Difference between 24p Real Cinema AND 24p playback

SPiET · 12-09-2008, 2:38 PM

just wondering whats the REAL difference between

- 24p real cinema (found on the TH-46PZ85)

and

- 24p playback (found on the TH-46PZ80)

is there any difference ?
because both models don't have both features.

thanks.

urbanshepherd · 12-09-2008, 5:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPiET

just wondering whats the REAL difference between

- 24p real cinema (found on the TH-46PZ85)

and

- 24p playback (found on the TH-46PZ80)

is there any difference ?
because both models don't have both features.

thanks.

24p real cinema ties in with the Intelligent Frame Creation. The 'standard' that most people look for is 24p playback (on pz80 & 85 & 81).

real cinema is more marketing to tie in with the IFC.

DanDT · 12-09-2008, 5:45 PM

Yes 24p real cinema is Panasonic's way to put IFC in 24p feeds, which i think defeats the point of having 24p as it makes it look like video...
24p playback is what everyone else does, simple 24p playback to remove judder on bluray movies.

MINANTRA · 12-09-2008, 6:14 PM

24p playback is also on the PX.

Cheers.

rewerb · 12-09-2008, 9:14 PM

From the Panasonic web site..
http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_G...#anker_1404724

SPiET · 13-09-2008, 7:01 AM

Thanks

but is it possible that the 24p real cinema found on the 85 (not the 80) is ONLY activated when you enable IFC ??

This would mean that when IFC is set to off, 24p real cinema is also set to off?

According to the specifics the 85 doesn't have 24p playback, only 24p real cinema. So when its set to OFF you don't have any 24p playback or am i wrong?

85 - ONLY real cinema (activated when enabling IFC?), not 24p playback

80 - ONLY 24p playback , not real cinema

?

rewerb · 13-09-2008, 9:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPiET

Thanks

but is it possible that the 24p real cinema found on the 85 (not the 80) is ONLY activated when you enable IFC ??

This would mean that when IFC is set to off, 24p real cinema is also set to off?

According to the specifics the 85 doesn't have 24p playback, only 24p real cinema. So when its set to OFF you don't have any 24p playback or am i wrong?

85 - ONLY real cinema (activated when enabling IFC?), not 24p playback

80 - ONLY 24p playback , not real cinema

?

All latest Vieras have 24p playback. In addition, the PZ85 (and PZ800/81) have real cinema, which is enabled with IFC on.

SPiET · 13-09-2008, 9:39 AM

Hi Rewerb,

thanks for letting me know.

i read that the advantage of IFC is only with SD content ... sd digital tv, sd dvds etc but not with HD material (ps3, bluray, etc) and not with sports.

Is that correct that its best to turn on IFC only with SD content (no sports)?

m4morris · 26-09-2008, 1:22 PM

So is 24p turned on by default? I have the PZ80. Do I need to activate it?

rewerb · 26-09-2008, 2:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m4morris

So is 24p turned on by default? I have the PZ80. Do I need to activate it?

No, TV automatically detects whether input is 24p or 50Hz or 60Hz.... and processes accordingly.

ro53ben · 01-12-2008, 1:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPiET

Hi Rewerb,

thanks for letting me know.

i read that the advantage of IFC is only with SD content ... sd digital tv, sd dvds etc but not with HD material (ps3, bluray, etc) and not with sports.

Is that correct that its best to turn on IFC only with SD content (no sports)?

I have a PZ85 with IFC.

I use IFC when watching F1, olympic swimming, olympic cycling, playing on my Wii and on other high speed stuff. It works well.

For other "studio" stuff, I ensure it's off as I don't like the effect it creates - truly horrible for movies. But I am grateful to have it on those specific sources.

Mr Grumpy · 01-12-2008, 1:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPiET

Hi Rewerb,

thanks for letting me know.

i read that the advantage of IFC is only with SD content ... sd digital tv, sd dvds etc but not with HD material (ps3, bluray, etc) and not with sports.

Is that correct that its best to turn on IFC only with SD content (no sports)?

Exactly the opposite in fact.
IFC is meant for HD only and out of sheer curiosity I tested it with SD DVDs and the effect produced was almost as if the tv simply could not cope with having to upscale AND run IFC.

ro53ben · 01-12-2008, 1:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Grumpy

IFC is meant for HD only

I disagree.

IFC can be enabled/disabled on a per input basis. Many of the inputs don't even support an HD source yet IFC is still available as an option. If it wasn't meant to be used, they would remove that option in the settings.

Obviously "24p Real Cinema" only really applies to HD sources, but IFC can be used for any input as desired.

pugheaven · 01-12-2008, 1:46 PM

Am I being daft here... I have the TH58PZ800, and I have IFC turned off... and have my HD-DVD player set to 1080/24P, so will I be seeing/ running my HD-DVD's at 24fps? i.e. as it should be? I've not had one single camera judder on any panning shots... so I'm assuming I am

ro53ben · 01-12-2008, 1:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pugheaven

Am I being daft here... I have the TH58PZ800, and I have IFC turned off... and have my HD-DVD player set to 1080/24P, so will I be seeing/ running my HD-DVD's at 24fps? i.e. as it should be? I've not had one single camera judder on any panning shots... so I'm assuming I am

You will be seeing the movie exactly as the director intended. If there is any flicker, it's on the 24fps source too.

If you're used to high frame-rate video from games or broadcast TV, then 24fps WILL flicker a little by comparison...you can even see it at the cinema with an experienced eye.

Judder and flicker are entirely different though. A 'normal' UK TV will run at 25fps, the HD movie will be sourced at 24fps. There's a missing frame when showing the 24fps on a 25fps TV and this can cause the judder effect people describe that should not be apparent if you get a 24fps compatible TV.

pugheaven · 01-12-2008, 1:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ro53ben

You will be seeing the movie exactly as the director intended. If there is any flicker, it's on the 24fps source too.

If you're used to high frame-rate video from games or broadcast TV, then 24fps WILL flicker a little by comparison...you can even see it at the cinema with an experienced eye.

Judder and flicker are entirely different though. A 'normal' UK TV will run at 25fps, the HD movie will be sourced at 24fps. There's a missing frame when showing the 24fps on a 25fps TV and this can cause the judder effect people describe that should not be apparent if you get a 24fps compatible TV.

Cheers fella, much appreciated, thought that was the case, but then thought, maybe I have to have this option turned on and I missed something

. Nice one.

Now to get back to enjoying this TV... and have to say it's fantastic!

HeadBanger · 01-12-2008, 2:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pugheaven

Am I being daft here... I have the TH58PZ800, and I have IFC turned off... and have my HD-DVD player set to 1080/24P, so will I be seeing/ running my HD-DVD's at 24fps? i.e. as it should be? I've not had one single camera judder on any panning shots... so I'm assuming I am

Pug - this is fine. If your Blu-Ray is set to output 24p then that is what you'll be watching. IFC is an additional feature and works with or without a 24p source and with either an SD or HD (24p or otherwise) picture.

ro53ben · 01-12-2008, 2:13 PM

The easiest way to understand IFC is to think of a stroboscobe (strobe light) in a night club.

When it's flashing at certain rates, people on the dance floor will have the impression of moving around in a jerky fashion. People moving quickly will move a long way between flashes. The faster the flashing, the smoother their movement will be.

An PAL SD TV source is going to have a shutter rate of 25fps which is ok, but not exceptionally smooth when compared to computer games that can run at hundreds of frames per second. To add to this, most screens now run at 100Hz - updated 4 times more often than the source on a PAL signal.

A 100Hz screen is able to be considerably smoother than a PAL source, so what IFC does is attempt to guess how the frame is going to change between the previous frame and the next.

If you watch Lewis Hamilton flying along the straight at 200mph, you may find that his movement isn't entirely smooth as his car travel such a distance between frames it appears to jump from one frame to the next. With IFC enabled, the TV will insert a false image in-between the 2 real ones which clearly makes the movement smoother. As the eye can follow it easier, things like advertising banners etc. are all easier to read....without IFC they can be a bit blurred.

It's not a perfect technology though and on many sources I believe it looks worse. It's just a case of turning it off/on as required.

loser40 · 03-01-2009, 7:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadBanger

Pug - this is fine. If your Blu-Ray is set to output 24p then that is what you'll be watching. IFC is an additional feature and works with or without a 24p source and with either an SD or HD (24p or otherwise) picture.

So, does this mean if your TV is not 24fps compatible but your DVD/BluRay player is, you can watch 24fps on a non 24fps TV just as long as the player is 24fps enabled ?

M.

choddo2006 · 03-01-2009, 10:24 PM

No. It just means that IFC can work on a 50 or 60Hz signal. It'll still have 3:2 pulldown judder of some type even with IFC on, if it's bluray or Region1 DVD.

Tenaciouscdsm · 30-04-2009, 3:38 PM

sorry i know this is a slightly old topic but ive re read all the posts numerous times and still cant seem to figure out is there any difference between 24p playback and 24p real cinema?

is there any benefit what so ever to having 24p real cinema?