[KenjohnB]

Hi everyone.

Can someone please help?

I have used my Harmony for a number of years without problem. However, after trying some of the Tips and Tricks on this section, I've made a complete Horlicks of things. I've got the vast majority working OK again but can't get my TV (PanasoniC TH37PX60) to switch on. Using Help on the Harmony doesn't solve it. When I switch on via "Devices" or the TV remote, the set comes on but instead of going to HDMI1 (for Sky) it goes to EC1/HDMI1. I've never heard of "EC1". What is it and how can I get my TV to go to HDMI?

I've tried all the troubleshooting routes, but to no avail.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks.

Ken

[logiciel]

It powers on when you press a button in the Devices area of the remote that has the Power-On command on it, but does not power on when you select an Activity that includes it - right?
At Devices> Settings> Adjust Power make sure the same command is set for Power-On, then in your Activities make it the first device to power on.

[KenjohnB]

By a lot of fiddling with the settings, including updating the Harmony software for my TV, I have resolved most of the problems. However, one issue remains which is still puzzling me.
Prior to encountering these recent problems, my Harmony was programmed to set the TV input to HDMI1 when in the "Watch Sky" activity, and it duly did this without problem for years. Now it switches to "EC1/HDMI1" Does anyone know what EC1 refers to and does EC1/HDMI1 differ in any way to HDMI1?

By the way, if I start off by "Watch DVD" activity (input HDMI2) and then switch to "Watch Sky" (i.e. TV switches input, but does not turn off), then TV does switch to HDMI1

Many thanks.

Ken

[logiciel]

OK Ken, so far so good. Where does this EC1 appear - do you mean the TV puts it on the screen? And what difference does it make? If it doesn't make any then you have your answer. Take a look at Review Settings for the Harmony Activity to make sure what the name of the input setting is there. In the Devices area go to Adjust Inputs and check the list of input names and their commands.

[monksy74]

I have a PZ70 and the input functionality changed a lot after the 60 series.

On mine you can go into the tv settings and tell the tv to power on to av or tv input at startup.

I used to have sky via scart on av1. If I chose the power on to AV it would automatically power on to AV1 but only if the sky box was on. In this case it displayed AC/AV1.

So I'm guessing the AC stood for auto control or something like that.

Is there a similar option in the px60 tv settings? If so have you recently changed it?

[KenjohnB]

Originally Posted by logiciel

OK Ken, so far so good. Where does this EC1 appear - do you mean the TV puts it on the screen? And what difference does it make? If it doesn't make any then you have your answer. Take a look at Review Settings for the Harmony Activity to make sure what the name of the input setting is there. In the Devices area go to Adjust Inputs and check the list of input names and their commands.

Yes, it appears on the top left of the screen for a few seconds. The name of the input in the Harmony settings is HDMI1. And until a few days ago, when starting the "Watch Sky" activity it displayed HDMI1 in the top left of the screen. Now it displays EC1/HDMI1 and I can't understand why. In all honesty, I don't think there is any difference in PQ, should there be? Its just bugging me that this has happened and I can't seem to change it back to how it was.

Many thanks.

Ken

[KenjohnB]

Originally Posted by monksy74

I have a PZ70 and the input functionality changed a lot after the 60 series.

On mine you can go into the tv settings and tell the tv to power on to av or tv input at startup.

I used to have sky via scart on av1. If I chose the power on to AV it would automatically power on to AV1 but only if the sky box was on. In this case it displayed AC/AV1.

So I'm guessing the AC stood for auto control or something like that.

Is there a similar option in the px60 tv settings? If so have you recently changed it?

Yes, mine is also set to power on to AV.

Many thanks

Ken

[logiciel]

That's OK Ken and I guess you're right that it will have no effect.
You could try running through the input settings with the original remote control to see what appears on the screen for each one.

[KenjohnB]

Thanks again Logiciel.

Did some experimenting tonight with results that puzzle me even more.

I did as you suggested and went through the inputs using my TV remote. Not once was there a mention of an "EC1", just TV, AV 1, 2, 3, 4 & 5, PC, Component and HDMI 1 & 2.

Then, using original remotes, the following happened:

1. Switchon TV, screen comes on TV input. Switch on Sky, screen switches to EC1/HDMI1.

2. Switch on TV, screen on on TV input. Switch TV input to HDMI. Switch on Sky, screen switches to HDMI1.

3. Switch on TV, screen comes on TV input. Switch to HDMI2 (DVD). Switch on Sky, screen switches to HDMI1.

4. Switch on Sky. Switch on TV, screen comes on EC1/HDMI1.

Could this be something to do with the extended time it takes for my TV to "warm up"? If so, why did it work perfectly well before? Also, tried adjust delay settings (guessing, if I'm honest) but no change.

My TV does take about 9-10 seconds to display an image, but as I say, worked perfectly well until last week.

By the way, my delay setting on the TV are:

Power On: 1200
Inter-key delay: 100
Input delay: 500
Inter-device delay: 100

Many thanks again for all your help.

Ken

[monksy74]

Originally Posted by KenjohnB

Thanks again Logiciel.

Did some experimenting tonight with results that puzzle me even more.

I did as you suggested and went through the inputs using my TV remote. Not once was there a mention of an "EC1", just TV, AV 1, 2, 3, 4 & 5, PC, Component and HDMI 1 & 2.

Then, using original remotes, the following happened:

1. Switchon TV, screen comes on TV input. Switch on Sky, screen switches to EC1/HDMI1.

2. Switch on TV, screen on on TV input. Switch TV input to HDMI. Switch on Sky, screen switches to HDMI1.

3. Switch on TV, screen comes on TV input. Switch to HDMI2 (DVD). Switch on Sky, screen switches to HDMI1.

4. Switch on Sky. Switch on TV, screen comes on EC1/HDMI1.

Could this be something to do with the extended time it takes for my TV to "warm up"? If so, why did it work perfectly well before? Also, tried adjust delay settings (guessing, if I'm honest) but no change.

My TV does take about 9-10 seconds to display an image, but as I say, worked perfectly well until last week.

By the way, my delay setting on the TV are:

Power On: 1200
Inter-key delay: 100
Input delay: 500
Inter-device delay: 100

Many thanks again for all your help.

Ken

Ken, the TV will auto switch to HDMI1 or AV1 if there is a device powered on and sending a SCART control or HDMI control signal.

When the TV auto switches it will display EC before the input name. It's the same input, the EC is just there to tell you that the TV auto switched to that input rather than you selecting it manually.

This is why it doesn't display it if it's already on that input when you power the device on.

If you set the power on preference to AV in the TV setup it will only power on to HDMI1 if the device connected is already switched on and sending a control signal. This explains why it was coming on to the TV input in points 1,2 and 3 and coming on to EC/HDMI1 in point 4.

There is a setting in the harmony software asking if you use SCARTs. This is there to try and prevent auto switching messing things up.

If you say no to this, when you start an activity the harmony will power all devices on before setting the input. If it does this the TV may auto switch when the sky box powers on. This is bad when you're using a cycling input method as the TV auto switches and then the harmony advances the input onto the next one.

If you say yes to this, when you start an activity the harmony will power the TV on, wait for the power on delay, set the TV input, then power all other devices on. Becuase the Harmony sets the input before the sky box is switched on the TV doesn't need to auto switch.

I'm wondering if the tweaking you mentioned in post 1 has changed this setting and that's why your now seeing the EC before the input name?

I also think your power on delay is too short. Mine is set to 7000 (7 seconds). Try timing it with the original remote to see how long from powering on before you can change input.

Hope this helps

Phil

[logiciel]

That's perfectly OK Ken - it clearly was worth trying out what happens with the original remote - that did explain the problem - and Phil has comprehensively explained how it explains it!
The magic word in this is "Scart" and although it was Phil who used it, not you, I'm pretty sure his guess was right.
They're awful things anyway, and if they're fully connected they always conflict with the Harmony, in some cases even when you specify that you use them.
One solution is to replace them, preferably with a better type of plug, or by a Scart that's not fully wired, or by a Scart adapter with only three RF connectors.
The other is to disable the Harmony's automatic switching, but I would not recommend that.
And yes, that man's right again - the Power-On Delay is much too low - it needs to cover the 9-10 seconds that you noted yourself.
Logi

[monksy74]

Cheers Logi, although just to clarify - HDMI cables send a similar control signal and the tv auto switches the input when the device is switched on.

I tested my sky HD by powering it off, switching to a different input and then powering it back on. The tv switched back to HDMI1 and displayed AC/HDMI1. It still did this even though scart control is off in the sky HD settings.

Phil

[KenjohnB]

Thanks guys

Absolutely brilliant advice and support. I'm sure this is what AV Forums is meant to be about,

Any idea why it didn't do this before (ie EC1/HDMI1 vs HDMI1?)? Probably a stupid question, but could it be due to the digital switchover which happened around here recently?

I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't a Harmony issue at all!

Many thanks.

Ken

[KenjohnB]

Originally Posted by monksy74

Ken, the TV will auto switch to HDMI1 or AV1 if there is a device powered on and sending a SCART control or HDMI control signal.

When the TV auto switches it will display EC before the input name. It's the same input, the EC is just there to tell you that the TV auto switched to that input rather than you selecting it manually.

This is why it doesn't display it if it's already on that input when you power the device on.

If you set the power on preference to AV in the TV setup it will only power on to HDMI1 if the device connected is already switched on and sending a control signal. This explains why it was coming on to the TV input in points 1,2 and 3 and coming on to EC/HDMI1 in point 4.

There is a setting in the harmony software asking if you use SCARTs. This is there to try and prevent auto switching messing things up.

If you say no to this, when you start an activity the harmony will power all devices on before setting the input. If it does this the TV may auto switch when the sky box powers on. This is bad when you're using a cycling input method as the TV auto switches and then the harmony advances the input onto the next one.

If you say yes to this, when you start an activity the harmony will power the TV on, wait for the power on delay, set the TV input, then power all other devices on. Becuase the Harmony sets the input before the sky box is switched on the TV doesn't need to auto switch.

I'm wondering if the tweaking you mentioned in post 1 has changed this setting and that's why your now seeing the EC before the input name?

I also think your power on delay is too short. Mine is set to 7000 (7 seconds). Try timing it with the original remote to see how long from powering on before you can change input.

Hope this helps

Phil

Thanks Phil!

Where is this setting?

Many thanks.

Ken

[monksy74]

Originally Posted by KenjohnB

Thanks Phil!

Where is this setting?

Many thanks.

Ken

Go to the tv device - troubleshoot, and look for
TV automatically switches some or all of the inputs (e.g. SCART cables--commonly used in Europe).

Phil

[logiciel]

Right again Phil - HDMI can also do it, though neither did it on my Tosh!
It must be a TV-specific thing, but you're right too Ken, it's definitely not a Harmony issue thing.

[KenjohnB]

Once again, many thanks Phil and Logi.

I did some more tweaking as per your suggestions, still going to EC1/HDMI1 so thought I would just have to accept that and stop worrying about it.

Now, lo and behold, the Harmony will not turn my TV on from any activity, even when I change all the settings back to what they were before. Have to turn on via Devices - TV - On/Off.

Think it might be time to introduce my Harmony to the wall!!!!

Thanks again guys.

Ken

[KenjohnB]

Thanks to your kind help, I've worked out what the problem is. What I need to do is to get the TV to activate before the Sky box turns on. I demonstrated this by turning my TV with its own remote on than pressing the "Watch Sky" activity on my Harmony (this doesn't currently affect the TV as the activity isn't turning TV on - as per my last post). And guess what? The TV switches to HDMI1 (without the EC1) just like it did before the problems started.

Only problem is, identifying problem much easier than sorting it! Any ideas? Especially about the Harmony not switching TV on. By the way, its isn't switching TV on in any activity, but does so when you switch TV on via "Devices".

Many thanks

Ken

[logiciel]

OK Ken - It's definitely best to have the TV as the first to power-on in each Activity. Don't forget our notes about the Power-On Delay. Then at Devices> TV> Settings> Adjust Power make sure that the option is to "turn off when not in use", and that the same command is set for Power-On as the one that you know works direct from Devices.

[monksy74]

Originally Posted by KenjohnB

Thanks to your kind help, I've worked out what the problem is. What I need to do is to get the TV to activate before the Sky box turns on. I demonstrated this by turning my TV with its own remote on than pressing the "Watch Sky" activity on my Harmony (this doesn't currently affect the TV as the activity isn't turning TV on - as per my last post). And guess what? The TV switches to HDMI1 (without the EC1) just like it did before the problems started.

Only problem is, identifying problem much easier than sorting it! Any ideas? Especially about the Harmony not switching TV on. By the way, its isn't switching TV on in any activity, but does so when you switch TV on via "Devices".

Many thanks

Ken

Ken, if it's not working in activities this suggests that the power settings are wrong. Go to the tv device and check what commands it uses. Make sure it's not set to leave on all the time.

What commands are working in device mode? is there a powertoggle command and separate PowerOn and PowerOff commands?

One thing with my Panasonic TV (and later ones) is that it needs the power command sending for about 1 second. Is this the same with yours?

In the power settings Logitech have added a duration box so that you can tell it to send the commands for xxx milliseconds. They haven't added this to all model variants in their database though. If it's not there for yours email logitech and ask them to add it.

One other thing - does the harmony power off the TV when you press the power off button?

[KenjohnB]

Sorted!!!!! - well almost!

Looked at all the settings you suggested, still no luck. Then had a brainwave - switch Sky on to HDMI2, put the rest on HDMI1 and see what happens. Guess what? Not only did it work - no EC1/HDMI2 on Sky (just HDMI2) but also no EC1/HDMI1 (just HDMI1) on the HDMI1 devices - result! Don'y know how or why it worked, but it did.

Couldn't get any joy with the TV On/Off issues despite trying all of your suggestions. So I assumed something must have gone wrong with my Harmony and rang Logitech. A very nice man there told me that the Harmony software for my TV had been updated and so he loaded the new version. Now everything hunky-dory again - TV switching on and off as it should.

Just a slight issue, and one I could live with, is that when starting an activity, the TV switches on and goes to the TV input for about 8-10 seconds after which it switches to the appropriate HDMI setting. The Logitech guy said this was normal on Panasonics. However, it didn't happen before - the TV went to the correct input almost immediately. Didn't want to disagree with him though as he had spent 45 minutes putting things right for me.

Current settings are:

Power On duration: 1500ms
Power Off duration: 1500ms

Power-on delay: 12000ms
Inter-key delay: 100ms
Input delay: 500ms
Inter-device dealy: 5ooms

Don't know if any of these are causing this issue, but, as I said, I think I can live with it.

Many thanks

Ken

[logiciel]

Good to hear of all the improvements.
That remaining problem isn't so much one of Panasonics as of HDMI control.
There may be a way of disabling it in the TV menu - Phil would know about that.
All the delays look right now and if 1500ms for the duration is working every time then there's no need to go for the mroe typical 2000.

[KenjohnB]

Well Phil and Logi, that's it! Finally sorted. Solved the last little gremlin by reducing Power-on delay from 12000 to 5000 ms and TV now goes straight to the relevant input.

Wouldn't have done it without your help and support, so once again, hearltfelt thanks and good wishes to you both.

Many thanks.

Ken

[logiciel]

OK Ken - Excellent - I thought that 12 second Delay was too long - but "didn't want to disagree"!
It's good to know we helped to get you there and it's very nice of you to say so - thank you too.
Logi