[messenger]

Well I guess we could all see it coming, but in an article I just read about Microsoft wanting to raise the subscription price of Xbox live I came across this distressing news;


Michael Pachter, the internet's favorite gaming soothsayer, turned up on GameTrailer's Bonus Round once again this week. What did the Wedbush Morgan analyst see in his crystal ball this time around? Not only did he declare that Microsoft has given up on PC gaming, but he also predicted that the price of Xbox Live Gold subscriptions will be going up sometime in the future.
"It's a profit deal," Pachter claimed, responding to a fan question about the dearth of ports from Xbox 360 to PC. "Microsoft wants you to never play a game again on your PC and play everything on your 360," he went on to suggest, adding, "You give a PC gamer an incentive to buy a 360 if you put something that he really wants only on the 360."

But why would Microsoft want to lure customers away from one of their own platforms? Pachter made his case:

"You can't hook a guy into Xbox Live Gold if he's playing on PC. So, I mean, that's the other problem is you really wanna hook every gamer who has a 360, you want them to buy all their games on 360, play everything multiplayer, pay you 50 bucks a year so that in a couple years, it's 100 bucks a year. And that's going up -- we all know that."
It might sound crazy to actually raise the price of Xbox Live, especially when neither of Microsoft's competitors are currently charging for online play. Then again, Microsoft has attempted to add value to Gold memberships for years now by piling on exclusive features like Netflix streaming and, any day now, Facebook integration -- perhaps in anticipation of a price hike further down the line?


Full story here: Microsoft to Raise Xbox Live Subscription Fee, Says Pacther

Perhaps it's gossip, lets hope so eh....

[Jay]

Pc gaming really does look like it's finally dying.

It'll take a few years yet to really take effect but either way the future of pc gaming isn't bright

[eiren]

He's talking out of his bottom.

Microsoft are relying heavily on DX11 and Windows 7 to take off in the gaming community.

He also sounds like he's never heard of Games For Windows Live

[Houghsx]

Why would I want to go from a Ferrari to a Skoda??

[Sinzer]

I am sorry but anyone who believes this tosh need to really inform themselves.

It really gets my goat when people say that PC Gaming is dieing. It has the largest number of players of any system.

What people have to realise is that not everyone just plays the latest Halo.

For instance, I play Heroes of Newerth (a lot!), I would guess that 95% of "games players" would not have even heard of this game. On a Sunday evening, peak EU time, there are 30,000 concurrent players on the servers (out of 300,000 active subscriptions). To me that is a far from a dead community. (It is not MMORPG, but a cross between WC3 and Diablo).

World of Warcraft sees figures ten times higher and has generated more revenue per year than the entire X360 market, hardware and software combined over 3 years.

Microsoft would prefer to see people console gaming as that is higher revenue for them due to software licencing. However, PC gaming is far from dead, most PC gamers don't play mainstream console tat all the time, there are lots of niche games and genres that the consoles won't see until a few more years.

It makes sense to have a PC and Console, if you are really hankering after Halo 10 or FIFA 120. However, PC Gaming has a lot more to offer and if you are a serious competitive gamer then it is the only platform that can offer that. The only game I have felt competitive in on a console was SFIV.

We will see how much PC gaming is dieing when Starcraft II is released, don't forget that the original Starcraft currently has one of the highest paid professional circuits in gaming and in asia even has whole TV channels devoted to it.

I dunno it is just a personal pet hate of mine PC gaming is not mainstream. I have always gamed on a PC and know that if I want to play console type games I buy a console. A console will not replace the PC markets.

Lets face it, the PC has survived at least 4 generations of consoles, I can't see it dieing this round.

This makes more interesting reading :

Who is Michael Pachter! (minus the swearing!)

NOTE : You have to replace the **** in the URL with the F word, the rest of the URL is clean, just a dodgy title


The best part of this is the contradiction that according to Pachter, there will not be a next gen of consoles, then combine this with PC gaming being dead. I can only assume that he has seen the apocalypse and there will be no more people, let alone computer games in 4 years.

[Sniper Ash6]

I dont at all believe that MS will give up on the PC gaming market due to the sheer size of it

They are very quick and happy to push DX11 and Games for Windows has done well - no need to ditch them

[SHARKuk]

So they have decided to stop making PC games because they cannot squeeze any more cash out of us. They want all the PC gamers to play there games on an unreliable box of junk that they will have more times than you to "repair it".

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Sinzer

The best part of this is the contradiction that according to Pachter, there will not be a next gen of consoles, then combine this with PC gaming being dead. I can only assume that he has seen the apocalypse and there will be no more people, let alone computer games in 4 years.

I think by that he means like others who wrongly say that there won't be a next gen console for some time as opposed to no more consoles ever.

As usual sinzer you make some very good points.

But surely you can see that in the mainstream pc gaming isn't what it once used to be.

And yes world of warcraft is a big revenue earner with loads of subcriptions etc but one game alone isn't really convincing me that pc gaming isn't dying.

Yes consoles are lower powered etc etc but the fact is these mainstream games make big bucks and the pc slowly losing out is not a good thing.

EDIT: Actually dying is the wrong word, and to be fair I'm sure every year there's talk of pc gaming dying, I don't think it'll ever die, but pc gaming isn't the force it once used to be.

[eiren]

It seems to be exactly as it's always been, if not better.

I remember struggling to find decent games to buy for my PC back in 2005. Don't have that problem at the moment.

Conversely, the only games I've been tempted to get on my consoles recently have been Uncharted 2 and Demon's Souls. They aren't exactly a hotbed of greatness themselves.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by eiren

Conversely, the only games I've been tempted to get on my consoles recently have been Uncharted 2 and Demon's Souls. They aren't exactly a hotbed of greatness themselves.

Uncharted 2 has me close to buying another ps3? Is it not as great as it's being made out then?

[eiren]

Haven't got either of them yet... I've got about 20 games installed on my PC that I haven't played or completed yet.

Got to work my way through those first

[Noggin1980]

I came across this distressing news;

The issue here is with definition of news, it's one overpaid loudmouths unfounded opinion, it's a hell of a long way from news.

[BYF]

Hardly surprising, there's certainly a lack of good PC exclusive games these days.

I had my PC nearly 6 months now and have only played Cryisis and NFS Shift, the later running like a dog on my ATI system. Only other game I'm interested in is Batman but I can get that on console rental for pennies.

I don't feel I've got much value out of my PC yet as a gaming platform.

Also there's a number of new big games out for consoles currently so I'm spending a lot more time on those and having fun.

[huy]

If Microsoft stops making games for Windows, others will fill the gap... it's not like MS will stop people playing games on windows all together.

[namuk]

Originally Posted by Houghsx

Why would I want to go from a Ferrari to a Skoda??

Ferrari to robin reliant you mean ...

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by eiren

I remember struggling to find decent games to buy for my PC back in 2005. Don't have that problem at the moment.

My thoughts exactly - over the last two years it has been a really good time for PC games - even companies that have traditionally been anti-PC have started to improve - look at Capcom coming of age. I have two consoles sitting at home waiting for the "death of PC gaming" - my current ratio of PC games played to console games played is 14:1.

[eiren]

Capcom is a great example of a company taking PCs seriously.

RE5 was re-written for the PC in terms of graphics and some game play. It's a much better game than the console counterparts.

[CraigofScotland]

raises an interesting question on wether they will try an account system for pc online games ala gold accounts for PC.

[mr_yogi]

The opinions of an 'Analyst' hardly qualifies as news IMO, I won't be worrying about this until MS make an annoncement, and even then I have no love of Live on the PC. We now have DX11 and some great online infrastructures (despite IW )

Originally Posted by BYF

Hardly surprising, there's certainly a lack of good PC exclusive games these days.

I had my PC nearly 6 months now and have only played Cryisis and NFS Shift, the later running like a dog on my ATI system. Only other game I'm interested in is Batman but I can get that on console rental for pennies.

Have you not got into (and caught up on older) the more traditional PC games, Supreme Commander, C&C/ Red Alert, Dawn of War II, Company of Heroes, Tropico 3 (out soon), L4D, Unreal 3, Q4, CS:Source, HL2/ EP1/ EP2/ Portal, etc.?

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by CraigofScotland

raises an interesting question on wether they will try an account system for pc online games ala gold accounts for PC.

Perhaps my memory is playing tricks with me, but I think GFW did this when it first launched. After a few months, Gold accounts were made free to PC users because absolutely nobody was paying.

Despite what the 'analyst' says, I think Microsoft remains comitted to PC gaming. The lack of fanfare for PC gaming despite the launch of Windows 7 is quite deliberate - look at the launch of Vista/Direct X 10 as to why they are doing things differently this time. But ultimately they have just launched Direct X 11 which rather shows their commitment. Furthermore GFW continues to be tweaked and refined - a few more generations and it might even be good.

[BYF]

Originally Posted by mr_yogi

Have you not got into (and caught up on older) the more traditional PC games, Supreme Commander, C&C/ Red Alert, Dawn of War II, Company of Heroes, Tropico 3 (out soon), L4D, Unreal 3, Q4, CS:Source, HL2/ EP1/ EP2/ Portal, etc.?

I'm not really a strategy/rpg game player, and played HL2, CS to death on my old system as well as UT2003, had L4D as a console rental.

I prefer action, footy and sim type games, on my old PC there were games like Max Payne, Mafia, Far Cry, Doom 3, HL2, UT2003, MOH, COD, IL-2, GP4, Nascar 2003, all great PC games and highly rated.

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by BYF

I'm not really a strategy/rpg game player, and played HL2, CS to death on my old system as well as UT2003, had L4D as a console rental.

I prefer action, footy and sim type games, on my old PC there were games like Max Payne, Mafia, Far Cry, Doom 3, HL2, UT2003, MOH, COD, IL-2, GP4, Nascar 2003, all great PC games and highly rated.

There are loads of action games available on the PC. We can recommend them until we are blue in the face, but if you'd rather play them on your consoles then you will find the majority available there - the PC doesn't deal in exclusives - just better graphics, better controls and better online play. However, if you do want some recommendations for 'action' centric titles, why not try:

S.T.A.L.K.E.R Shadow Of Chernobyl
S.T.A.L.K.E.R Clear Sky
Jericho
Mass Effect
Blacksite
Turning Point: Fall Of Liberty
Rainbow Six: Vegas 2
Fallout 3
Lost Planet
Overlord
Overlord 2
Overlord: Raising Hell
Bioshock
Medal Of Honour: Airborne
Team Fortress 2
Half Life 2 & Episodes
Portal
Timeshift
Call Of Duty series
Unreal Tournament 3
Enemy Territory: QUAKE Wars
Assassins Creed
Brothers In Arms: Hells Highway
Far Cry 2
Mirror's Edge
FEAR 2: Project Origin
Wolfenstein

If you are prepared to expand your horizons a little try Company of Heroes - an action centric RTS game.

[Razor]

I haven't touched my consoles for years now. Yes I play the odd exclusive game and I do have fun with them but apart from that I could easily live without my consoles. My Live subscription is up any day now and I don't think I will renew it till Crackdown 2 comes out. I just dont see the point as I never use my 360.

Most of the time I find console games basically poor. The low res, poor textures, poor lighting, jaggies, loud machines, tearing, low frame rate etc just winds me up. There are certain games I can live with the above like ratchet and clank, but i could never play a game like COD, Farcry 2, Command and Conquer, HL2, UT3, RE5 etc on a console. To me its like watching a big blockbuster movie in dvix on a mobile phone with mono sound.

This pc debate has been going on for years and pc games are still here. IMO its a silly debate and similar to saying that sit down restaurants will die now that we have fast food. The market is plenty big enough for both to exist and if anything the gaming pie is getting bigger and bigger every year.

[Jay]

I can always count on you razor to slate the consoles

Pc gaming is vastly superior when compared to consoles, no one can doubt that apart from the silly fanboys on the ps3 forums (I find the 360 fanboys ain't as bad)

But I'm just worried about the constant poor ports, I preferred it when the ps3 had sloppy ports

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Indecisive Jay

I can always count on you razor to slate the consoles

Pc gaming is vastly superior when comapred to consolkes, no one can doubt that apart from the silly fanboys on the ps3 forums (I find the 360 fanboys ain't as bad)

But I'm just worried about the constant poor ports, I preferred it when the ps3 had sloppy ports

LOL.....

I agree PS3 fanboys are the worst. I don't know why, maybe its because they know their machine isn't as good when it comes to multi platform games as the 360 and this pee's them off. Maybe its all the bluerays they watch instead of playing games. Or it could be that their hands are so crippled that they all like to stick together. Maybe we will never know the answer.

Dont worry about poor ports mate, even if they do port a game it always starts life on a pc then is scaled down to a console. That is how games are made. The gap is growing bigger and bigger between the two platforms also pc gaming is so much cheaper than it used to be say 5-10 years ago. Which is opening up the platform to those that couldn't afford it. Couple this with the increase of htpc's in peoples homes, I think pc as a gaming platform is getting more popular and not so niche.

I have helped more people this year who have come from consoles spec/build a gaming pc than I have in the previous years. I predict that pc gaming will get even more popular until the next gen of consoles appear and then the we will see a few users go back to consoles. Only to do the same again 3-4 years into the consoles life.

[BYF]

Originally Posted by Razor

Most of the time I find console games basically poor. The low res, poor textures, poor lighting, jaggies, loud machines, tearing, low frame rate etc just winds me up. There are certain games I can live with the above like ratchet and clank, but i could never play a game like COD, Farcry 2, Command and Conquer, HL2, UT3, RE5 etc on a console. To me its like watching a big blockbuster movie in dvix on a mobile phone with mono sound.

Are you being serious? a divx on a mobile phone in mono sound.....a bit of an exaggeration there I think.

[tommygunn]

How Plausible is it for MS to combine GFW & Xbox Live for the top top games i.e Cod 4, GoW, PES!!!, Fifa, C&C, and Many more. I know the obvious things like DL content and Controls but if they iron out those niggles surely they can create a service which satisfy's pretty much everyone under their blanket of Console gamers and Windows gamers and make a shed load of cash in the process??

personally i like xbox live but i LOVE pc games.

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by tommygunn

How Plausible is it for MS to combine GFW & Xbox Live for the top top games

I think we need to see GFW Live and Xbox Live diverge. Sure some elements can be universal - Achievements and the gametag for example - but we need to get GFW to move away from it's console routes and accept that somethings don't work well on the PC, i.e. auto-patching in game. Steam has got the online community and auto-patching approach right and we really need other services to follow suit.

[Chaos]

We already have a PC vs Consoles thread and that is the only way this is heading. Closed.