[Stuart Wright]

AVForums Home Cinema Podcast : 14th August 2007
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Time. 01:21:01 Size: 74.1MB

In this months edition:

00:50 Discussion of the AVForums HD poll
11:35 AV News
34:00 Roundtable discussion : buying an HD display - what to look for

Please reply to this thread with your feedback.

[Adam_uk]

I find it very odd that Pioneers move to 'high end' is lauded as a success when there last set on financial results were shocking.

Revenue and profits were both down. How has this been a success? The next three months will be very telling for Pioneer, anyother fall in profits, I imagine, will see a rather swift change. A proper Brand shift takes around ten years! Not sending a bunch jurno's to Rome.

Also the 'get what you pay for' discussion- why is no comment made on pioneers dual continent pricing? The price discussion on the forums are not around the sets are expensive, its that they are twice as much in Europe than the US. Spare us the fact Pioneer are making no margin on these sets, of course they are making juicy margins on the sets in Europe.

While I always find the podcast very informative and interesting, at times I do feel the pannel are rather snobbish to the 'mass market' which they seem to equate to people who live in Moss Side.

Yes the pannel are experts in their field and its a good thing they do these to inform people and share news- but I do think the tone of these need to be watched as they in danger of becoming a bit elitist.

I know this appears a bit negative- but its just my opinion.

[Adam_uk]

That said- the how to pick a flat screen section was very good and well explained in non jargon.

[Tony Lazzerini]

Originally Posted by Adam_uk

I find it very odd that Pioneers move to 'high end' is lauded as a success when there last set on financial results were shocking.

Revenue and profits were both down. How has this been a success? The next three months will be very telling for Pioneer, anyother fall in profits, I imagine, will see a rather swift change. A proper Brand shift takes around ten years! Not sending a bunch jurno's to Rome.

Also the 'get what you pay for' discussion- why is no comment made on pioneers dual continent pricing? The price discussion on the forums are not around the sets are expensive, its that they are twice as much in Europe than the US. Spare us the fact Pioneer are making no margin on these sets, of course they are making juicy margins on the sets in Europe.

While I always find the podcast very informative and interesting, at times I do feel the pannel are rather snobbish to the 'mass market' which they seem to equate to people who live in Moss Side.

Yes the pannel are experts in their field and its a good thing they do these to inform people and share news- but I do think the tone of these need to be watched as they in danger of becoming a bit elitist.

I know this appears a bit negative- but its just my opinion.

It's easy to see why Pioneer is trying to move up-market. They have found that they can't compete on price with Matsushita because they can't get the volume high enough. So instead they are going for a much higher price and less volume. Luckily they have a set that let's them try this!

What is interesting is that whilst Europe is going down this line Pioneer US seem to be going the opposite way. Maybe Pioneer is trying to back two horses at once!

I can't believe that any manufacturer can do that, so we'll have to wait a while to see what happens. Will US prices go up (hard to believe) or UK prices come down? We'll see!

Tony

[Renoir]

Any chance of an ETA on those disount codes for the HQV discs Phil?

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Adam_uk

I find it very odd that Pioneers move to 'high end' is lauded as a success when there last set on financial results were shocking.

Revenue and profits were both down. How has this been a success? The next three months will be very telling for Pioneer, anyother fall in profits, I imagine, will see a rather swift change. A proper Brand shift takes around ten years! Not sending a bunch jurno's to Rome.

Also the 'get what you pay for' discussion- why is no comment made on pioneers dual continent pricing? The price discussion on the forums are not around the sets are expensive, its that they are twice as much in Europe than the US. Spare us the fact Pioneer are making no margin on these sets, of course they are making juicy margins on the sets in Europe.

While I always find the podcast very informative and interesting, at times I do feel the pannel are rather snobbish to the 'mass market' which they seem to equate to people who live in Moss Side.

Yes the pannel are experts in their field and its a good thing they do these to inform people and share news- but I do think the tone of these need to be watched as they in danger of becoming a bit elitist.

I know this appears a bit negative- but its just my opinion.

Ok couple of points, we agreed that Pioneer had taken the correct step with their rebranding as a high end manufacturer; I don't believe anyone said it was a success. However it was obvious to us that the company couldn't have continued to try and sell at the volume end of the market, as they cannot produce the volume at such low prices.

The product is highly spec'd and performs well and it costs the money it does because of the high end parts it uses, I believe Neil also mentioned Fujitsu in the same vein.
Now what Pioneer US does is not really valid to our discussion as we live in Europe and we do not buy sets aimed at the US market. Another thing is that the States have a completely different economy of scale in terms of how that market works, the numbers likely to be sold and the maturity of the market place. Plus you have the fact that the US have a different standard of living based on wages against market forces, once you take this on board you can then see how Pioneer can charge what appears to be less on the same product in the US market. But if you are being paid $20,000 a year salary in the US (national average) it suddenly doesn't seem as cheap. At the same time the US market is huge compared to Europe so prices will be lower due to the sheer number of projected sales in such a large market.

The European market on the other hand has a number of countries each with their own economic factors and the majority with a higher standard of living than the UK, you ever visited Sweden? The scale of sales is also far less in Europe than the US because the market is still young for HC equipment and acceptance.

Hope that clears up where we are coming from. There is no elitism on the Podcast, we are here to provide talking points, answer questions and offer guidance from our experience of the industry. The mass market is not the sole property of a housing estate in Manchester either!

[Adam_uk]

Sorry- that is clearly not true- the average national wage is well above $20000. Mean income per capita is around $25 000 and median earnings for the over 25's is around $40 000- which is on par with the average salary in the UK (which is high for Europe), so your point on Pioneers pricing is off the mark.

As Tony says they have a clear dual strategy for Europe and the US- which I dont think they can maintain.

Also, I never said you nor the pannel were elitist, simply the way you all talk at times it comes across that you derided the 'mass market'. Yes you do inform and give great information- but your tone and choice of language is, in my opinion, at times boardering on snobbery/ elitism.

Anyway- I dont really want to have a debate about this- I was simply giving my opinion, take the feedback on board or ignore it- its your call.

[Raitzi]

On LCD vs Plasma you prefered plasma, but would you play video games on plasma?

Don't give me theoretical, just your opinion

Some people say it is fine to play games on plasma, but others say it causes burn-in(or IR at least).

Thanks for good podcast!

PS: Those new Kuros look nice and pana has also new(750z)1080p plasma with 24p coming.

[Phil Hinton]

I have the Pioneer 508XD here at the moment and have been playing video games on the PS3 with no problems whatsoever. Obviously my screen is properly calibrated which helps stop screen burn, plus I don't leave static images sitting on screen for hours while I go away and do other things. If you don't have a screen properly calibrated then yes you MIGHT get screen burn if you have the settings too high and you leave a static image on screen for hours, otherwise there is nothing to worry about.

[dazzler]

Originally Posted by Renoir

Any chance of an ETA on those disount codes for the HQV discs Phil?

I second that

[jwramsay]

A very good podcast indeed.

Having both a Pioneer 436 Plasma and a Tevion 32" LCD (Aldi job), the "you get what you pay for" statement is right on the money.

The deinterlacing of the Tevion is frankly shocking.

Hi,

I found the calibration part very interesting.

Can you provide the link and the vouchers for the disc patterns.

Also is the HD poll still active, I can't find it.

Cheers

[meltonboy]

As ever, both interesting and imformative.

I was interested in the new THX standard discussed, where some quiet sounds are increased in volume. I have often thought that although there is obviously a big volume difference in real life between an explosion and someone talking, having this accurate volume difference is highly annoying in home cinema (especially to those of us in blocks of flats).

I think that i posted before, but i recently watched "walk the line" and had to constantly mess with the volume as i would turn it up for the dialogue, but then the 'live' concerts would blow my ear drums.

Can someone tell me (a) what this standard is called and (b) if any other AV receiver offers something similar but perhaps with a different name ?

Cheers

MB

[redford]

hi, interesting discussion in aug. pod.

may i suggest topic?

fujitsu make great pdp/tv

in your panels experience re use for 1080p and 720p, the higher res alis panels look great to me
i view at 9 feet at home. some debate over the interlacing of vertical channels of phosphers/pixels. i have seen yamaha and hitachi sets with alis panels. probably they are all well implemented with excellent driver/video
electronics/ before i spend a not inconsiderable sum, any disadvantages?

[redford]

hi, u did not mention aufio quality when choosing.

hard to do in ashop. a home dem by specialist dealer is best all round imo.

[Stuart Wright]

Originally Posted by johnwaz

Also is the HD poll still active, I can't find it.

It's in the Official Polls forum right down the bottom of the forum list.

[Renoir]

Hate to be a pain but any chance of a reply to my earlier question as regards the availability of HQV benchmark discount codes. Plan to buy the discs but wondering whether it's worth holding off?

[angryht]

I found some dicount codes here There are some other places with codes and I am not sure why your request has not been answered. I would think that the avforums would get some kind of credit for using their codes, maybe they are too busy. Anyway, hope this helps.