[la gran siete]

Originally Posted by stanga

The last time I met an Argentinian was in Zaragoza. The first thing he mentioned was the 'Malvinas' and how it belonged to Argentina.

yes of course, some do just as there are people here who think the islands should be as they are.Whats strange about that?

[MikeP1]

I'm pretty sure the last time I checked, people serving in the forces don't get to pick there deployments. The only time deployments have been changed are when there are security risks, which there aren't in the Falklands. Having chosen to serve for our country, we should respect the service he provides.

Whilst his presence anywhere will always have a political edge, I don't see how you can see this as an idea he came up with.

Also, the majority of the comments being made by Argentina are actually aimed at our destroyer deployment.

[Pecker]

The British approach appears to have worked.

The only non-military chance (and subsequently the only chance) to get hold of the Islands is with agreement from the Islanders. This will never happen as long as inflametory rhetoric comes out of Buenos Aires.

So, the British send a destroyer down there, and hey presto!

The Argentinian government are being played like a fiddle.

Steve W

[stanga]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

William Wales ( or whatever his name is) has lost any respect I might have had for him due to his idiotic, inflammatory and provocative visit to the Falklands. If he had waited a couple of years then fine but to do it on the anniversary of the war is thick beyond belief, but then that speaks volumes for the kind of mentality which exists in this country .Laughable when one thinks of Charles comment about "senseless terrorist activities" as if that visit is not a symbolic act of terrorism and celebration of warfare.then again this country is full of willy waving "my guns are bigger than yours and I had an empire" fruitcakes .Sad dorks!

If you object so much to 'the kind of mentality which exists in this country' and regard a visit by a Royal dignitary to sovereign territory as an 'act of terrorism' then I respectfully suggest you book the next flight back to your homeland. I doubt you will ever be happy with your 'countrymen' in this part of the world.

Just saying.

Love it or leave it, comrade, love it or leave it.

[fiveaside]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

William Wales ( or whatever his name is) has lost any respect I might have had for him due to his idiotic, inflammatory and provocative visit to the Falklands. If he had waited a couple of years then fine but to do it on the anniversary of the war is thick beyond belief, but then that speaks volumes for the kind of mentality which exists in this country .Laughable when one thinks of Charles comment about "senseless terrorist activities" as if that visit is not a symbolic act of terrorism and celebration of warfare.then again this country is full of willy waving "my guns are bigger than yours and I had an empire" fruitcakes .Sad dorks!

He's just following orders, don't take it personal. How can he be celebrating warfare? Sounds to me like someone has put something in your fruitcake! And by the way I don't mean to agitate you, you silly little man but let's not forget Argentina invaded the Falkands not the other way around.

[Sonic67]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

William Wales ( or whatever his name is) has lost any respect I might have had for him due to his idiotic, inflammatory and provocative visit to the Falklands.

He will be doing air sea rescue as part of his job. It's not a state visit. Do you ever follow the news?

[la gran siete]

Originally Posted by stanga

If you object so much to 'the kind of mentality which exists in this country' and regard a visit by a Royal dignitary to sovereign territory as an 'act of terrorism' then I respectfully suggest you book the next flight back to your homeland. I doubt you will ever be happy with your 'countrymen' in this part of the world.

Just saying.

Love it or leave it, comrade, love it or leave it.

I feel it my duty to remind people that such visits at such times by those what you call dignitaries(ridiculous term given there is nothing dignified about the visit) are inappropriate for the reasons given.Unfortunately oafs are aplenty in the UK. ie people who conveniently brush aside the sentiments of others on the alter of self righteousness

[lucasisking]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

William Wales ( or whatever his name is) has lost any respect I might have had for him due to his idiotic, inflammatory and provocative visit to the Falklands. If he had waited a couple of years then fine but to do it on the anniversary of the war is thick beyond belief, but then that speaks volumes for the kind of mentality which exists in this country .Laughable when one thinks of Charles comment about "senseless terrorist activities" as if that visit is not a symbolic act of terrorism and celebration of warfare.then again this country is full of willy waving "my guns are bigger than yours and I had an empire" fruitcakes .Sad dorks!

How can it be 'inflammatory' and 'provocative' for British subjects to visit British territories?

It's would be like calling a US President 'inflammatory' towards the British by visiting the State of Virginia on the 4th July.

Let them be inflamed and provoked.

[fiveaside]

You really are an idiot of a man!

[Pecker]

Originally Posted by lucasisking

How can it be 'inflammatory' and 'provocative' for British subjects to visit British territories?

It's would be like calling a US President 'inflammatory' towards the British by visiting the State of Virginia on the 4th July.

Let them be inflamed and provoked.

If only international politics were that simple.

I doubt there are too many people here who genuinely believe that Wild Bill's name just happened to come out of the hat as it being his turn to go down south.

Now of course, it's entirely a matter for the British government to send who it sends to wherever it wants to send them, and as I've said I think the British government have played a blinder here, and the Argentinian government have been suckered into inflametory rhetoric which does them no good.

But it's pretty naive to think his stationing is pure coincidence.

Steve W

[stanga]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

.Unfortunately oafs are aplenty in the UK. ie people who conveniently brush aside the sentiments of others on the alter of self righteousness

A more ironic statement has never been made. That's precisely your stance on the 'sentiments' of the Falkland Islanders!

[Pecker]

Originally Posted by fiveaside

You really are an idiot of a man!

fiveaside, I'm not sure posts like this add anything to the debate.

I think these forums are a great example of everything that's great about our democratic system, our way of life, and why the Falkland islanders want to stay British.

But hopefully that means respectfully, intelligently and articulately arguing our point of view against those with whom we disagree, rather than just hurling abuse.

LGS gets a lot of stick here. I disagree with him on his stance of the Falklands, but I feel able to express my opinions with (I hope) a little intelligent argument. I also respect the fact that he knows virtually everyone disagrees with him, and still posts anyway.

I think if these threads on the Falklands were just back-slapping, jingoistic, flag-waving hyperbole, without any of us having any understanding of how Argentina thinks on these matters, the forums would be a more impoverished place.

I disagree with LGS, but my understanding of the situation is broadened by hearing how the other side think, and long may it continue.

Steve W

[blackrod]

Put your fishing Rod away LGS, it is getting tiresome now...

[Trollslayer]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

I feel it my duty to remind people that such visits at such times by those what you call dignitaries(ridiculous term given there is nothing dignified about the visit) are inappropriate for the reasons given.Unfortunately oafs are aplenty in the UK. ie people who conveniently brush aside the sentiments of others on the alter of self righteousness

Funny you should mention that.
Now go back to Argentina and get conscripted.

[la gran siete]

Originally Posted by Sonic67

He will be doing air sea rescue as part of his job. It's not a state visit. Do you ever follow the news?

no doubt he'll be dropping round to "celebrate" the victory with the locals otherwise why do it this year.Have you no common sense?

[JustinJ004]

Originally Posted by Pecker

fiveaside, I'm not sure posts like this add anything to the debate.

I think these forums are a great example of everything that's great about our democratic system, our way of life, and why the Falkland islanders want to stay British.

But hopefully that means respectfully, intelligently and articulately arguing our point of view against those with whom we disagree, rather than just hurling abuse.

LGS gets a lot of stick here. I disagree with him on his stance of the Falklands, but I feel able to express my opinions with (I hope) a little intelligent argument. I also respect the fact that he knows virtually everyone disagrees with him, and still posts anyway.

I think if these threads on the Falklands were just back-slapping, jingoistic, flag-waving hyperbole, without any of us having any understanding of how Argentina thinks on these matters, the forums would be a more impoverished place.

I disagree with LGS, but my understanding of the situation is broadened by hearing how the other side think, and long may it continue.

Steve W

I understand your point Steve but to be fair LGS gets away with insulting people all the time!

On this very page he calls people dorks and oafs for having a different viewpoint for example.

I don't honestly understand how he gets away with it to be honest but there you go.

Back on topic it sounds to me like Argentina are just stamping their feet and throwing their toys out like a spoiled child and nothing will come from any off this except maybe a few people laughing at them.

[lucasisking]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

no doubt he'll be dropping round to "celebrate" the victory with the locals otherwise why do it this year.Have you no common sense?

Will anybody in Argentina see these 'celebrations'? Can the Falklands be seen from the mainland? Will ordinary Argentinians see the flags, ships and helicopters?

The only exposure they will have to the Royal visit will be via their own (probably biased) media, which is none of our concern.

[jay mc]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

I feel it my duty to remind people that such visits at such times by those what you call dignitaries(ridiculous term given there is nothing dignified about the visit) are inappropriate for the reasons given.Unfortunately oafs are aplenty in the UK. ie people who conveniently brush aside the sentiments of others on the alter of self righteousness

Do you ever stop to really think about what your saying lgs?
So theres nothing dignified about a air sea rescue unit having a good pilot doing his duty as part of the raf?
And the last bit, wow the hypocisy is comedy gold!!!
So when you moving to argentine? you remind me of those imigrants over here who rant and rave about protecting there lands while living some where that allows them the freedom of speech they would not get if they where back home and they certently would be as well off either..

[NewMan]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

.Unfortunately oafs are aplenty in Argentina. ie people who conveniently brush aside the sentiments of Falkland Islanders on the alter of self righteousness

Fixed that for you.

[IronGiant]

Originally Posted by justinj004

back on topic it sounds to me like las tres casas are just stamping their feet and throwing their toys out like a spoiled child and nothing will come from any off this except maybe a few people laughing at them.

ftfy

[NewMan]

Originally Posted by IronGiant

ftfy

Las tres casas...

It took me a minute to spot the "fix", but masterfully done.

[Pecker]

Originally Posted by JustinJ004

I understand your point Steve...

Thanks for that.

Originally Posted by JustinJ004

...but to be fair LGS gets away with insulting people all the time! On this very page he calls people dorks and oafs for having a different viewpoint for example.

Well, that being the case, I think the rules or civility should be applied equally.

Originally Posted by JustinJ004

Back on topic it sounds to me like Argentina are just stamping their feet and throwing their toys out like a spoiled child and nothing will come from any off this except maybe a few people laughing at them.

I think we're forgetting that Argentina is a democracy and that most people there support the claim, and subsequently like the rhetoric.

What's being gained is extra brownie points for the current Argentine government when it comes to election time.

Frankly, if I were Argentinian PM, I'd be doing the same.

Steve W

[mitchec1]

Aren't Argentina and their senior foreign official LGS forgetting a couple of things

Article 1.2 of the UN charter covering respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples.

There's has been no United Nations General Assembly Resolution calling for talks since 1988


I'm a little confused by isn't this exactly what the Falkland Islanders are saying that little "We want to be British"

Ah yes Falkland Islanders talking to Special Committee of 24 (Special Committee on Decolonization)

They asked the Committee to recognise that self-determination is a universal human right, and respect for this principle is enshrined in the UN Charter as one of purposes this Organisation. They made clear they, like any other people, are entitled to exercise the right of self-determination. They reiterated the historical facts that the Falkland Islands had no indigenous people and that no civilian population was removed prior to their people settling on the Islands over 178 years ago. They confirmed that they are and have been the only people of the Falkland Islands, and they did not wish for any change in the status of the Islands. They lamented the measures adopted by the Republic of Argentina that unlawfully aim to limit both their transport links and their access to open and free trade.

http://www.un.org/en/ga/president/66...ber%202011.pdf

[Sonic67]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

no doubt he'll be dropping round to "celebrate" the victory with the locals otherwise why do it this year.Have you no common sense?

Hasn't air sea rescue been privatised in the UK now? Where else can he go?

It's not even provocative. The first guy he fishes out the water could even be Argentinian. His job entails saving lives.

Besides why should Argentina dictate where our armed forces post its serving troops?

Don't you know what air sea rescue entails?

[BISHI]

Originally Posted by la gran siete

William Wales ( or whatever his name is) has lost any respect I might have had for him due to his idiotic, inflammatory and provocative visit to the Falklands. If he had waited a couple of years then fine but to do it on the anniversary of the war is thick beyond belief, but then that speaks volumes for the kind of mentality which exists in this country .Laughable when one thinks of Charles comment about "senseless terrorist activities" as if that visit is not a symbolic act of terrorism and celebration of warfare.then again this country is full of willy waving "my guns are bigger than yours and I had an empire" fruitcakes .Sad dorks!

Hmmm, don't forget that William doesn't get to choose his postings, that his uncle was deployed there on the front line 30 years ago. that Argentina is the product of an empire and has fought for and secured slices of its neighbours over the year, that 'willy waving' led the then Junta to invade what was not theirs. Do you not think that recent Argentinian actions are not more provocative..? I don't see you criticising their decisions regarding airspace or port access.

The British have just responded with quiet reserved confidence - 'do your worst but don't even think about trying what you did 30 years ago, we'll be ready this time.............and we're so confident we are putting very important royalty down there..'

Thats a pretty reasoned and reasonable response to Argentinas 'willy waving.'
They just need to realise how much better endowed we are..

[mrtbag]

Originally Posted by BISHI

Thats a pretty reasoned and reasonable response to Argentinas 'willy waving.' They just need to realise how much better endowed we are..

Bishi, love it!!

[mrtbag]

Here's an intersting take on UN resolutions reagrding the subject:

Argentina tell the world that Britain is refusing to comply UN Resolutions and says Britain has to negotiate.

This is, of course, a complete lie.

General Assembly Resolutions must be recognized, but aren’t mandatory. They are there to advise the subjects of the Members wishes and views.

Security Council Resolutions are obligatory, in that refusal to comply is an offence. Or should be. Recent SC Resolutions concerning Iraq and North Korea suggest otherwise.

Argentina refused to comply with SC Resolution 502 in April, 1982.

Argentina’s current claim is that Britain should follow GA Resolution 2065 which recognises a dispute over sovereignty between the UK and Argentina and calls for talks.

Resolution 2065 dates back to 1965, as a direct consequence of it, both sides sat down in an attempt to resolve their differences. Needless to say, talks were protracted and didn’t go in the direction that Argentina wished.

The same can be said of Resolution 31/49 (1976), and for the same reason.
Then there were the UN GA Resolutions produced between 1982 and 1988.
37/9 (1982) calls for negotiations over sovereignty, as does 38/12 (1983) and 39/06 (1984). Resolution 40/21 (1985) superseded these by calling for negotiations to solve the problems existing between the two countries, including the Falklands, which seemed now to take a secondary position. No mention of sovereignty in that one. Nor was there any mention of a sovereignty dispute in 41/40 (1986) or 42/19 (1987).

The last UN GA Resolution was 43/25 (1988) which called, as had the two before it, on both sides; “ to initiate negotiations with a view to finding the means to resolve peacefully and definitively the problems pending between both countries, including all aspects on the future of the Falkland Islands (Malvinas), in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations;” Both sides sat down, talked for the first time in years and reached some agreements.

The United Nations was so happy that there hasn’t been another GA Resolution since.

So Argentina tells the world lies. Britain is not in breach of any UN GA Resolution concerning the sovereignty of the Falkland Islands.

There is another type of UN Resolution however; one which goes to the core of the UN itself; one that emanates from the Charter; one that cannot die.

One example is 1514 (1960) which talks about all peoples having a right to determine their own future; another example is 1515 (1960) which states that such peoples have the right to exploit their own resources, as does 1803 (1962).

Argentina shot itself in the foot when it invaded. That act not only killed a lot of good men, it killed off a few Resolutions too.

The last effective Resolution on the subject was 1988. Britain complied with it, Argentina didn’t.

Maybe the UN just doesn't care about the whole subject anymore, as the islanders are happy, and that is what their Charter protects.

[Sonic67]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16864926

[Alan CD]

Originally Posted by Pecker

The British approach appears to have worked.

The only non-military chance (and subsequently the only chance) to get hold of the Islands is with agreement from the Islanders. This will never happen as long as inflametory rhetoric comes out of Buenos Aires.

So, the British send a destroyer down there, and hey presto!

The Argentinian government are being played like a fiddle.

Steve W

Agree with that, when you see a bubble - prick it! Or at least have a stab, clever move by the UK government.

Am I allowed to say p-r-i-c-k on the forum?

[IronGiant]

As a verb, yes