[Sniper Ash6]

As the title says this is not a thread for PC vs Console, it is a never ending argument that goes around in circles that has been going on for years.

The thing i dont get (or like) is that whenever a console is mentioned or someone who owns a console. They are instantly laughed at and made fun of and abuse is hurled at them

To me, this isnt the spirit of the forum and isnt fair. Im happy to play UT on the PC but dont think of my friends (or myself) that have a 360/other console an idiot or blind etc

So why cant everyone take the same/similar approach and realise they co-exist?

[addyb]

I dont slag off console owners considering i own a wii, ps3 and 360 myself.

[GMC79]

You will always get it as with the 360 vs PS3 nonsense, Always have die hards who just wont accept a few less pixels etc etc. No names mentioned.
It's all brilliant and i appreciate what we get these days. We're all lucky to live in this era

[CAS FAN]

I must admit, that is something about the PC forums which I do find very insular.

We all know that a PC is technically superior to the consoles (especially now that the consoles have been out around 3-4 years) but they do offer a great turn on and play experience out of the box. With a PC you are constantly changing settings, updating drivers, still manually patching a lot of games (if non-steam etc.), optimising the registry and performing other housekeeping tasks etc.

My views on PC's remain constant (regardless if I have an aging PC that I rarely use, or a new decent PC like I have now) and that is that they are the technical pinnacle of gaming, but not all of the best games come out on the PC.

I will always own and enjoy consoles as long as they have great exclusive titles on them. I kind of hope that they always do as I must confess that I like buying them and the excitement that comes from a new console release.

As things stand, you need to own all of the consoles and a decent PC if you want the pick of all of the best games IMO. A PC is pretty damn useless when it comes to playing what IMO will probably be the game of the year...Uncharted 2. You can stick a couple of DX11 graphics cards, 16gb ram and a top end i7 CPU in it and it will still not play Uncharted 2 .

I also love Wipeout, Ratchet and Clank, Gran Turismo, inFamous, Motorstorm 2, MGS4, Killzone 2, Resistance 2, Uncharted, Forza, PGR4, Halo 3, Fable 2, Super Mario Galaxy, Metroid Prime 1-3, Mario Kart Wii to name 16 great console exclusives that come to mind that have already been released in the first half of this console generation.

It's great to have cutting edge visuals but at the end of the day, the games we are playing now look awful, even on the best PC you could ever build. Give it 5-10 years and we will look back and wonder how we coped with such poor visuals in games like Crysis! The one thing that will always remain is the gameplay and how much fun a game provides. All of the currently available games platforms (Wii, 360, PS3, PC, PSP, DS etc.) have some great fun titles on them.

Im not a PC gamer, a Console gamer, a PS3, Wii or 360 gamer. I'm just a gamer and enjoy playing video games. I'll always buy the best versions of cross platform games (which will mean that I will buy them on the PC now), but i'll still keep all of the consoles to play the great exclusives that appear on them. I also take each console for what it is and see no point at all in slagging off any of them. They are all good in my book.

[eiren]

It's because they're rubbish.



Also don't take things so seriously.

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by Sniper Ash6

So why cant everyone take the same/similar approach and realise they co-exist?

I don't think anyone is "laughed at" or "made fun of" or "abuse is hurled at them" - I do think there are some very sound arguments against consoles though. I own an Xbox 360 and PS3 that I use for playing platform exclusives but I freely put my hand up and say I hate console gaming and despise what it has done to games. Things that bug me about consoles are as follows:

- Checkpoints. I am a grown adult who can decide for myself when to save. The game I am playing was not brought with my last pennies of pocket money and therefore I don't need to extract 'enjoyment' from playing the same scene again and again and again and again.

- Gamepad Centric. All games are now centric around the gamepad. The days and depth of something like X Wing are gone as a result - all functions need to be easily controlled with the 16 odd buttons and twin sticks on a gamepad. Even if you look at admirable efforts such as IL-2 Sturmovik: Birds of Prey you will see significant 'consolidation' of controls to fit onto the gamepad.

- Controls. Sticking on the controls theme I find the gamepad a single solution that is a perfect fit for very few games. I find the movement in the sticks too limited and much prefer using mouse/keyboard or a joystick. Admittedly the PS3 has started to grow up in this respect and at least allows a choice of (branded) controllers such as use of a Thrustmaster joystick in IL-2 Sturmovik: Birds of Prey. But you can only such a device when specifically permitted to do so.

- General Dumbing Down. We now have 'Quick Time Events' in lieu of any real action. I'm sorry but pressing X or O or some other shape is about as absorbing as a plastic raincoat. I think the stark contrast can be seen from playing something like The Force Unleashed and then Jedi Knight 2 - compare and contrast the AT-ST battles. The former's QTE are solely a product of the reduced controls on a console.

- Graphics. If it was just a case of accepting "a few less pixels" I don't think anyone would be really bothered. But it's not - a few years into the consoles lifespan and things stangnate. Core gaming resolution gets sacrificed. So does AA/AF. So does framerate. Especially when playing on a projector these defects leap forward and slap you in the face. Flash up Far Cry 2 on the PC with everything maxed out on your projector and then do the same with the PS3 version! Yuck! I appreciate that games are about gameplay not graphics - but I think the latter is an important component as I certainly want my games to look great and I want to be immersed.

- Exclusives. I find it quite annoying when companies buy up exclusive games for their consoles. A fact of life I suppose but why can't I enjoy Gears of War 2 on my PC - the console version is tied to the gamepad and doesn't look or play anywhere near as well as the first game (on the PC).

- Downloadable Content. DLC is growing in popularity on consoles - especially as developers see it as a way of making people retain the original game thus frustrating the second hand market. Unfortunately as a result I think we are in an annoying situation where small amounts of content are deliberately left out from the original retail package. Wind back 10 years and proper expansion packs were made - unfortunately these days, with limited console storage space and bandwidth limitations, we are given small bitesized chuncks.

- Mods. Not a massive mod person but every now and then I do use one to enhance my games. Adding vehicles and graphics enhancements to S.T.A.L.K.E.R for example - it makes the experience so much better. The console experience here is always going to constrained.

- Game Updates. When on an open platform like a PC a developer can issue as many patches as they like. The certification process for the consoles constrain and limit this. The perfect example is Team Fortress 2 - compare and contrast the current PC version with the Xbox 360. It is instantly clear the two platforms have a very different experience - play it on the Xbox and it's like a historical tour for PC gamers. And there is no reason other than barriers unnecessarily imposed by an administrative layer that doesn't need to be there.

- Mobility. With an open platform you can play your games on any suitable hardware - desktop or laptop and easily transfer files between them. Not so with consoles - could you imagine dragging your Xbox 360 and a small LCD TV on the train!

- Legacy Support. It may not always be easy and require some faffing around, but old PC games from 1 year ago, 5 years ago, 10 years ago etc can be played now. Not so with consoles - backwards compatibility is provided as a half-hearted feature at a console launch and dmininshes thereafter. For some games it will be reissued on Marketplace or PSN Store and then be sold to you again - but why accept a platform where you have to buy your stuff twice!?! And if you still want to play next generation you'll probably need to buy it again.

Don't get me wrong - I enjoy some of the console exclusive games. I think ICO and Shadow of the Colossus are two all time greats despite being shackled to a console. I have also thoroughly enjoyed many other console titles - most recently things like Resistance 2, Infamous and IL-2 Sturmovik Birds of Prey. But would I have enjoyed them more on the PC where I could have picked the controls and cranked up the graphics? YES!

Consoles are a fact of life and, due to their plug and play ease ensuring even a pleb can get going, means they inevitably dominate mainstream gaming. It's disappointing for all the reasons I cite above - but not a show-stopper - I still enjoy my games.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Sniper Ash6

The thing i dont get (or like) is that whenever a console is mentioned or someone who owns a console. They are instantly laughed at and made fun of and abuse is hurled at them

Ash to be fair, no one recieves abuse on this forum for owning a console, or gets called names, as the majority on this forum own pcs and consoles.

I think you've maybe just mis-read the banter, it's the usual suspects that like having a joke about consoles, it's not serious.

It's the same as those on the 360 forums that crack jokes about the ps3, it isn't serious, and most of them own a ps3.

[JohnG]

Yes I reckon a lot of what is said in this forum is in fun and is just good natured banter

[CAS FAN]

These threads are pretty pointless as all you will get are threads highlighting the benefits of PC's (or consoles if you post this in the console forums) and dumbing down the benefits of consoles (or PC's in the console forums).

Comments like "Consoles are a fact of life and, due to their plug and play ease ensuring even a pleb can get going, means they inevitably dominate mainstream gaming." are hardly helpful and really only belittle (in this case) console gaming. Calling someone a pleb implies that they are the lowest and most common element of society, lacking in intelligence.

Just because something is designed to be user friendly (consoles, ipods and other consumer electronic devices) and designed to be easy to use, doesn't mean that they are there for those lacking in intelligence and that those with more about them should always seek out devices which are more complex in their operation. Making something intuitive/easy to use etc. is a design goal as is viewed as a positive, rather than a negative. Many folk (usually those with high level, demanding jobs and family lives i.e. those generally regarded as the successful in society) simply do not have the time to invest in the PC and require something that is easy to use, is pick up and play so that you can be gaming within minutes of opening the box and provides fun entertainment.

The PC is great and it fills a specific need, but it's not the best solution for everyone. For some people a console is the best solution to meet their gaming needs.

[Sniper Ash6]

It may have started off as banter but its just not anymore (IMO)

Any mention of a console or a game that is multi-platform is slagged off eg see the thread about MW2 being delayed on PC

Its just excessive now and getting old, if you dont like consoles we know that and get the point

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Sniper Ash6

It may have started off as banter but its just not anymore (IMO)

Any mention of a console or a game that is multi-platform is slagged off eg see the thread about MW2 being delayed on PC

Its just excessive now and getting old, if you dont like consoles we know that and get the point

To be fair though this is the pc forum, it's not as though people are going into console forums and saying it.

Whereas you get console owners going into other forums to troll.

Which funnily enough happened in the thread you mention, a console owner came and started defending his pride and joy and people simply replied to him.

It works both ways you know, you can't go into a thread say something and expect no replies.

Either way it's banter, why are you taking it so seriously?

[JohnG]

You do get the same kind of thing in the lcd/plasma forums when someone who owns an lcd goes into the plasma forum to say that plasmas are crap (or vice versa)

[Jay]

Originally Posted by JohnG

You do get the same kind of thing in the lcd/plasma forums when someone who owns an lcd goes into the plasma forum to say that plasmas are crap (or vice versa)

Exactly, it happens everywhere.

I don't care though, and don't see why others would.

If someone wants to be loyal to a peice of electronic equipment, then that's up to them, I just like to get the best I can get regardless of who makes it...Which is why I got a pc instead of a console

[Sniper Ash6]

Im not trying to start fights or anything but i just dont like reading threads and everything in there is unrelated as its about slagging off consoles or PC vs Console etc

My original question still stands of why cant people accept they co-exist? People have their own opinion of which they prefer and that is fair enough and quite obvious by which set of forums they frequent

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Sniper Ash6

Im not trying to start fights or anything but i just dont like reading threads and everything in there is unrelated as its about slagging off consoles or PC vs Console etc

My original question still stands of why cant people accept they co-exist? People have their own opinion of which they prefer and that is fair enough and quite obvious by which set of forums they frequent

It's the same in the console forums, only it's people arguing about which version has less jaggies the ps3 or 360, or which version is 500p and which is 510p

I think most people can accept that they co-exisit, infact most of us are "gamers" and want to play the best games regardless of what console they're on.

I don't want to miss out on the new ratchet and clank on the ps3 because of some undying love for the pc for example.

[Jay]

Also the fact remains that regardless of the subject matter arguments on the internet will always exist, as it's easy to make a smart ass comment with no worry of consequence.

I think maybe you just need to accept that as one of the negatives of forums and move on.

[Razor]

No disrespect but this is a bit of pointless thread. As others have said this happens in allot of other sections of the forums.
Pop into the PS3 section and mention that the 360 is better and see what happens. The same applies to LCD/Plasma, Mac/PC etc...

The way I see it is we are all gamers here and many with multiple platforms in our homes. Most people think I am not a big fan of consoles yet I own 2 360's, a PS3, a PSP and a interactive teletex machine called a wii. Consoles have their uses and their good games although they are not my main platform of choice.

I am with Cas when he says that he is just a gamer, I also feel the same way and have bought games for all my platforms this year. The reason why I have all the platforms is for exclusive gems which I don't want to miss out on as I love gaming.

What gets on my nerves is blinkered inexperienced fanboys which seem to frequent certain sections of this forum and other forums. Who spout crap about things they dont know.

[Clunk]

Both my parents were killed in a freak Atari 2600 accident.

I'm sorry, but I'm just not ready to move on yet.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Razor

a interactive teletex machine called a wii.
.

Look I'll be honest I'm sick and tired of you slagging off the wii, all you do is abuse it and it's really distressing for me.

I'm having sleepless nights, please stop.

[Clunk]

Look, I've been using teletext for years - why can't people just accept that it's each to their own? We get our own exclusive puzzle and jokes pages, why have people like Razor got to keep insulting us with cheap comparisons?

Grrrrr etc.

[eiren]

Originally Posted by Sniper Ash6

Im not trying to start fights

I think you are though.

If there's any posting you think is insulting or damaging to read, then please report the post to a mod and they can take the appropriate action.


I think most of them can see the big wink emoticon after all the joking comments like this one


Most of us own both the main 'next gen' consoles and a gaming PC, so we're in a pretty good position to pass comment.


You should maybe also think about taking legal action against NVidia too, since their 'The Way It's Meant To Be Played' programme and motto is aimed directly as a criticism towards consoles.

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Clunk

Both my parents were killed in a freak Atari 2600 accident.

I'm sorry, but I'm just not ready to move on yet.

Thats terrible news mate. My deepest sympathies.

Originally Posted by Indecisive Jay

Look I'll be honest I'm sick and tired of you slagging off the wii, all you do is abuse it and it's really distressing for me.

I'm having sleepless nights, please stop.

Originally Posted by Clunk

Look, I've been using teletext for years - why can't people just accept that it's each to their own? We get our own exclusive puzzle and jokes pages, why have people like Razor got to keep insulting us with cheap comparisons?

Grrrrr etc.

I wasnt slagging off the Wii I was bigging it up.

Right off to wave my arms about on page 376 of teletext.

[Jay]

Razor have you played the wii much or do the graphics hurt your eyes

Mario galaxy is worth playing.

I bet the wii is your guilty pleasure, and you bang out the bowling and tennis every night

[Clunk]

Originally Posted by eiren

I think you are though.

If there's any posting you think is insulting or damaging to read, then please report the post to a mod and they can take the appropriate action.


I think most of them can see the big wink emoticon after all the joking comments like this one


Most of us own both the main 'next gen' ConsoLes and a gaming PC, so we're in a pretty good position to pass comment.


You shoUld maybe also thiNK about taking legal action agaInSt NVidia too, since their 'The Way It's Meant To Be Played' proGRammE And moTto is aimed directly as a criticism towards consoles.

Exactly. Although at the end of the day we'll all read what we want to read and take things personally if we want to.

Cheers.

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Indecisive Jay

Razor have you played the wii much or do the graphics hurt your eyes

Mario galaxy is worth playing.

I bet the wii is your guilty pleasure, and you bang out the bowling and tennis every night

I was actually playing it on Friday night when a few mates popped round. They did start to moan when I said fancy a game of golf or bowling and didnt seem happy to be playing it in low res on teletext.

Despite their moaning we all moved into the garden some 45 foot away from the display and their eyes stopped hurting at this distance. We had a few hours of fun before they had enough and went back to playing PURE on the pc. (It was also getting very cold in the garden)

[Clunk]

Originally Posted by Razor

I was actually playing it on Friday night when a few mates popped round. They did start to moan when I said fancy a game of golf or bowling and didnt seem happy to be playing it in low res on teletext.

Despite their moaning we all moved into the garden some 45 foot away from the display and their eyes stopped hurting at this distance. We had a few hours of fun before they had enough and went back to playing PURE on the pc. (It was also getting very cold in the garden)

Yet another score for being a teletext gamer here, see.

No moaning - I don't have friends.

[Razor]

Originally Posted by Clunk

Yet another score for being a teletext gamer here, see.

No moaning - I don't have friends.

I will be your friend mate.

[Rasczak]

Originally Posted by CAS FAN

Comments like "Consoles are a fact of life and, due to their plug and play ease ensuring even a pleb can get going, means they inevitably dominate mainstream gaming." are hardly helpful and really only belittle (in this case) console gaming. Calling someone a pleb implies that they are the lowest and most common element of society, lacking in intelligence.

Pleb means commoner, i.e. someone with 'common' knowledge CAS FAN. By which I was merely pointing out the benefits of the consoles in that anyone can access them for games even if normally challenged by such equipment. However, and I doubt even Microsoft or Sony would dispute, consoles are to gaming what Butlins is to holidays - an affordable way to game.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Rasczak

However, and I doubt even Microsoft or Sony would dispute, consoles are to gaming what Butlins is to holidays - an affordable way to game.

That's a good one, I'll have to use that when I go and troll in the 360 and ps3 forums.

I'll tell them their console is like butlins, and the pc is like a luxury holiday in dubai

[Clunk]

Originally Posted by Razor

I will be your friend mate.

Yeah you say that now, but some day a Megadrive will fall from the top of an old storage cupboard onto you, leaving you in a coma. I'm not sure I can live with that on my conscience.

No, no you're best keeping your distance.