[fastra]

Anyone got one of these:

ARGOS £130

... and are they any good at all?

[stripper_vicar]

I had one the 250gb version of one of these. Bought it at the beginning of December. Constant freezes and slow to respond. Worst piece of electronic hardware I've ever bought. It eventually stopped working completely at the beginning of January, it which point it went back to the shop and I bought a Humax, which is an infinite amount better in every way.

Obviously just my opinions but you did ask......

[fastra]

Cheers,

its these opinions that help though...

I think I was just looking for a cheap' alternative to the Humax anyway, so I suppose the extra £30/40 is money well spent really.

[stripper_vicar]

I'd say money extremely well spent. As opposed to completely wasted on the Wharfedale. Plus, I think there are some deals to be done on the Humax so may not even be that much more than £130 - £140.

[creddish]

Originally Posted by fastra

Anyone got one of these:

ARGOS £130

... and are they any good at all?

I think the comments made so far in this thread are premature. These latest Vestel made LP/CI Slot units have only been on sale for about one week and AFAIK there has been very little user experience posted on them yet. A couple of users posting on Digital Spy have commented on occasional brief loss of HDMI output but I have seen no other info. The previous Vestel T825 units with the 1.7 and 2.7 software versions do have issues with the Series Record functionality but the latest 4.8 software has not been reported on significantly yet.

No doubt the situation will become clearer soon.

Colin

[technogran]

Originally Posted by creddish

I think the comments made so far in this thread are premature. These latest Vestel made LP/CI Slot units have only been on sale for about one week and AFAIK there has been very little user experience posted on them yet. A couple of users posting on Digital Spy have commented on occasional brief loss of HDMI output but I have seen no other info. The previous Vestel T825 units with the 1.7 and 2.7 software versions do have issues with the Series Record functionality but the latest 4.8 software has not been reported on significantly yet.

No doubt the situation will become clearer soon.

Colin

Colin what do you mean by the latest 4.8 software? As I own the Wharfedale with series link has there been a software OTA update?

[creddish]

Originally Posted by technogran

Colin what do you mean by the latest 4.8 software? As I own the Wharfedale with series link has there been a software OTA update?

Sorry to disappoint you. There have been no downloads from Vestel. The 4.8 software version is the version installed on the latest LP/CI Slot Vestel PVRs just arrived in stock at Argos.

Colin

[technogran]

Thanks Colin just wanted to check that I hadn't missed it! Actually mine is behaving impecably at the moment! Its fine as long as you don't go into search and are not watching anything live when two recordings start! I still like it though but I do wish that they would have a software download just to iron out the small problems.
I really don't want to take it back if possible as the pic from it is brilliant via the HDMI and its such a shame if it doesn't get an update.

TG

[bengalcat]

The picture is excellent over HDMI. It is a pain in the backside the amount of times it crashes!!!!!

[creddish]

Originally Posted by bengalcat

The picture is excellent over HDMI. It is a pain in the backside the amount of times it crashes!!!!!

What kind of "crashes" are you getting? Is this just using the HDMI output or is it on SCART also. Watching live TV has always been a bit temperamental on earlier Vestel PVRs. This previously has been generally freezing of the picture and sound occasionally. This can usually be cleared by simply changing channels, without the need for setting to standby or power cycling. It has also been an oddity that this behaviour tends to improve after a week or so of use.

It would be a useful test to carry out on these latest LP/CI Slot versions to the check the performance of the unit when a relatively large number of Series Record events have been scheduled, say 20 or so programmes with a number of episodes per week. On the previous T825 Series Record units on software versions 1.7 and 2.7 this caused the unit to be very slow to respond to user commands. For example it could take up to 40s to access the Timers list and navigation of the Guide (EPG) became very slow. It will be interesting to know if this aspect has been improved on the latest 4.8 software version.

Colin

[technogran]

Colin who has reported it as slow? I have loads of Series Links set and I haven't noticed any slow down?

TG

[creddish]

Originally Posted by technogran

Colin who has reported it as slow? I have loads of Series Links set and I haven't noticed any slow down?

TG

There are several threads discussing this issue, mainly on Digital Spy I think. One example is the one here, particular the posts by Barry #34, #54, #78, 85, and PTD #33. Barry is a well respected expert on PVR and has done some rigorous tests on one of these units. It may well be that the tests that Barry has done are more rigorous than some users would experience in practice but they do expose some inherent weakness. Although I don't have Series Record on my T816 I do notice some significant slowing down accessing the Library and deleting recordings now I have a relatively large number (about 100) of recordings in the Library.

Colin

[fastra]

Thanks Colin,

That link is invaluable!

[bengalcat]

Originally Posted by creddish

What kind of "crashes" are you getting? Is this just using the HDMI output or is it on SCART also. Watching live TV has always been a bit temperamental on earlier Vestel PVRs. This previously has been generally freezing of the picture and sound occasionally. This can usually be cleared by simply changing channels, without the need for setting to standby or power cycling. It has also been an oddity that this behaviour tends to improve after a week or so of use.

It would be a useful test to carry out on these latest LP/CI Slot versions to the check the performance of the unit when a relatively large number of Series Record events have been scheduled, say 20 or so programmes with a number of episodes per week. On the previous T825 Series Record units on software versions 1.7 and 2.7 this caused the unit to be very slow to respond to user commands. For example it could take up to 40s to access the Timers list and navigation of the Guide (EPG) became very slow. It will be interesting to know if this aspect has been improved on the latest 4.8 software version.

Colin

It crashes a lot when you are watching a programme and recording another, it also crashes when recording two programmes at once, and the series link also gives it a crash now and again. I am thinking of power cycling it everyday to keep it going. I am using HDMI.

[creddish]

Originally Posted by creddish

What kind of "crashes" are you getting? Is this just using the HDMI output or is it on SCART also. Watching live TV has always been a bit temperamental on earlier Vestel PVRs. This previously has been generally freezing of the picture and sound occasionally. This can usually be cleared by simply changing channels, without the need for setting to standby or power cycling. It has also been an oddity that this behaviour tends to improve after a week or so of use.

It would be a useful test to carry out on these latest LP/CI Slot versions to the check the performance of the unit when a relatively large number of Series Record events have been scheduled, say 20 or so programmes with a number of episodes per week. On the previous T825 Series Record units on software versions 1.7 and 2.7 this caused the unit to be very slow to respond to user commands. For example it could take up to 40s to access the Timers list and navigation of the Guide (EPG) became very slow. It will be interesting to know if this aspect has been improved on the latest 4.8 software version.

Colin

Originally Posted by bengalcat

It crashes a lot when you are watching a programme and recording another, it also crashes when recording two programmes at once, and the series link also gives it a crash now and again. I am thinking of power cycling it everyday to keep it going. I am using HDMI.

You didn't answer my question whether it is just using the HDMI output giving problems or is it on SCART output also? I'm also unsure what you mean by a "crash". Does the unit "lock-up" and refuse to respond to any remote control buttons? Does the picture "freeze" but remain on the TV screen?

Some users have reported problems with the HDMI output freezing but it is OK on their SCART output. This is a different issue from the Live TV freezing and apparent lock-ups which affects most Vestel PVRs occasionally, the frequency depending on how the unit is used. Have you tried simply changing channels to clear freezing. Also over-enthusiatic use of the Remote Control (particularly whilst using Rewind) can cause the unit to "apparently" lock-up but if you wait a while (30s or so) the unit will usually recover and immediately execute any stored commands.

It may well be that if you have a much higher rate of occurrences of the above issues than typical, you have a poor signal issue. The Vestel PVRs are less tolerant to signal levels than some other PVRs.

Colin

[bengalcat]

By crashing I mean it locks up and will not respond to either the remote controls or the controls on the PVR. It does it so regularly. Other users have said about. You are right that the remote will freeze up sometimes and you have to wait a while. I do think using the SCART will change this.

[miniman]

Bought one of these for my day at Christmas. First one kept crashing and finally completly locked up, 2nd one went the same way. I then got a full refund and bought him the humax. He has not had a problem with the humax and is now hooked on his pvr. Not bad for a 70 year old

[Dav0]

I have the Wharfedale LP250DTRHDMI 250Gb version and so far the unit is great. Good picture upscaling to my Hitachi plasma and no problems via the HDMI other than the occasional, very short, picture break up.

Anyhow, does any know the Oneforall code for these?

Cheers,

Mark

[DavidF2005]

I have just bought the LP250 version, to replace my Toppy which failed after about 2 years. I have 3 'problems' which the (Argos) help-line was not too helpful with.
1. Occasional momentary freezing on real-time viewing (SCART connection). Never happened on the Toppy so unlikely to be aerial or signal problem.
2. When not in use (ie on standby) unit starts up every few hours; HDD seems to run, and green panel lights up and says something like 'starting', then after 20 seconds or so it runs down again. Argos say this is normal! Anyone comment?
3. On the Toppy, the PVR would automatically 'capture' the TV from its basic analogue mode. With this new one I have to go through the TV menu to select the appropriate SCART input. I have to do this for every evening session. Not catastrophic but a little tedious.

I don't want to return the box as I think I have mislaid the receipt!
Anyone got any advice, please?

DavidF

[creddish]

Originally Posted by DavidF2005

I have just bought the LP250 version, to replace my Toppy which failed after about 2 years. I have 3 'problems' which the (Argos) help-line was not too helpful with.
1. Occasional momentary freezing on real-time viewing (SCART connection). Never happened on the Toppy so unlikely to be aerial or signal problem.
2. When not in use (ie on standby) unit starts up every few hours; HDD seems to run, and green panel lights up and says something like 'starting', then after 20 seconds or so it runs down again. Argos say this is normal! Anyone comment?
3. On the Toppy, the PVR would automatically 'capture' the TV from its basic analogue mode. With this new one I have to go through the TV menu to select the appropriate SCART input. I have to do this for every evening session. Not catastrophic but a little tedious.

I don't want to return the box as I think I have mislaid the receipt!
Anyone got any advice, please?

DavidF

Problem No.1 is a common with all the recent Vestel PVRs. Odd thing is it tends to improve after a week or so's use.

Problem No.2 is also common. Some have said that it is the unit checking for updates but I'm not sure the cause has definitely been identified.

Problem No.3 I've not heard of before. Are you actually changing the state of the PVR (e.g.) from standby to on or do you have any other devices "hogging" the TV AV input(s). Have you tried changing the SCART lead? It is probably something to do with the switching signals on Pin 8 of the SCART lead to the TV. Could be a hardware fault in the PVR if the SCART lead and TV inputs are known to be OK i.e. nothing else has been changed except to change over the old and new PVRs.

Colin

[DavidF2005]

Colin,

Thanks very much for your informative and (mostly) reassuring reply.
Indeed, the momentary freezing problem seems to have improved or even gone away. Last night (our fourth 'session') seemd completely glitch free.

This frequent recycling is strange. The Argos 'Help Line' said it was normal but I can't believe that it is intended for the unit to cycle like this several times a day (except at 3 am); I notice it twice most afternoons and it may well be more. It seems strange that there seems to be no manufacturer's authoritative info on this.

I am using the same SCART lead and TV as with the previous box. As for not capturing the SCART signal, the Argos lady said it is normal! DO OTHERS HAVE ANY EXPERIENCE OF THIS, either 'capturing' or 'not capturing'?

Cheers,
DavidF

[creddish]

Originally Posted by DavidF2005

Colin,

Thanks very much for your informative and (mostly) reassuring reply.
Indeed, the momentary freezing problem seems to have improved or even gone away. Last night (our fourth 'session') seemd completely glitch free.

This frequent recycling is strange. The Argos 'Help Line' said it was normal but I can't believe that it is intended for the unit to cycle like this several times a day (except at 3 am); I notice it twice most afternoons and it may well be more. It seems strange that there seems to be no manufacturer's authoritative info on this.

I am using the same SCART lead and TV as with the previous box. As for not capturing the SCART signal, the Argos lady said it is normal! DO OTHERS HAVE ANY EXPERIENCE OF THIS, either 'capturing' or 'not capturing'?

Cheers,
DavidF

Regarding the unit starting up (your Problem No. 2) I found a couple of posts where others have reported this on the non-LP version of this PVR which preceded the LP version you have. See here Posts #123, 124 and 125. One of the views expressed was that the unit was checking for updates of Series Record data. This behaviour has not been reported AFAIK on the non-Series Record models.

Regarding the non-capturing problem could you describe the initial conditions and the sequence of button presses you carry out expecting the TV to capture the PVR signal. It may give a clue as to what is wrong.

Colin

[technogran]

Originally Posted by creddish

Regarding the unit starting up (your Problem No. 2) I found a couple of posts where others have reported this on the non-LP version of this PVR which preceded the LP version you have. See here Posts #123, 124 and 125. One of the views expressed was that the unit was checking for updates of Series Record data. This behaviour has not been reported AFAIK on the non-Series Record models.

Regarding the non-capturing problem could you describe the initial conditions and the sequence of button presses you carry out expecting the TV to capture the PVR signal. It may give a clue as to what is wrong.

Colin

Colin don't know if I am misunderstanding the poster here, but my Series Link Wharfedale 250HDMI starts the HD up and then it stops about every 15 minutes or so, but it doesn't come out of standby to do this, it remains in standby whilst this is taking place.

TG

[creddish]

Originally Posted by technogran

Colin don't know if I am misunderstanding the poster here, but my Series Link Wharfedale 250HDMI starts the HD up and then it stops about every 15 minutes or so, but it doesn't come out of standby to do this, it remains in standby whilst this is taking place.

TG

Hi TG, Maybe I have mis-understood too? I assumed DavidF2005 meant his unit comes out of standby when he said "unit starts up every few hours" but maybe it does not become fully operational? Can you clarify David? In the link I posted one poster (SgtRock) used the phrase " switch on about once an hour for a couple of minutes and then switch off" and the other (Barry) said "My Wharfdale certainly does something every hour ish, can hear the HDD clunk and then spin down" so I guess it is not certain whether all the examples are the same or not. Either way something happens so David can be assured it's not just his unit doing something.

Colin

[technogran]

Originally Posted by creddish

Hi TG, Maybe I have mis-understood too? I assumed DavidF2005 meant his unit comes out of standby when he said "unit starts up every few hours" but maybe it does not become fully operational? Can you clarify David? In the link I posted one poster (SgtRock) used the phrase " switch on about once an hour for a couple of minutes and then switch off" and the other (Barry) said "My Wharfdale certainly does something every hour ish, can hear the HDD clunk and then spin down" so I guess it is not certain whether all the examples are the same or not. Either way something happens so David can be assured it's not just his unit doing something.

Colin

Yes Colin I agree, a little more clarification wouldn't go amiss. You only notice it of course because the disc is not spinning normally and only really does so when it is deemed necessary. I just have always surmised that because it has Series Link, it was probably just accessing the hard drive to check on changes to the EPG, but of course I could be wrong. It has never bothered me as the unit is so quiet other times.

TG

[DavidF2005]

Colin, TG

1. Yes, the spontaneous run-up reported by others does seem to be similar to my own. To clarify, the machine is not in use (ie on standby) with only the red light on. Then suddenly there is a gentle whirring (presumably the HD and/or fan running up), the green panel says, I think, 'STARTING' and after about 30 seconds there is another whirring as the HDD/fan runs down.; a few seconds later there is another slight , brief whirring and then the unit reverts to standby. The noise is quiet and I only notice it when sitting in the living room quietly reading or dozing in the afternoon (I AM retired!). I reckon there is about 1 1/2 hours between these events. I am not disturbed by the noise, but I am a little concerned that excessive and possibly unnecessary recycling of the HDD may shorten its life. I do have a series recording selected, but I am 95% sure that this phenomenon existed before this.

2. To clarify the non-capture by my TV of the PVR's SCART signal: I have tried both switching on the TV first and then the PVR, and also switching on the PVR (and allowing it to fully run up) before switching on the TV. This latter is to see if the TV will 'search' for a SCART signal on switch-on and only capture it then. Neither sequence has been succesful. As I said before, the TV always captured my previous PVR, and this occurred no matter what sequence of switching was used. I am planning to buy an HDMI cable to link the PVR to the TV. Do you think this will make for automatic connection?

Regards,
David

[creddish]

Originally Posted by DavidF2005

Colin, TG

1. Yes, the spontaneous run-up reported by others does seem to be similar to my own. To clarify, the machine is not in use (ie on standby) with only the red light on. Then suddenly there is a gentle whirring (presumably the HD and/or fan running up), the green panel says, I think, 'STARTING' and after about 30 seconds there is another whirring as the HDD/fan runs down.; a few seconds later there is another slight , brief whirring and then the unit reverts to standby. The noise is quiet and I only notice it when sitting in the living room quietly reading or dozing in the afternoon (I AM retired!). I reckon there is about 1 1/2 hours between these events. I am not disturbed by the noise, but I am a little concerned that excessive and possibly unnecessary recycling of the HDD may shorten its life. I do have a series recording selected, but I am 95% sure that this phenomenon existed before this.

"STARTING" is the front panel display that is given when re-booting after switching the power of completely at the mains. When coming out of standby normally, the display simply changes almost instantly from the time indication to the current channel identification. This suggests to me that it is not coming fully out of standby but is doing some other function. A test of this would be to leave the TV switched to the PVR input during standby (i.e. showing a blank screen) and see if the PVR sends a video signal when it does it's spontaneous operation.

By the way, the Vestel PVRs don't have fans so any noise will be coming from the HDD. On the Vestels the HDD switches on only when required for Recording, Playback and a few other short-term tasks such as acessing the Timers List or scheduling recordings in the Guide. The HDD spins down about 2m after it is no longer required. So HDD switching is common during normal operation and I have not seen a significant number of reports of HDD failures to suggest this is a problem.

2. To clarify the non-capture by my TV of the PVR's SCART signal: I have tried both switching on the TV first and then the PVR, and also switching on the PVR (and allowing it to fully run up) before switching on the TV. This latter is to see if the TV will 'search' for a SCART signal on switch-on and only capture it then. Neither sequence has been succesful. As I said before, the TV always captured my previous PVR, and this occurred no matter what sequence of switching was used. I am planning to buy an HDMI cable to link the PVR to the TV. Do you think this will make for automatic connection?

Regards,
David

This is puzzling. I have no experience of HDMI but a quick of Google on "HDMI TV switching" just now revealed a number possible issues with HDMI feeding a TV. Things like some TVs not being switched automatically and other cases where if the SCART output is also connected to the TV this over-rides the HDMI input. So using the HDMI output may confuse the issues further. But as I said I have no experience of HDMI so better I say no more about it

Colin

[DavidF2005]

Colin,
Thanks (and I've just discovered the 'official' Thanks button!) You certainly seem to know your way round these boxes.

I'm not too keen to leave the TV on with blank (ie Blue) screen as it is a Plasma and I believe screen burn is possible.

Some more info which might merely serve to confuse matters more. This afternoon at about 4.30 (my PM R&R being taken a little late today), the unit ran-up spontaneously, but this time the panel showed CHANNEL and 4, which happened to be the channel we recorded latish last night. After a couple of minutes, and showing no sign of running down, I switched on the TV and, sure enough, the current Channel 4 programme was being shown by the PVR. As it was Noel Edmunds, I could only bare to leave it on for another couple of minutes and then shut PVR and the TV down. If it happens again, I shall see if it wants to run for a longer period. The prospect of spontaneous switching on and STAYING on is a bit disturbing. (I've heard the expression 'Deus ex machina' but never really understood what it meant; is this it?)

When I get my HDMI, I expect to diconnect the SCART cable so this should avoid conflict.

David

[creddish]

Originally Posted by DavidF2005

Colin,
Thanks (and I've just discovered the 'official' Thanks button!) You certainly seem to know your way round these boxes.

I'm not too keen to leave the TV on with blank (ie Blue) screen as it is a Plasma and I believe screen burn is possible.

Some more info which might merely serve to confuse matters more. This afternoon at about 4.30 (my PM R&R being taken a little late today), the unit ran-up spontaneously, but this time the panel showed CHANNEL and 4, which happened to be the channel we recorded latish last night. After a couple of minutes, and showing no sign of running down, I switched on the TV and, sure enough, the current Channel 4 programme was being shown by the PVR. As it was Noel Edmunds, I could only bare to leave it on for another couple of minutes and then shut PVR and the TV down. If it happens again, I shall see if it wants to run for a longer period. The prospect of spontaneous switching on and STAYING on is a bit disturbing. (I've heard the expression 'Deus ex machina' but never really understood what it meant; is this it?)

When I get my HDMI, I expect to diconnect the SCART cable so this should avoid conflict.

David

Assuming the unit was in standby initially it does seem at least on that occasion it did switch on fully. However, that does tend to conflict with the earlier situation where it only reached the "STARTING" state before going to standby again. More observation required methinks. Presumably the recording the previous evening was successful and had not been inadvertently set for this afternoon?

Colin

[technogran]

Hmmm, this is not the behaviour of my 250DTRHDMI! My hard drive does 'power up' then power down when the unit is in standby, but I never observe the 'Starting' I only see that as Colin says if the plug has been pulled and the unit is doing a re-boot?? Neither have I ever had the unit 'switch itself on either?? If there is a recording set and the unit is in standby it stays in standby, but you can see that a recording is taking place because the red light comes on and stays on for the duration of the recording.
I don't think Colin that HDMI connections have 'switching' abilities like scarts as I always have to access the HDMI on the tv if I want to watch the Wharfedale. Also be warned that they do not do 'width' switching either (you know where the scart will automatically switch to 14.3 dispay on a widescreen tv)
Of course I could be wrong here, but I am sure that I read that HDMI connections don't do this switching.

TG