HD Audio through Analogue (HTPC)

[hickmeister]

Hi,

Just in the middle of building my HTPC and after looking at numerous posts, i just wondered if anyone had got there HTPC sending out DOLBY-HD and DTS-HD over analogue ....?

[Prism666]

I've got Dolby True-HD working well via analogue. To be honest I can't tell which sounds better, that or dolby digital plus via spdif. They sound different but thats down to the processing being done in my reciever vs the pc i reckon

I'm waiting on Powerdvd 8 to be released for DTS-HD MA support as I have a few blurays with those soundtracks

[hickmeister]

Originally Posted by Prism666

I've got Dolby True-HD working well via analogue. To be honest I can't tell which sounds better, that or dolby digital plus via spdif. They sound different but thats down to the processing being done in my reciever vs the pc i reckon

I'm waiting on Powerdvd 8 to be released for DTS-HD MA support as I have a few blurays with those soundtracks

Thanks for the Reply.... How have you got your PC linked to your AMP, what Cables, where is it plugged into, etc..... ??

[Azzin]

Originally Posted by hickmeister

Hi,

Just in the middle of building my HTPC and after looking at numerous posts, i just wondered if anyone had got there HTPC sending out DOLBY-HD and DTS-HD over analogue ....?

I'm using 5.1 analogue out to my Denon 1906 amp.

The audio and video signals are confirmed when selecting "Show Information" when watching an HD DVD in PowerDVD.

[Prism666]

Originally Posted by hickmeister

Thanks for the Reply.... How have you got your PC linked to your AMP, what Cables, where is it plugged into, etc..... ??

I have got 4x 3.5 stereo jack to 2 phono cables (spent about £5 on each from ebay). Jacks into the soundcard and the 8 phono's into the analogue inputs in the back of my Denon 3805 receiver

http://www.avland.co.uk/denon/avr3805/rearlrg.jpg

Near the bottom left of the picture 'ext in'

I then switch the receiver into Ext In mode and thats it.

To be honest, the Denon receivers are good all round devices but I'm basically only using the amplification apsects of it when using analogue in. A future purchase will probably be a 8 channel power amp to replace it. Many people seem to be aiming for an HDMI approach where they get a receiver to do the decoding and D/A conversion but to be honest unless you spend a fortune I'm not convinced that it is the way to go. I'm going to stick with analogue from the PC for a good while unless I can be convinced that a receiver under a grand can process and amplify better than my system currently sounds

[mossym]

Originally Posted by Prism666

I have got 4x 3.5 stereo jack to 2 phono cables (spent about £5 on each from ebay). Jacks into the soundcard and the 8 phono's into the analogue inputs in the back of my Denon 3805 receiver

http://www.avland.co.uk/denon/avr3805/rearlrg.jpg

Near the bottom left of the picture 'ext in'

I then switch the receiver into Ext In mode and thats it.

To be honest, the Denon receivers are good all round devices but I'm basically only using the amplification apsects of it when using analogue in. A future purchase will probably be a 8 channel power amp to replace it. Many people seem to be aiming for an HDMI approach where they get a receiver to do the decoding and D/A conversion but to be honest unless you spend a fortune I'm not convinced that it is the way to go. I'm going to stick with analogue from the PC for a good while unless I can be convinced that a receiver under a grand can process and amplify better than my system currently sounds

so you're trusting the D/A converters on your soundcard over the comparable ones in a receiver? not sure i'd agree with that.

[Azzin]

Originally Posted by hickmeister

Thanks for the Reply.... How have you got your PC linked to your AMP, what Cables, where is it plugged into, etc..... ??

My leads go straight from the analogue connections on the motherboard:



Direct to the analogue ins on the back of my amp (bottom left):



HTH.

[Prism666]

Originally Posted by mossym

so you're trusting the D/A converters on your soundcard over the comparable ones in a receiver? not sure i'd agree with that.

That would depend on the receiver. A £100+ sound card typically uses better DACS than I have have a 3 year old Denon 3805 which is rated SNR 102 dB. So in my case I guess yes - however, as I said earlier, stats aside, can I actually tell...?

These fairly expensive receivers (I paid £850 for mine 3 years ago), often use cheap as chips components inside. For example, the DAC's in every Denon receiver all the way up to the £3000 5805 use Burr-Brown PCM1791 DACS which cost about £1.50 each.

I truely believe that in general with consumer electronics you pay through the nose for brand name, fancy cases and tons of processing modes and features that a generally a waste of time. Nothing a PC could do equally as well given the correct silencing, anti vibration and internal shielding

Also, I'm not even sure my 7.1 speaker setup is capable of even letting me distinguish

[mossym]

make a quick edit there to change sbr to snr..

and i'm not saying reveicers have great dacs. i have a 3808 myself. Burr-Brown have been living for years off of a name they made a long time ago as audiophile chips. i mean it's not even a company anymore.

i just question that the dacs on the soundcard are much better. awful lot of electrical noise going on in a pc.

[Prism666]

Originally Posted by mossym

make a quick edit there to change sbr to snr..

Doh, cheers

i just question that the dacs on the soundcard are much better. awful lot of electrical noise going on in a pc.

To be honest I'm not sure. I wouldn't say the soundcard approach is particularily better or worse. With such a wide range of possible combinations of soundcard/amps or receivers I guess its different for everyone. I would say that decent soundcard plus amplification is comparable to a good receiver. Having, like I guess most people, only heard my own setup its difficult to truely compare. I do know however that next time I spend a chunk of cash on an amp, I'm more likely to spend it on a very good power amp rather than an all singing and dancing integrated receiver

[dogbert]

Originally Posted by Prism666

To be honest I'm not sure. I wouldn't say the soundcard approach is particularily better or worse.

mhh.. as a rule of thumb, it's much easier to lift the required SNR from a low noise floor of a dedicated receiver than from a loud noise floor of a regular PC, so my advise would be to spend the money on the receiver and rely on digital transmission (SPDIF, HDMI) between the PC and the receiver. SPDIF cards are reasonably cheap (20€), cards with HDMI will be cheap once they're widely available, which will be presumably in half a year's time.

[Erazerhead]

Originally Posted by dogbert

cards with HDMI will be cheap once they're widely available, which will be presumably in half a year's time.

That would be cool. Have you seen any news about such cards and their pricing?

[dogbert]

ASUS has announced an overpriced soundcards with HDMI connectors. also, the GPU makers (NVidia, ATI/AMD) are designing fully fledged HDMI connectors for their upcoming generation.

[Prism666]

Originally Posted by Erazerhead

That would be cool. Have you seen any news about such cards and their pricing?

Intel G35 and Nvidia 8200 motherboards can both do this right now. Asus is releasing a Xonar with HDMI shortly http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/02/..._capture_card/ and Auzentech an addon for their Prelude

However, once you have spent are fair amount on an add on Xonar or Prelude then you have to question again where would the best place be to do the conversion. As Dogbert says, in general the receiver would be the better place, but you have to also consider that these two soundcards are rated much higher than most receivers and even with the noise from the PC, could provide a better sound. I'm assuming here that most people who are trying to get the best sound from their PC are using low powered, silent components in cases with separate compartments for the PSU and hard drives

If you fancied a motherboard replacement with HDMI onboard then I don't think many would argue that using the HDMI output would be better than analogue as long as you are going for a decent receiver that can do it better (which to be honest is my problem with my 3 year old receiver)

[james.miller]

Originally Posted by Prism666

Intel G35 and Nvidia 8200 motherboards can both do this right now. Asus is releasing a Xonar with HDMI shortly http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/02/..._capture_card/ and Auzentech an addon for their Prelude

However, once you have spent are fair amount on an add on Xonar or Prelude then you have to question again where would the best place be to do the conversion. As Dogbert says, in general the receiver would be the better place, but you have to also consider that these two soundcards are rated much higher than most receivers and even with the noise from the PC, could provide a better sound. I'm assuming here that most people who are trying to get the best sound from their PC are using low powered, silent components in cases with separate compartments for the PSU and hard drives

If you fancied a motherboard replacement with HDMI onboard then I don't think many would argue that using the HDMI output would be better than analogue as long as you are going for a decent receiver that can do it better (which to be honest is my problem with my 3 year old receiver)

the xonar which is considered pretty top notch, uses the same dac's ad my onkyo 805. however, the onkyo does a better job being fed a digital signal, sadly. the xonar still picks up a little noise! theoretical specs on the dacs are all well and good, but its far form the last word on a sound cards performance.