Will they re-introduce tax on betting?

FZR400RRSP · 18-03-2010, 4:36 PM

After getting whiffs of the money spent on bets at Cheltenham, and the current deficit the goverment is trying to fix, how long will it be before they re-introduce tax on betting?

DJT75 · 18-03-2010, 4:52 PM

I completely forgot we used to have to pay it. Either pay on your stake, or on your winnings - When did it disappear & why?

FZR400RRSP · 18-03-2010, 4:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJT75

I completely forgot we used to have to pay it. Either pay on your stake, or on your winnings - When did it disappear & why?

When?....ooh....I remember having to pay it......maybe 8-10 years ago?
It was a pain, having to remember to pay the extra nine pence on the pound on your stake.
Why?...dunno.

FZR400RRSP · 18-03-2010, 4:57 PM

I've been trying to see how much was staked at Cheltenham 2009.
See how much revenue the government could have earned.
But can't find anything.

SHATNERSTACTIC · 18-03-2010, 5:04 PM

Wasn't the reason for the tax exemption something to do with the rise of Internet betting - an attempt by the government to keep the high street shops competitive and protect the employment which they provide? I think most of the big UK firms are based out of the Channel Islands for their online operations so the UK government can't lay any claim to tax revenues placed via that route.

FZR400RRSP · 18-03-2010, 5:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee12

I think most of the big UK firms are based out of the Channel Islands for their online operations so the UK government can't lay any claim to tax revenues placed via that route.

IIRC, Bet365 are based in Stoke.
I remember being in a hotel across from their big building.
Google's toolbar server flag 'thing' shows a union jack for their site (would Channel islands show a Union Jack?)

Edit - I see what you're saying.
Re-introducing taxes in the UK would just drive betting onto sites outwith the UK.

SHATNERSTACTIC · 18-03-2010, 5:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FZR400RRSP

IIRC, Bet365 are based in Stoke.
I remember being in a hotel across from their big building.
Google's toolbar server flag 'thing' shows a union jack for their site (would Channel islands show a Union Jack?)

Yeah, that's right, BET365 certainly have a big set of offices in Stoke.

FZR400RRSP · 18-03-2010, 5:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee12

Yeah, that's right, BET365 certainly have a big set of offices in Stoke.

After the day I've had betting with them, could you go burn it down for me?

*disclaimer, if B365 actually have a fire tonight, I was only kidding*

dazza74 · 19-03-2010, 12:03 PM

I think it would open up a can of worms for the government if they did re introduce it as to what types of gambling would be taxed. Would they just do those betting on sports or would all these online casino games, bingo etc get clobbered as well. I think it's a potential gold mine of revenue though taxing this stuff again, going by the tv adverts in recent times you get the impression the whole countries gone gambling crazy.

StormLoaded · 19-03-2010, 3:13 PM

they cant tax for gambling (well they can but its then too complicated surely).
what happens if i win. i pay tax on the win? .. what if i lose? can i claim my tax back?!.. its hardly fair to charge me tax when ive just lost my money anyway.

the whole point to betting etc, is its calculated gambling.. ie i know the odds, and i know what i expect to walk away with should i win.. i dont want to have to calculate how much i need to put down (inc tax) and then have to workout how much i'll earn after tax deductions from winnings etc.. it shortens the income potential so why would i bother? its the bookies that never lose that should pay additional taxes if taxing betting is required. im sure they make more than enough!

i dont bet myself. but i do trade a bit (spread) which is also tax free due to it being classed as a "gamble"

.. i'd be pretty f*kd off if i had to pay tax on that being as ive taken the risk to do it with my own money, then anything i make (or lose) should remain mine fully - plus we all have already paid income tax on the money were all betting with which could vanish in a flash if we chose wrong. thats enough of a risk without giving anything to mr tax man.

martinmc71 · 19-03-2010, 3:18 PM

I agree that the main reasons for abolition were the offshore web-based firms. This was a rare example of the Govt being ahead of the trend, accepting the inevitable, and making a change to minimise disruption.

There were probably a couple of other factors, though. I seem to remember that, at the time, an arrangement was made with the big bookies regarding the tax they paid on corporate profits, and the payments/levies made to support horseracing. (Obviously other sports see massive betting money these days, but the horses are inextricably linked.) I think the idea was that the bookies would see more business due to the effective price to the punter dropping by the extra 9%, and the Govt would still get a tax take from corp tax on these higher profits. I'm sure Google would supply a more coherent explanation.

Also there were some admirable gentlemen trying to claim their betting costs as business expenses (saying they were professional gamblers). I think at that point the Revenue choked on the idea of allowing people to offset unlucky punts against tax, and decide to change things to a more sensible arrangement.

I don't think any of these things have gone away, so the chances of re-introduction are probably fairly slim. George Osborne might see it differently though - taxing vices is always the least unpopular option, so it might happen.

I would bet against it though. 9/1 against, at least.