[paulr]

Sven,the best England manager for years and he's forced to leave his job because of the scumbag press and spineless FA.
Good luck in the summer and thanks for a great 5 years.You deserved better.

[Sick Boy]

Must have been asleep when we lifted those trophies. What amazing performances we achieved in those tournaments.

This should probably be in the sports forum

[thfccambs]

Originally Posted by paulr

Sven,the best England manager for years and he's forced to leave his job because of the scumbag press and spineless FA.
Good luck in the summer and thanks for a great 5 years.You deserved better.

What drugs you on m8?

[mjn]

Originally Posted by paulr

Sven,the best England manager for years and he's forced to leave his job because of the scumbag press and spineless FA.
Good luck in the summer and thanks for a great 5 years.You deserved better.

er........did i sleep through England winning a competition or regularly beating quality opposition?

[paulr]

Originally Posted by Sick Boy

Must have been asleep when we lifted those trophies.

Compared to Keegan,Hoddle,Venables and Taylor you mean?

[mjn]

Originally Posted by paulr

Compared to Keegan,Hoddle,Venables and Taylor you mean?

But Sven has got a vast array of talent to choose from, perhaps the best out of the 5 managers listed here!

[paulr]

Originally Posted by mjn

But Sven has got a vast array of talent to choose from, perhaps the best out of the 5 managers listed here!

I know what you mean,Keegan had ***** like Beckham,Owen,andSchloes to contend with whereas Sven has.......oh,wait a minute.

[Lex]

I agree that he has done a good job... When he took over the England job EVERYBODY was saying that we should forget Japan/Korea (because the team was in such a poor state) and concentrate on Portugal, the fact he got us to Japan was beyond expectation, and he also gave us the pleasure of beating Germany and Argentina along the way.
He then did exaclty as expected and got us qualified comfortably for Portugal. Admittedly we could have done better there, but losing in the knock out stages on Penalties is not a huge disgrace is it?
Next he qualified us for Germany 2006... what exactly has he done that is so awful?

[overkill]

Originally Posted by Lex

I agree that he has done a good job... When he took over the England job EVERYBODY was saying that we should forget Japan/Korea (because the team was in such a poor state) and concentrate on Portugal, the fact he got us to Japan was beyond expectation, and he also gave us the pleasure of beating Germany and Argentina along the way.
He then did exaclty as expected and got us qualified comfortably for Portugal. Admittedly we could have done better there, but losing in the knock out stages on Penalties is not a huge disgrace is it?
Next he qualified us for Germany 2006... what exactly has he done that is so awful?

Could it be that England played awful football, and really only defeated teams that we should beat, so, so what? Even then under Ericsson, not exactly in style, and even in the 2002 qualifiers he managed to mis-manage to the point that even after drubbing Germany, we still had to rely on a free kick that shouldn't have been given to qualify at all! Then off to the Far East, a fairly easy set of qualifiers, a reasonable 1st knock out game, then despite the warnings that he was carrying too many losers (Heskey ring any bells?) he displayed the tactical ineptitude he was to become famous for, in the one hard game he faced, and promptly saw his team get played off the park. Great.

He then failed to ever use friendlies to good effect, got to the S/F at a EURO 2004 so weak that Greece won it, and again displayed poor judgement when it counted, ie in losing to an average Portugal. Cue the press trying to get rid of him............

Then on to the less than convincing performances in this World cup qualifying series, in a group so poor that the likes of Ramsey, Revie, Robson and Hoddle would have been green with envy, and which included a dismal defeat at "how many years was it since you won?" NI and you can see why people are a little sceptical at his 'great record'.

As has been said before, England haven't progressed one millimetre under Ericsson - with a reasonable group of players.

If we win the World cup then I'm prepared to forgive just about anything, but frankly, I will getting out the worry beads early on this time..............

[Artie Fufkin]

I think the OP is really Scottish.

[phillfyspoon]

I think right now we have the best england team ever ON PAPER but on the pitch a different story. I just hope we can win it, it's not like we dont have the players too there top flight world class players (apprantly)

[neilios]

I wouldn't say england have regulary lost to opposition either ,i like eriksson ,if you read his book it gives you a better incite into how he likes to work with the players ,and is whole take on the game of football .
Like all good managers ,he shows faith in his players ,thats why he plays james,heskey, and most other members of his squad even though they have only played to there full potential a couple of times .

There in lies the secret to winning the world cup ,brazil know there the best the team in the world ,the germans are also very confident,the italians very tactical and defensive.

England on the other hand play with too much fear ,which eriksson has tried to eradicate ,hence beating teams like germany,and argentina in crucial games ,when under other managers england would have collapsed and froze .

But i believe england do have a team capable of winning the world cup ,lets face it ,owen is world class,lampard is a complete midfielder,as is gerrrard ,and rooney is potentialy the best english footballer wev'e ever had .
And eriksson is the man in charge and gets my vote to stay that way.

Er bit of a rant ,but i do get a bit passionate about football lol.

[la gran siete]

I'm glad someones sticking up for Sven who whose win / lose ratio is better than mostof the previous incumbents Getting us into the last WC was a notable achievement when it looked a lost cause and putting 5 past the Huns felt great.
People in this country expect miracles though and think we have some sort of divine right to win tournaments forgetting that the pressure put on the major competitors especially Brazil is every bit as great if not greater. Creating the right conditions and developing the right calibre of player is absolutely essential for success , but in itself only increases the chances of doing so.Constantly changing managers doesnt do very much at all. Given the amount of access Sven has had to his squad and the paucity of freindlies ( not to mention the pressure from the press)I think he has done oK. I f he gets us into the semis I shall be satisfied anything more would be a bonus.

[Nebby]

I just love the idea that none of this Sven's fault; it's all down to those dastardly swines in "the gutter press"

[paulr]

Originally Posted by neilios

I wouldn't say england have regulary lost to opposition either ,i like eriksson ,if you read his book it gives you a better incite into how he likes to work with the players ,and is whole take on the game of football .
Like all good managers ,he shows faith in his players ,thats why he plays james,heskey, and most other members of his squad even though they have only played to there full potential a couple of times .

There in lies the secret to winning the world cup ,brazil know there the best the team in the world ,the germans are also very confident,the italians very tactical and defensive.

England on the other hand play with too much fear ,which eriksson has tried to eradicate ,hence beating teams like germany,and argentina in crucial games ,when under other managers england would have collapsed and froze .

But i believe england do have a team capable of winning the world cup ,lets face it ,owen is world class,lampard is a complete midfielder,as is gerrrard ,and rooney is potentialy the best english footballer wev'e ever had .
And eriksson is the man in charge and gets my vote to stay that way.

Er bit of a rant ,but i do get a bit passionate about football lol.

Nice post.I've read his book too and its an excellent insight into how he operates.If he does well in Germany he'll have one of the best records as England manager and he can leave head held high.

Question:If Sam allardyce is so talented why didn't Liverpool or Chelsea try and get him in recent years?

[oxygenuk]

Originally Posted by paulr

Sven,the best England manager for years and he's forced to leave his job because of the scumbag press and spineless FA.
Good luck in the summer and thanks for a great 5 years.You deserved better.

[paulr]

Originally Posted by oxygenuk

You know how to post icons.Congratulations.

[overkill]

Originally Posted by Nebby

I just love the idea that none of this Sven's fault; it's all down to those dastardly swines in "the gutter press"

Exactly. It's all very well saying he has a good win against loss ratio, but that doesn't take into account a) the current poor state of World football b) his unwillingness to take on REAL opposition in friendlies - just in case he lost c) the weak groups he's had to qualify from. If we have such a good squad of players as we are constantly being spun, err told, then why can't he do as the great International sides of the past have done, and win in style, and in the matches where it counts? Answer. He's not up to it. Prove me wrong Sven, please?

I don't care how 'good his book is', autobiographies and biographies are notorious for being one sided, 'barbara cartland' stories of their subjects lives and works. Football ones (English auto/bios are the worst as well) in particular are known for this. Chairmen & managers become 'gritty but fair' 'tactical geniuses' and 'mistakes' only prove they are 'still human'. Gimme a break................ Vinnie Jones book is a classic example. You wouldn't even recognise the Vinnie we all knew and loved/loathed.

Sven had a good record in club management, but as people here are quick to point out that doesn't mean you will become a great international coach. Just take Revie for example.

[Nebby]

He may have an impressive record, but does anyone actually think England will win the world cup under Sven?

I don't...because when it comes down to it, he makes poor decisions - or no decisions at all.

He has been England manager since January 2001, and yet he has failed to address the fact that there appears to be no English player with a decent left foot to be found anywhere in the country. I don't blame Sven for the fact that no decent left sided player exists, but you've got to ask why he didn't try (a) Wayne Bridge playing in front of Ashley Cole (or vice versa) more than once, or perhaps a different system. Am I alone in thinking that this current squad seems perfect for 3-5-2?

Owen Hargreaves?

He turned Paul Scholes from a prolific International midfield goalscorer into a holding player. Before Sven, Scholes bagged 10 in 29 appearances. Under Sven he managed 4 in 36! Why did he do it...no wonder Scholes retired early.

He persisted with Beckham during the World Cup in Japan, when everyone could see that the guy was not fully fit.

Owen Hargreaves?

He persisted with David James and David Seaman for far too long. Both cost England matches. It's no good enough for Sven to say that he's got confidence in James, when it's obvious the back four doesn't. God help us if he makes it onto the plane for Germany.

Owen Hargreaves?

[Bernard Barnett]

Originally Posted by Nebby

It's no good enough for Sven to say that he's got confidence in James, when it's obvious the back four doesn't.

The most telling point made in this thread I'd say. Totally agree with everything said by Nebby and Overkill. We do have the potential for a cup-winning side but, I suspect, not under Sven. Wouldn't it be nice to be proved wrong though!

[Nebby]

Hey - if England win the World Cup Final (a penalty shootout, with a controversial shade of '66, against the Germans or the Argies would be nice), I'll proclaim Sven as the greatest...

...for as we all know: in football, you're only ever as good as your last game.

[paulr]

Originally Posted by Bernard Barnett

The most telling point made in this thread I'd say.

Then you dont understand where he's coming from.Ultimately he dropped James because he wasnt up to the job,but in giving him a chance he showed the other players that he was prepared to be loyal to them,not to worry about one bad performance,and creating an environment where players were more relaxed and more likely to perform at their best.

Anyway,bring on "Big Sam",what an impressive record of trophies he has...........erm.................

[Nebby]

Paulr - you're absolutely right.

Sven certainly created an environment where the players felt more relaxed and safe that their place in the squad was assured...

...I mean, do you remember what David James said after England slumped to that awful defeat against the Danes???

You remember, that was the match where he conceeded 3 goals in seven minutes after coming on as a second half substitute...the match where he and Glenn Johnson caused so much panic among their teammates that they could be seen looking at the bench and screaming "what the f**k is going on?" (something that they would repeat when being out thought by Lawrie Sanchez's Republic of Ireland side).

James said that his poor performance was due to the fact that he didn't bother to warm up properly. Now that's relaxed!!!

[overkill]

Originally Posted by paulr

Then you dont understand where he's coming from.Ultimately he dropped James because he wasnt up to the job,but in giving him a chance he showed the other players that he was prepared to be loyal to them,not to worry about one bad performance,and creating an environment where players were more relaxed and more likely to perform at their best.

Anyway,bring on "Big Sam",what an impressive record of trophies he has...........erm.................

No, where he was coming from, was exactly where he was with Beckham, Neville, Scholes, Heskey, Johnson and yes, Hargreaves. I.e "I know best, and the more obvious it is I'm making mistakes in terms of selection and position, the less likely I am to back down". Bit like a politican really, and hardly a quality that's going to win trophies.

Loyalty is where you pick good players and stick by them through the thin. But even then, as Ramsey did, you prune when they are obviously not going to get any better again. With Beckham he failed even that last test. With the likes of Heskey and Hargreaves he failed the former.

Again though, should he bring success, I'm more than willing to recant.

[Bernard Barnett]

Originally Posted by paulr

Then you dont understand where he's coming from.

Yes I'll put my hand up to that. And the sooner he goes back there the better.
Seriously, it's a terrible job though, isn't it? 20 million people all watching what you do and reckoning they could do it better.

[neilios]

I don't ever remember england having any great international sides of the past ,or winning any games in style ,more like giving everyone a nervous breakdown.

The point eriksson is trying to make is that to have any success in a competition like the world cup all the players on the field have to play well at the same time ,but 4 or 5 of those players must be world class and play at there peak .

If the players do not play this way the whole dynamic of the team breaks down ,the brazillians are so good because they usually have 6 or 7 world class players and out of that 3 ultimate match winners .

The germans rely on an excellent team ethic ,and confidence as well as never making any mistakes ,and punishing teams when the few chances arise .

We can try a sam allerdyce or whatever and go back to the bad old days of don howe style football ,with the tub thumping ,tony adams style (who actually became a better player under wenger)


Unfortunatly english football management hasn't changed much ,the only successful english manager we've ever had is bryan clough .the rest are mostly scottish or er scottish ,or french .

When the FA stops printing that don howe coaching manual we might produce a decent coach and players lol.

Anyway dont forget to do your star jumps .

[overkill]

Originally Posted by Bernard Barnett

Yes I'll put my hand up to that. And the sooner he goes back there the better.
Seriously, it's a terrible job though, isn't it? 20 million people all watching what you do and reckoning they could do it better.

One change there, 20 million people all watching what you do and wishing youcould do it better.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by overkill

No, where he was coming from, was exactly where he was with Beckham, Neville, Scholes, Heskey, Johnson and yes, Hargreaves. I.e "I know best, and the more obvious it is I'm making mistakes in terms of selection and position, the less likely I am to back down".

I find it incredible that people question Beckham's selection. The guy is fantastic on a football field, okay so he has the odd bad game and dip in form (doesn't everyone) but how many games has he (and Owen - another who is constantly criticised) won for England over the last few years. He has been consistently superb for Real Madrid this season, they laugh at us in Spain for the way we knock him, and who else are you gonna play - Sean Wright Phillips has huge potential, but he is not even close yet to being the player Beckham is...

Okay, there's another can of worms opened

[Nebby]

My views on Beckham are quite simple. If he is fit, he should be in the squad and available for selection. However, if he is unfit - as he was in Japan - then he shouldn't be in the squad, let alone out in the pitch.

The 'problem' a lot of us fans have with Beckham is one that's largely of Sven's making, and stems from his days in club management. Before he took over the England job, he was often criticised for aligning himself too closely with the stars of his Roma, Fiorentina, Sampdoria and Lazio sides.

To an extent this makes perfect sense - Fergie did it with Keane, as did Graham with Adams, and so have many others before - but the wheels can easily come off if the manager loses control.

Yes Beckham is performing extremely well in Spain - but there his desire to drift inside is not tolerated as it is when he puts on an England shirt. He knows that if he doesn't perform at the very highest level, week in week out, he'll be dropped from the team.

That's not the case with the England set-up, where he has put in some very average performances of late. In fact, when was the last time you thought Becks put in a disciplined performance for England? For me, it was October 2001 and the 2-2 draw with Greece that took England to the World Cup in Japan.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by Nebby

Yes Beckham is performing extremely well in Spain - but there his desire to drift inside is not tolerated as it is when he puts on an England shirt. He knows that if he doesn't perform at the very highest level, week in week out, he'll be dropped from the team.

I'm sorry but that just isn't the case. Beckham's desire to drift in and out has been actively encouraged, he even plays central midfield at times. And as for him being dropped if he doesn't perform, well you couldn't be more wrong - all the Galacticos have to play every game if they are fit, they are not allowed to be dropped by order of Florentino Perez the club president. This is the main reason that so many managers have struggled at Real Madrid, they are not allowed to pick the team! Beckham's place in the team is guaranteed.
But I do agree with you that if he is not fit he should not be picked for England, captain or not.