I've just taken delivery of a pair of Martin Logan Clarity electrostatic hybrids. These were intended to replace a set of JMLab Electra 905's (excellent speakers!).

The reputation of the legendary midrange open-ness and imaging attracted me to the ML's. First plays last night though have left me very disappointed. I know they need very careful room placement, but after lots of experimenting I can't find any room position that creates a good sound. They are very bloated and boomy in the bass and thin/nasally in the midrange - the last thing I expected to hear really.

They're being driven by a Sugden A21a, which although only 25w, is a good amp and doesn't seem to be struggling to drive them (plenty of volume). The room is relatively small - about 12*18', speakers firing across the 12'. I've managed to get the speakers well away from wall boundaries but still no improvement.

I've only read good things about the ML's - has anybody else struggled to get a balanced sound out of them. The biggest surprise is the really poorly controlled bass.

Thanks,
tom.

[Mr Cat]

hi, it maybe worth talking to zanash on zerogain as he had / has a pair...I went to his place and he had them running with a quad amp and cdp - while the sound was good - I didn't think it was amazing as I felt as tho they were too big for his living room and the volume was too loud...

but he's a top bloke!

[ryart]

I have a pair of Martin Logan Aerius i and find they give a fantastic sound with none of the faults you mention although granted they are a different design. Assuming enough similarities in the design I hope the following might help.

I have mine biamped, fed by two Quad 909s (140watts per channel). I have tried them with other Quad amps, 303 and 405, and even with the 100 watts per channel of the 405 they sounded a bit weedy/strained/restrained (difficult to describe). So, 25 watts per channel sounds rather optimistic.

I also have very heavyweight velvet curtains behind them and have them firing down a 15x10ft room, 30 inches from the cutains and about 15 inches from the side walls with them toed in so that an imaginary line from them crosses in front of the listening position. I have carpet over a concrete floor which may help with the woofer being placed rather low and close to the floor. It may be worth trying is to adjust the amount they tilt back.

One thing to bear in mind is that electrostatics tend not to sound as full-on as many box speakers. In its place you get wonderful transparency, uncoloured sound and excellent transients. This can show up problems further up the line and reveal all sorts of horrors in your CD player and amps!

Best of luck and hope you manage to get them to sing!

thanks Ryart. I'm pleased to hear that they can be made to work in a relatively small room.

It does seem asthough it ight be the A21 that's the problem, ust not damping the speakers properly. I'll see if I can get hold of a beefier power amp to drive them.

I'd like to persevere as they are so close to being superb, if I could get the bottom end controlled.

thanks again,
tom

[ryart]

Let us know how you get on

[Pat Marcus]

What does the Dealer you bought them from have to say ? Can he lend you a more muscular amp to try ?

[0gopogo]

cougarboy,

You wrote your speakers fire across the 12' wall. To me this means they are positioned in front of the wider wall of the room. If this is true then there's the problem or at least one of your problems. Standing waves, reflections from back wall, ...

My room's dimensions are similar to your's, 18' x 11'. My Aeon-is are positioned a bit over 3' from the short front wall, and a bit over 1' away from the long side walls, slight toe-in. My comfy chair is 11' away from the speakers. None of the negative attributes you used apply, this setup - within the limits of my inferior amplification - sounds well. My amps' problem is not power, it is the fact that they can not handle the low impedance of the Logans at high frequencies and higher volumes. I am sure that the speaker positions are not quire optimal yet. They are, however, good enough until I get a better amp.

[ryart]

Hi Cougarboy

How are you getting on with your MLs? Went to one of the launch days for the new Quad speaker last Saturday (very nice BTW) and almost by accident listened to the Quads through both valve and solid state ampicfication. The solid state 909 monoblocks were excellent but to my ears the speakers sounded far far better with valves (Quad II 40s).

Anyway, popped up to the excellent Sounds of Music in East Sussex to see what valves might do for my ML Aerius's. Swapping the biamped 909s for a biwired pair of II 40 valve monoblocks with valve pre has transformed a wonderful speaker to one that has me saying "Good Grief" or "B****y Hell" at the end of each piece of music. Why? better bass, better dynamics and much more of a feeling of being there. Perhaps a case of listening to musicians playing music rather than just listening to music.

Of course this is just my response and others would no doubt think differently of the comparison, but food for thought none the less.

You indicate that you're trying to drive a ML Clarity with a 25 watt per channel amp. Say it ain't so.
I've got a pair of Claritys that I'm driving with NAD M15/M25 separates. They pump out 160 watts X 7 and it takes every bit of it to makes these babies sound right.
Lots O luck
PS Most low watt amps won't handle 4 ohm loads. If that's the case with yours, I'm surprised you haven't fried your power supply.

[Mark.Yudkin]

Martin Logan electrostats have absolutely horrible impedance characteristics - the Quads look positively friendly in comparison - some will drop down to 0.8 Ohm (and that's not a typo). In addition, the bass woofer in the ML hybrids are hefty power gobblers that will eat their way through 150W. You need an amplifier that not only has plenty of power, but that is also stable right down to that ludicrously low impedance. You are going to need a major investment in power amplification to meet the demands the Clarity's are placing. ML's should not be purchased without paying attention to the amplification.

I assume you bought the Clarity's second hand - since they are no longer sold new - so they should have been run in by now.

[Mark.Yudkin]

I keep dreaming of a Quad II 40 + ESL 2905/2805 surround setup, but no matter what I do, I just can't get all those speakers into my room, nor can I place all those hot monoblocks - even if I could afford them all. I couldn't even manage the ML Script i's for the surrounds, and I must have measured the room every second day for a couple of months looking to squeeze them in somehow.

In the meantime, I'm sticking to the ESL-63's for the front (I quite like both the ML Summits and the Vistas).