[locky79]

hullo

for those of you who check the business section in the bbc news then you will know that sony got fine today and here more details about it via the link.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4387045.stm

its about time! i cant stand sony arrogance, its time this knocks them into reality

[Miyazaki]

Good news IMO. They have a stranglehold on the console market.

[AML]

Im not to happy if sonys stock goes down! I just happen to own some!

I doubt they will have to stop selling the machine though. They will probably settle out of court!

Still it is a lesson to these big corps who think they can do what they want!.

[captaineyecatch]

Serves them right - they thought they could push the small company around, MS knew they were right and settled out of court paying £26million. But big old Sony thought we can take the little on and win it.
Another news bit here http://www.japantoday.com/e/?content...at=4&id=332037

[CAS FAN]

I still think it's funny how my 1st year (1993) Industrial Design Degree project to design a Video Games controller appeared in the shops a year or so later as the Playstation pad. Could have just been coincidence mind

[Miyazaki]

AFAIK, you don't own copyright to anything you produce at university, the university would own the copyright, even if you could prove someone stole your design.

[Battlestar]

Originally Posted by Games Guru

Good news IMO. They have a stranglehold on the console market.

why, because they are doing better than the other consoles?

[Miyazaki]

No, but any virtual monopoly is only bad for any sector.

[CAS FAN]

Originally Posted by Games Guru

AFAIK, you don't own copyright to anything you produce at university

We were always told to sign & date all work with our names & the copyright symbol so that we could sue if our designs were stollen. I guess at the end of the day it's proving it I though.

[CrispyXUK]

PS1/2 Pad is also very similar to the snes pad, but with handles and an extra set of trigger buttons

[CAS FAN]

Indeed that's partially where I took my inspiration. I just stuck on the hand grips that came down off the D-Pad and buttons sections (in a similar way to how Sony have done). Got a good grade for the work though so can't grumble I guess.

[Solar]

Originally Posted by AML

I doubt they will have to stop selling the machine though. They will probably settle out of court!

too late the court has already ordered them to stop selling the console

[Zacabeb]

Reportedly their appeal means they can keep selling the console while it's pending.

I doubt it will end up with Sony having to stop selling anything or removing the force feedback from its controllers. It will most likely end up with Sony settling with Immersion, as AML pointed out. If Immersion would not come to an agreement with Sony and force the latter to remove the force feedback, that would mean bad publicity for Immersion as it would anger quite a lot of PlayStation consumers. If anything they probably want a settlement with Sony, so long as it includes getting paid a license fee in perpetuity and throughout the universe.

What disturbs me though is that one can patent something as silly as the concept of vibration. Sony would probably violate the patent even if they switched to an alternative method such as solenoids. Actually they'd probably violate the patent even if they switched to jumping beans, clattering joke teeth, whatever.

Also, Immersion does not make its money on rumbling motors, they don't even make any. Their primary business is software and control electronics for haptic force feedback (i.e. feedback that affects the controls) for use in gaming, medicine, and science. There they have a lot of proprietary servo technology which is quite advanced. Their vanguard technology are mice that can simulate moving over different surfaces, not simple vibration.

So, this technology isn't even what Immersion is concentrating on, it just happened to grow big because of video games. Suing Sony over rumbling motors is pathetic, they're just out to use their patents to make money off a company with bigger earnings because they're envious.

[CrispyXUK]

Don't SEGA hold the Patent to camera view buttons on Arcade machines? LOL

Originally Posted by Zacabeb

What disturbs me though is that one can patent something as silly as the concept of vibration. Sony would probably violate the patent even if they switched to an alternative method such as solenoids. Actually they'd probably violate the patent even if they switched to jumping beans, clattering joke teeth, whatever.

i dont quite get that, sony werent the fist to get controllers to vibrate im 99% sure that was nintendo with the n64 rumble pack so how come if the entire idea is whats patented didnt either nintendo sue sony or this company sue nintendo? or microsoft for that matter?

[CrispyXUK]

Nintendo own part of the company

right so why didnt nintendo sue sony as soon as the ps1 dual shocks were released? and why havent they sued microsoft for using vibration?

company and copyright laws are needlessly complex

[CrispyXUK]

I think Microsoft paid them

[Ed Selley]

Microsoft did indeed pay up for the right to shake.

[Enquirer]

http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9584_22-5056455.html

Microsoft settled on July 28, 2003 and has a stake in Immersion check the above link i'm not making it up.
Under the deal, Microsoft will pay Immersion $26 million for licensing rights and for a stake in the company, Immersion said Tuesday. Immersion also can borrow as much as $9 million more through a convertible debenture arrangement with Microsoft, the company said.

They might Not want to settle as microsoft must have a say.

so your saying that both microsoft AND nintendo have a vested interest in this little company! and they are suing sony and have managed to get a ruling to stop playstation sales. seems a little convenient that really, the 2 major competitors ganging up on sony? perhaps im just being overly suspicious.

[Battlestar]

Originally Posted by watchinthewheel

so your saying that both microsoft AND nintendo have a vested interest in this little company! and they are suing sony and have managed to get a ruling to stop playstation sales. seems a little convenient that really, the 2 major competitors ganging up on sony? perhaps im just being overly suspicious.

No i think you may be spot on. Considering that the playstation brand is the top seller ( regardless of wether it is a better product or not) I would say that both Nintendo and Microsoft are involved in a conspiracy to take down the top dog and are using imersion as a front to do the job

[AML]

Let them gang up on Sony I say!

I think sony are too arrogant and need to be taken a peg down.

I never did like the PS2 tbh! Underpowered, horrible design, difficult to make games for, the list goes on!

[jian]

Originally Posted by Zacabeb

. Suing Sony over rumbling motors is pathetic, they're just out to use their patents to make money off a company with bigger earnings because they're envious.

So, are yopu saying that you wouldn't do the same if you were in immersions's position?

Having a patent is all about sharing design ideas with other parties who then pay a fee for it, so I guess anyone in there position would sue, especially when one takes into account the sums involved.

[jenic]

I think we should all support sony because you know who will eventually lose out, us! They might start charging more for Playstations and the games and might even charge more for other products just to make the money back!

[Enquirer]

Originally Posted by CrispyXUK

Nintendo own part of the company

I cant find any evidence to support your statement Crispy.
Nintendo did use the technology under licence so thats why they were not on the lawsuit list.

Immersions patent is very detailed and although its possible to make a different way of doing the same thing its going to be expensive and they already owe for existing products

[Greg]

$90m is of no consequence to a giant like Sony. It will probably get reduced or thrown out in the appeals court anyway.

Or they will find some loophole to keep selling them.

[Enquirer]

I think you'll find $90 million means a lot more nowadays than it used to quite a few of sony divisions make a loss.

[AML]

Indeed. Only SCEI are making a proffit for sony!

They are resting all their hopes on a couple of big investments such as Blu Ray, the PSP and the PS3. As well as displays and their media section. (Sony pictures/music)

[CrispyXUK]

Originally Posted by Enquirer

I cant find any evidence to support your statement Crispy.
Nintendo did use the technology under licence so thats why they were not on the lawsuit list.

Immersions patent is very detailed and although its possible to make a different way of doing the same thing its going to be expensive and they already owe for existing products

Well info is around as Nintendo will be using immersion tech in there next console, apparently giroscopic type stuff