson carps on about won't wotk because we have no one ideally suite to the role. As good as Carrick may be (and I'm a Spurs fan), he's more a creative player than a blocker at heart.

Sven should revert to 4-4-2, and I think he probably will...


Robinson
G.Neville Terry Ferdy A.Cole

Beckham Lamps Gerrard J.Cole

Crouch Owen


With Lennon to come on (on either wing) late on to terrify the oppo !

[Ultima]

[QUOTE=dc007][QUOTE=Paulie-W]

I was thinking weather or not Beckham could play on the left and put Lennon on the right

Beckham on the left ?! He has NO left foot !

The team is beginning to pick itself. The 'holding role' that Erikson carps on about won't wotk because we have no one ideally suite to the role. As good as Carrick may be (and I'm a Spurs fan), he's more a creative player than a blocker at heart.

Sven should revert to 4-4-2, and I think he probably will...


Robinson
G.Neville Terry Ferdy A.Cole

Beckham Lamps Gerrard J.Cole

Crouch Owen


With Lennon to come on (on either wing) late on to terrify the oppo !

Yes agree with 4-4-2 and your team selection apart from I'd have Sol Campbell instead of Ferdinand anyday.

Martin

[la gran siete]

Carrick is an excellent passer buty cant tackle. I fsven decides oin a holding platyer then my guess would be Hargreaves whop has never had a long enough chance to establish his claim. Should be played 90 mins against Jamaica. Other that that i think Sven will go for 4-4-2 with Owen up front with Crouch / Rooney or Defoe

[DJT75]

[QUOTE=ashworthacca][QUOTE=dc007]

Originally Posted by Paulie-W

I was thinking weather or not Beckham could play on the left and put Lennon on the right

Yes agree with 4-4-2 and your team selection apart from I'd have Sol Campbell instead of Ferdinand anyday.

Martin

Did you see Campbell last night? He was embarassingly bad.

[Ultima]

[QUOTE=DJT75][QUOTE=ashworthacca]

Originally Posted by dc007

Did you see Campbell last night? He was embarassingly bad.

Yes I have to agree with that but IMO he is a better all round defender than Ferdinand.

[la gran siete]

[QUOTE=DJT75][QUOTE=ashworthacca]

Originally Posted by dc007

Did you see Campbell last night? He was embarassingly bad.

not long been back from all his troubles

[Paulie-W]

I was quite surprised at how bad Campbell was last night. What was it, 15 seconds before a yellow card. Nice one Sol............................Not

[Steven]

In Sol's defence (if I can be on first name terms) A.Cole's pass sold him short. Sol could have made a vain attempt to close down, in which case the Hungarian would have been through on goal, or crunch him, take the free kick and regroup.

Move on

Hargreaves is a much bigger talking point. For a natural DMC, he got showed up by Carra! True Carra didn't play one pass forwards, but didn't screw up defensively. Hargreaves gave away 6, 7 fouls alone, and didn't close down at all, particularly for the Hungarian goal. True no keeper can save 35 yard wonder strikes, but close a player down = they can't shoot

He must have something on Sven

[la gran siete]

I wouldnt give up on Hargreaves just yet . Any player good enough to play for Bayern must be doing something right Probabaly just needs a full ninety minutes to blend in effectively.
Carragher is a defender pure and simple and a very good one at that.Carrick excellent passer but cant tackle
Anyway Sven is going for 4:4:2

as for Cole and Campbell woefully short of match fitness

[Kopite4Ever]

Robbo
Neville (hate this guy but there is no one else), Carra, JT, Cole
Beckham, Stevie, Fat Frank, JO Cole
Crouchy, MO

How anyone can pick the laboured "footballing center half" ferdinand is beyond me. At least with carra and JT your talking about 110% committed defending all game, both of them would die for the shirt, lazy rio would not at all.

Rest of the team pretty much picks itself, obviously Shrek up front with Mo if he is fit.

[lee_d_m]

Well, I think we do need a holding player in the team, especially as Rooney is out, becuase we need both Gerrard and Lampard to be as effective offensively as we possibly can. I don't think we need Gerrard to play the Rooney role, I think he just needs to play his normal role, but just be more attacking than he normally is, and forget about defending.

I think the comments about Rio are a bit harsh, he was our best defender in 2002, and I still think he is a class player today. He may look lazy, but thats just becuase most of the time he has such good positioning that he doesn't have to do much to be effective. He's not perfect by all means, but I'd rather have him over an over-the-hill Campbell.

My formation would be as follows when playing good teams.

Robinson
Cole-Terry-Ferdinand-Neville
Carrick
Cole-Gerrard-Lampard-Beckham
Owen

when playing easier teams (Trinidad/Paraguay) possibly...

Robinson
Cole-Terry-Ferdinand-Neville
Beckham
Cole-Gerrard-Lampard-Lennon
Owen

[la gran siete]

One other option would be tpo p;lay ferdinand as sweeper behind Carragher and Terry, push Neviile and Cole up the flanks n ad let Gerard Lampard( or J Cole) and Becks dovetail in midfield. Owen and Crouch up front.

[RMCF]

I'm baffled by no Owen Hargreaves in any of your selections.

Great player.

Also, is it just me, or has anyone else noticed all the rubbish that Michael Owen has been spouting in the press for the last 2 weeks about how he feels so sharp and how he wishs the WC was tomorrow as he's really ready to go. Last couple of matches he's been very average.

I think the England team will be (without Rooney):
Neville, A.Cole, Ferdinand, Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, J. Cole, Owen, Crouch.

If Rooney has to come back then same team except swap Rooney for Joe Cole.

[la gran siete]

Originally Posted by SOK

I'm baffled by no Owen Hargreaves in any of your selections.

Great player.

Also, is it just me, or has anyone else noticed all the rubbish that Michael Owen has been spouting in the press for the last 2 weeks about how he feels so sharp and how he wishs the WC was tomorrow as he's really ready to go. Last couple of matches he's been very average.

I think the England team will be (without Rooney):
Neville, A.Cole, Ferdinand, Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, J. Cole, Owen, Crouch.

If Rooney has to come back then same team except swap Rooney for Joe Cole.

i think I did state in one of my posts that we shouldnt just dismiss him. He simply hasnt been given a long enough chance to make a positive impression.
Any red crosses flying about where you are by any chance? this place is awash with them Bit Chav i say!

[RMCF]

In NI you tend not to see a whole pile of cars with St. George crosses flying from them. Something to do with getting burnt out!! Although I was in East London last week and seen quite a few. Nothing wrong with it I say. You should see this place when Ireland make it to a major championship (which I don't think will be done for a while now).

As for Hargreaves, I posted more as a joke as no-one seems to like him. He never seems to play well for England and the press really murder him.

But to be honest, you can't have made it as a regular in the Bayern Munich team unless you're a decent footballer. Perhaps they have a system that suits him better.

[lee_d_m]

Originally Posted by SOK

I'm baffled by no Owen Hargreaves in any of your selections.

Great player.

Also, is it just me, or has anyone else noticed all the rubbish that Michael Owen has been spouting in the press for the last 2 weeks about how he feels so sharp and how he wishs the WC was tomorrow as he's really ready to go. Last couple of matches he's been very average.

I think the England team will be (without Rooney):
Neville, A.Cole, Ferdinand, Terry, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, J. Cole, Owen, Crouch.

If Rooney has to come back then same team except swap Rooney for Joe Cole.

Are you sure you don't mean swap Rooney for Crouch ?

[Paulie-W]

I think Sven uses Hargreaves as a utility player, but always for only half a game or so. Give the guy the chance of a full game and maybe we`ll be pleasantly surprised.


As for the flags. My wife went out and bought two for the car, and a friggin` great thing for the garden

Most likely get some local councilor comming round to tell me im upsetting some minority or another. But thats a whole different thread

[DJT75]

Originally Posted by lee_d_m

My formation would be as follows when playing good teams.

Robinson
Cole-Terry-Ferdinand-Neville
Carrick
Cole-Gerrard-Lampard-Beckham
Owen

when playing easier teams (Trinidad/Paraguay) possibly...

Robinson
Cole-Terry-Ferdinand-Neville
Beckham
Cole-Gerrard-Lampard-Lennon
Owen

But leaves Owen on his own again like the 1st half on Tuesday & he's completely wasted. You'd have Carrick or Beckham pinging the ball to no-one.

If we are to play a holding player it has to be for defensive duties & no play making. We need someone to tackle & give to the likes of Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard & Cole - not bypass them & not hit Owen.

[RMCF]

Originally Posted by lee_d_m

Are you sure you don't mean swap Rooney for Crouch ?

Yes thats what I meant. Wasn't thinking as I was typing.

[lee_d_m]

Originally Posted by DJT75

But leaves Owen on his own again like the 1st half on Tuesday & he's completely wasted. You'd have Carrick or Beckham pinging the ball to no-one.

If we are to play a holding player it has to be for defensive duties & no play making. We need someone to tackle & give to the likes of Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard & Cole - not bypass them & not hit Owen.

Naturally, I disgree. I think the holding role is very much misunderstood, IMO, the most important attribute the holding role player needs is to be able to keep hold of the ball. That means, they must have outstanding ball control. Secondly, they need to be able to read the game well, and thirdly, must be a good passer. This is why Makelele is the best holding midfielder in the world, he has outstanding technique, and reads the play magnificently. He is not the best tackler in the world by any means, in fact, he commits a lot of fouls, you don't have to be a great tackler to defend well, positioning and anticipation are more important.

Playing a defender in the holding role is a mistake, becuase they are not comfortable enough on the ball and don't "see" passes quick enough, as was evident with Carra. Also, there is no reason why the holding player has to ping balls to Owen bypassing the midfield, Chelsea play 1 upfront and I don't see Makele doing that for Chelsea. For me, if we are to play the holdng role, Carrick is the only man, he may fall down slightly defensively, but in evey other aspect, he fits the bill, he's been doing a good job at it for Tottenham all season, and if you weren't gonna play him there, why put him in the squad in the first place ?

With regards to leaving Owen on his own, this is only a problem if we can't keep possession long enough to get the ball wide to beckham or cole, once we do that, the other 3 midfielders will be in and around the box anticipating crosses, which other than set pieces, is our best way of scoring goals.

[Steven]

Originally Posted by lee_d_m

Robinson
Cole-Terry-Ferdinand-Neville
Beckham
Cole-Gerrard-Lampard-Lennon
Owen

Sorry, but Beckham can't tackle. Not without fouling anyway. Plus it'd ruin his hair

Originally Posted by lee_d_m

Playing a defender in the holding role is a mistake, becuase they are not comfortable enough on the ball and don't "see" passes quick enough, as was evident with Carra. Also, there is no reason why the holding player has to ping balls to Owen bypassing the midfield, Chelsea play 1 upfront and I don't see Makele doing that for Chelsea. For me, if we are to play the holdng role, Carrick is the only man, he may fall down slightly defensively, but in evey other aspect, he fits the bill, he's been doing a good job at it for Tottenham all season, and if you weren't gonna play him there, why put him in the squad in the first place?

True, which is why I thought to myself, if he's gonna play Carra as DMC, surely it would have been better to switch him around with Rio against Hungary?

Some will hate me for this, but whilst Owen isn't fit, given Crouch's effect in a mere 20 min, surely the 4-1-2-1-1 against Hungary would have been much better had Crouch played from the start? I know Owen needs games to get fit, but if you're gonna play Owen, play 4-4-2, or any formation, as long as there's 2 up front. Of course, Sven picks players by reputation, not for the system. Look at Spain. Morientes left at home as he didn't fit the system.

Lastly, Owen looks way off the ball, but has a bit of time. Which leads me to say Rooney doesn't have a chance in hell. Best leave him and take a fit Defoe or Johnson. Still better than a half-fit Rooney, no matter how good he is.

Originally Posted by lee_d_m

With regards to leaving Owen on his own, this is only a problem if we can't keep possession long enough to get the ball wide to beckham or cole, once we do that, the other 3 midfielders will be in and around the box anticipating crosses, which other than set pieces, is our best way of scoring goals.

Owen can't play on his own! Simple! Can't hold it up, not strong or big enough. Dare I say, he's lost the cunning and agility to dribble the ball out of trouble since doing his hamstrings in for Liverpool, losing some of his pace. Until Crouch came on, we was playing without a strike force. Wingless wonders in '66, but you ain't doing it in '06 with strikeless err strongmen? (please help me with a better rhyme)

[neilios]

Id just go for a traditional 442 and play.

Robinson
neville
terry
ferdinand
cole
beckham
gerrard
lampard
cole
crouch
owen


But if i was the coach with the current players i would of used a 352 ,but thats obviously too late now.

robinson

ferdinand terry carragher

j cole beckham gerrard lampard cole

owen crouch

[istanbul05]

I would say its a question of who would you want to get the most out of? Owen or Gerrard. Owen scores the goals, Gerrard influences a game. If Gerrard then i would pick Carrick in a 5 man midfield with owen as lone striker, and if crouch then i would play the normal 4-4-2. I may be biased but Carragher should definately be in the team ahead of Rio. He is too prone to a lapse in concentration. IMO the following team should start the world cup :

------------------Robinson-----------------

Neville---------Terry------Carra--------Cole

-------------------Carrick------------------

Beckham----------Lampard------------Cole

-------------Gerrard-----------------------

---------------------Owen----------------

But no doubt the Swede will start with Rio. Also i think Crouch has a massive () effect when coming off the bench.

[lee_d_m]

Quote:
Lastly, Owen looks way off the ball, but has a bit of time. Which leads me to say Rooney doesn't have a chance in hell. Best leave him and take a fit Defoe or Johnson. Still better than a half-fit Rooney, no matter how good he is.


Better still, take Rooney AND Defoe and leave Hargreaves behind, Rooney would be more effective with a plastercast on his foot than a fully fit hargreaves any day of the week !

[Steven]

Can't leave Hargreaves...unless he gets "injured"

Excuse me...where's my ninja outfit?