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Old 15-08-2004, 7:46 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Reading this and other threads on testing prompted some thoughts on the subject of tone testing.

The experts can look away now. Or hopefully correct any of my mistakes.

You should always start a run of sinewave test tones at your highest test frequency and work downwards. This should avoid you blasting your equipment at inaudible frequencies. Which could easily happen if you start very low and then turn the level right up just to hear these strangely inaudible tones!

When you hit a room resonance it is the room that amplifies the signal. Not the equipment. Which merely "excites" the room resonance. The equipment is not being put in danger of overload by a true room resonance. Just be sure you haven't got the level too high if it's your first test tone!

The test signal should remain at the same level throughout a test run. Which means that you should choose a reasonable level on the SPL meter while still in the clearly audible region. Starting at somewhere around 70-80dBs @ 120Hz seems to work for me. This is impressive enough to be fun without damaging the scenery too much on room resonances.
There is no correct level. It is a matter of taste. If you start testing at 100dB on the meter then your sub may decide to commit suicide. Rather than play the really deep notes. If the neighbours start banging on the wall then your test level is probably a bit too high.

The danger is if you set your test level in the middle of an unknown (but deep) room response trough. If you discover the response is rising fast as you lower the frequency of your tones. Then you should lower the test level and start again from the beginning. Though you may simply be approaching a response peak slightly below your starting frequency. If the level doesn't get out of hand and starts to fall again with lower frequency tones then it was a peak.

Have your SPL meter propped up where your head is at your normal listening position. With the test microphone pointing towards the speakers or sub being tested. The RadioShack SPL meter has a tripod bush underneath if you have a photo or video tripod handy. It is often easier to read the scale if you set the meter on its side. I find it can be read from much further away when you are running back and forth to the computer. To change to the next tone or write down your SPL reading and test frequency.

Remember to have your meter correction figures handy when you finally plot your column of test figures onto a bit of graph paper or computer spreadsheet.

If you don't have expensive Windows Excel on your computer then don't panic. Download "Open Office". A free (64MB?) download. Not too painful if you have unlimited broadband.

Don't blame your subwoofer if it is your speakers causing a wobbly bass response. I would always test with the speakers working and normally calibrated first. Long before doing a sub only test. Which is largely of acedemic interest.

Remember that your speakers are part of the sound reproduction system on all material (music or film). You can't completely ignore the speakers in the bass. Even when they are crossed over as high as 120Hz! Though most are crossed over lower than this.

If you're running full range, unfiltered floorstanders like me. Then you'd better have your speakers working! Or your test results are completely worthless!

All speakers and subwoofers go through a whole series of being in an out of phase with each other. Depending entirely on frequency and your room's physical dimensions. The bigger the room the lower the affected frequencies. But these phase effects are always still there.

The sub's phase control often seems inneffective. Unless you are cancelling a phase peak between the sub and your speakers. Then you won't notice a thing as you wind the phase control knob back and forth. (Or switch between 0 and 180)

Adjusting the phase should always be done from the listening position anyway. Not when you're crouched over the sub!

Boo! You can all wake up again now!

Nimby
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Old 15-08-2004, 8:19 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Nice Post Nimby
Talking from good experience

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Old 15-08-2004, 8:27 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Old 15-08-2004, 12:02 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimby
You should always start a run of sinewave test tones at your highest test frequency and work downwards. This should avoid you blasting your equipment at inaudible frequencies. Which could easily happen if you start very low and then turn the level right up just to hear these strangely inaudible tones!
Sinewaves are also known to fry speaker drivers if played back at excessive levels (apparently), so when playing back test tones be VERY careful: it might sound ok to start with, but a big peak that you discover might not be so pleasant...
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Old 15-08-2004, 1:28 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Seems good Nimby. For surround testing I heard that the SPL meter should be vertical (ie. not pointing at any of the speakers really), that should give a more consistent reading all round.

I can't see how it would make any difference using a freq. sweep from low to high but it probably wouldn't sound as satisfying, nor will the low frequency limit be quite as apparent. (Just noticed that you weren't referring to a sweep but to various test tones in which case you'd be right).

With respect to the calibration adjustments, if you have the new SPL meter (curvy and very nice as I've just got one from Keene) then I don't think anybody's sure what the adjustments are or even if they're necessary. I'd be very surprised if the same values were used though.

Smurfin, I'm not sure how sine waves should damage speaker drivers (unless you were putting particularly low frequencies through which the motor can't reproduce without burning out). What would definitely cause problems is if the sine waves weren't pure and contained any DC component. I'm sceptical of the quality of computer generated sine waves such as the mp3's or function generators available. Perhaps someone could advise me? I'd rather not have to go and nick a lab standard function generator from uni!

Then onto my main question which sort of follows on: Which is the best PEQ? I know lots of people use the BFD successfully but has anyone got any experience with the analogue models that SVS supply for example? I think their cheapest model works out less than a BFD.
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Old 15-08-2004, 4:32 PM   #21 (permalink)
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A resonance as a result of a room mode will sound louder without the sub or speaker working any harder. I repeat that the sub is in no danger if it is a room peak. It is the room amplifying that particular tone. Not the driver or the sub's amplifier.

Using downloaded test tones will quickly show if harmonic distortion is present if a tone below 20Hz is clearly audible as a hum. The presense of a higher tone would indicate that distortion is being reproduced. It should ideally be an inaudible "soft & fluffy" air movement. Sensed clearly but not really heard.

I am satisfied that using high level connections and snapbug's tones in my system that very little distortion is being reproduced. The room can really shake without anything being clearly audible. That's good enough for me. Even if I'm completely wrong about the level of distortion.

Square or distorted high frequency waveforms can fry a tweeter rather quickly if at high enough level. Bass/midrange units are usually protected by the crossover. Though some speakers have only a simple capacitance (high pass) filter for the tweeter. Which could expose the bass/mid driver to possible damage I suppose.

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Old 15-08-2004, 5:19 PM   #22 (permalink)
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What software / tones are you guys using for this and where can I get it please?
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Old 15-08-2004, 6:28 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Everything that you need to know about using a BFD is on the snapbug site. The test tones are downloadable from here
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Old 15-08-2004, 8:03 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karkus30
Ettepet, Im not really sure what your saying ?? I use the amplification I have and the graph shows the db levels. This is the accepted way of setting up a sub woofer. Tried moving the location, but it just wasnt happening. The room that I use at present has terrible acoustics as its square.
What I was saying is that you should NEVER use huge positive gain on your BFD.

I hope this was clearer.
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Old 15-08-2004, 9:35 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ettepet
What I was saying is that you should NEVER use huge positive gain on your BFD.

I hope this was clearer.
Had to use +10db @ 63Hz. Apparently you shouldnt use lage increases much below 50Hz due to the sheer power it takes to do that, leaves little headroom. Above 50Hz isnt so bad.
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