HS1 v 12HT

mystex · 07-04-2003, 9:41 PM

I am now in a position to upgrade my LCD projector (HS1). I have just seen the SONY 12HT going for £3000 inc VAT and I was wondering whether there is a vast improvement between the 2. I am not happy with the black levels on the HS1 (I actually avoid watching The Crow,Se7en,etc). The reviews for the 12HT seem stunning, is this a good upgrade route to take or should I really be looking at DLP for the black levels. (I demo'd a SIM200 and wasn't that impressed with it)?

08-04-2003, 1:08 AM

Hi Mystex,

I have seen the HS1 in action as well as the 11HT (but not the 12HT). The 11HT produced a much better picture than the HS1 in many ways:

(1) The chicken wire effect was obvious on the HS1 at a reasonable viewing distance (10 feet), but not on the 11HT at the same distance.

(2) The picture was better on the 11HT, brighter, clearer and more cinematic than the HS1.

(3) The 11HT had better blacks than the HS1, which were immediately obvious.

I saw a SIM200 demonstrated over the weekend. Interestingly, I think that the 11HT had a brighter picture, but arguably the SIM200 was more cinematic. I thought the SIM produced a good picture, but at £6,000 I think it does not represent good value for money. In that respect, I would agree that it's not that impressive.

I haven't seen the 12HT in action, but my educated guess is that it would be much better than the HS1, a little better than the 11HT, and for £3000, much better (in terms of value) than the SIM200.

Cheers,
Ice

08-04-2003, 1:50 PM

I recently upgraded my HS1 to a HS10 - wasn't prepared to stretch to the 12HT and had a narrow escape with a conman on eBay (see "Sinner repents..." thread elsewhere on this forum for details...)

Now, I am informed by others on this forum that the 12HT is superior to the HS10 but even if it is the same let me say quite categorically....

The HS10 blows the HS1 away. I only had my HS1 a few months and the screendoor did my head in - couldn't watch a movie for constantly checking out where the screendoor could be seen or not. On the HS10 it's just not there unless you REALLY REALLY look for it. There is no comparison. Even the missus (unprompted) said the picture quality was a world away from the HS1.

Can't really comment on black levels since I think this topic is somewhat overblown and, besides (lucky me) I will have total light control in my work-in-progress cinema.

In my view if you are upgrading from the HS1 choose the 12HT if you want to (a) spend a few hundred quid more than a HS10 (b) need a short throw PJ (c) don't care about lack of DVI connection. Otherwise choose an HS10.

Either way, upgrading from the HS1 to either of these - you won't be sorry, believe me.

mystex · 08-04-2003, 8:48 PM

Thanks for the replies guys. I now find myself in a position on whether to go for the HS10 or the 12HT! I might go the extra hog for the 12HT based on the reviews of HCC. I shall post again when I recieve my new unit....

thanks again

08-04-2003, 11:21 PM

Hi MrSafety,

I am interested in your views on the HS1 vs. HS10 mainly because I have yet to see the HS10 in action. My educated guess is that the HS10 would be similar to the 11HT (although the HS10 has a DVI interface and sideshot2).

How does the sideshot2 on the HS10 compare with the sideshot on the HS1? So for example, if projecting on an 8 foot diagonal screen, how far to the left or right can you position the HS10? Also, do you get the overspill of excess light in a trapezoidal shape as you do on the HS1?

Cheers,
Ice

09-04-2003, 1:33 PM

Hi Ice

I haven't really played with sideshot on the HS10 since it came with a free screen so I swapped using my HS1 in a bedroom projecting onto a wall from an angle to sitting in my living room with a screen and the PJ centred. However, I get the impression that it doesn't allow as much correction as the HS1 - ie, the HS10 can't be placed as off-centre as the HS1. As I say, I haven't looked into this in any detail but would be happy to compare what the two manuals say if you like to see whether there is a difference.

As for trapezoid overspill - yes, you get this whenever you use Sideshot as an inevitable consequence of the angular correction. I can't comment on the impact using Sideshot has on picture quality - I know others on this forum say it detrimentally affects the PQ and I suppose it does but, with my eyes and my DVD player (on S-video connection) I don't really notice any difference. Hey, I'm not a purist so shoot me! I have a lovely projector which I intend to watch movies on and not endlessly tweak and fiddle with. With the HS1 I couldn't stop looking past the movie and checking for picture imperfections - with the HS10 I just sit down and enjoy!

Happy to answer any more questions on HS1 vs HS10 features

Gavin_Hall · 09-04-2003, 3:38 PM

I have an HS1, I would love to know what the fan noise is like in comparison to the HS10?

I was fortunate enough to be able to borrow a friends Panasonic Ae300 and boy is that quite, it makes my HS1 (which is quite in -33db) seem like Concorde taking off comparison!!!

I have a feeling the HS1 is getting noisier, although can't prove it!! I wonder if the fans get noiser the more you use them?

Just curious as I now have upgrade-itis :-)

Gavin

09-04-2003, 5:49 PM

The HS10 is no quieter than the HS1 and probably a tiny bit louder - or maybe not "louder" as more "whirry" as it were. I run it on "cinema black" mode which is as quiet as it gets as I would say it is comparable with the HS1. At the moment it doesn't bother me - you only hear it in the quiet bits of films and I am sitting right on top of the PJ at the moment in my makeshift cinema - I basically put the PJ on a small table in front of the sofa and my right ear must be no more than 3 feet from the PJ. I would expect it to be less of an issue once installed in its dedicated place in a dedicated room but won't know until I've done it.

I've read a lot about fan noise on this forum and I would say, simply, that it will bother you if you let it. I am harbouring dreams of building either a hushbox or even a mini projector room/partition in my cinema so that I can have it as close to silent as possible but don't whether I will ever get round to it. We'll see. All I would say is that, if the PQ on the HS1 was good enough for me not to have upgraded I would still be considering a hushbox-type solution so - in short - I don't think you should let the fan noise be a decisive factor in your PJ selection.

I'm probably still at the "honeymoon" stage with the HS10 and you might be better off asking others who've lived with theirs longer. For the moment, if I ever have any issue with it (e.g, can't position it where I want it or I notice the fan during a movie) I just remind myself of the picture clarity and lack of screendoor and instantly forget about it.

Gavin_Hall · 09-04-2003, 6:12 PM

Thanks for the comparison. The HS1 doesn't normally bother me when watching a film, however during quiet scenes you can definately hear it, not enough to wind me up, but audible never-the-less. I was simply amazed at how quiet the AE300 was in comparison. I had my head inbetween the AE300 and my HS1, I was about 1ft away from the AE300 and 2 ft away from my HS1 that was ceiling mounted. The HS1 drowned out the AE300 with fan noise! It was definately an ear/eye opener!!

cheers

Gavin

08-04-2003, 1:08 AM	#2
Ice Guest Posts: n/a	Hi Mystex, I have seen the HS1 in action as well as the 11HT (but not the 12HT). The 11HT produced a much better picture than the HS1 in many ways: (1) The chicken wire effect was obvious on the HS1 at a reasonable viewing distance (10 feet), but not on the 11HT at the same distance. (2) The picture was better on the 11HT, brighter, clearer and more cinematic than the HS1. (3) The 11HT had better blacks than the HS1, which were immediately obvious. I saw a SIM200 demonstrated over the weekend. Interestingly, I think that the 11HT had a brighter picture, but arguably the SIM200 was more cinematic. I thought the SIM produced a good picture, but at £6,000 I think it does not represent good value for money. In that respect, I would agree that it's not that impressive. I haven't seen the 12HT in action, but my educated guess is that it would be much better than the HS1, a little better than the 11HT, and for £3000, much better (in terms of value) than the SIM200. Cheers, Ice
	Quote

08-04-2003, 1:50 PM	#3
MrSafety Guest Posts: n/a	I recently upgraded my HS1 to a HS10 - wasn't prepared to stretch to the 12HT and had a narrow escape with a conman on eBay (see "Sinner repents..." thread elsewhere on this forum for details...) Now, I am informed by others on this forum that the 12HT is superior to the HS10 but even if it is the same let me say quite categorically.... The HS10 blows the HS1 away. I only had my HS1 a few months and the screendoor did my head in - couldn't watch a movie for constantly checking out where the screendoor could be seen or not. On the HS10 it's just not there unless you REALLY REALLY look for it. There is no comparison. Even the missus (unprompted) said the picture quality was a world away from the HS1. Can't really comment on black levels since I think this topic is somewhat overblown and, besides (lucky me) I will have total light control in my work-in-progress cinema. In my view if you are upgrading from the HS1 choose the 12HT if you want to (a) spend a few hundred quid more than a HS10 (b) need a short throw PJ (c) don't care about lack of DVI connection. Otherwise choose an HS10. Either way, upgrading from the HS1 to either of these - you won't be sorry, believe me.
	Quote

08-04-2003, 11:21 PM	#5
Ice Guest Posts: n/a	Hi MrSafety, I am interested in your views on the HS1 vs. HS10 mainly because I have yet to see the HS10 in action. My educated guess is that the HS10 would be similar to the 11HT (although the HS10 has a DVI interface and sideshot2). How does the sideshot2 on the HS10 compare with the sideshot on the HS1? So for example, if projecting on an 8 foot diagonal screen, how far to the left or right can you position the HS10? Also, do you get the overspill of excess light in a trapezoidal shape as you do on the HS1? Cheers, Ice
	Quote

09-04-2003, 1:33 PM	#6
MrSafety Guest Posts: n/a	Hi Ice I haven't really played with sideshot on the HS10 since it came with a free screen so I swapped using my HS1 in a bedroom projecting onto a wall from an angle to sitting in my living room with a screen and the PJ centred. However, I get the impression that it doesn't allow as much correction as the HS1 - ie, the HS10 can't be placed as off-centre as the HS1. As I say, I haven't looked into this in any detail but would be happy to compare what the two manuals say if you like to see whether there is a difference. As for trapezoid overspill - yes, you get this whenever you use Sideshot as an inevitable consequence of the angular correction. I can't comment on the impact using Sideshot has on picture quality - I know others on this forum say it detrimentally affects the PQ and I suppose it does but, with my eyes and my DVD player (on S-video connection) I don't really notice any difference. Hey, I'm not a purist so shoot me! I have a lovely projector which I intend to watch movies on and not endlessly tweak and fiddle with. With the HS1 I couldn't stop looking past the movie and checking for picture imperfections - with the HS10 I just sit down and enjoy! Happy to answer any more questions on HS1 vs HS10 features
	Quote

09-04-2003, 5:49 PM	#8
MrSafety Guest Posts: n/a	The HS10 is no quieter than the HS1 and probably a tiny bit louder - or maybe not "louder" as more "whirry" as it were. I run it on "cinema black" mode which is as quiet as it gets as I would say it is comparable with the HS1. At the moment it doesn't bother me - you only hear it in the quiet bits of films and I am sitting right on top of the PJ at the moment in my makeshift cinema - I basically put the PJ on a small table in front of the sofa and my right ear must be no more than 3 feet from the PJ. I would expect it to be less of an issue once installed in its dedicated place in a dedicated room but won't know until I've done it. I've read a lot about fan noise on this forum and I would say, simply, that it will bother you if you let it. I am harbouring dreams of building either a hushbox or even a mini projector room/partition in my cinema so that I can have it as close to silent as possible but don't whether I will ever get round to it. We'll see. All I would say is that, if the PQ on the HS1 was good enough for me not to have upgraded I would still be considering a hushbox-type solution so - in short - I don't think you should let the fan noise be a decisive factor in your PJ selection. I'm probably still at the "honeymoon" stage with the HS10 and you might be better off asking others who've lived with theirs longer. For the moment, if I ever have any issue with it (e.g, can't position it where I want it or I notice the fan during a movie) I just remind myself of the picture clarity and lack of screendoor and instantly forget about it.
	Quote