[Pecker]

10CC star jealous of Queen's success - Yahoo! News UK

10cc rocker Graham Gouldman is disappointed his band is overshadowed by the success of rivals Queen and David Bowie - insisting they were just as prominent on the 1970s music scene.

The guitarist concedes it was the band's image and lack of leadership which has left them out of the music magazines and polls.

He says, "I'm not happy with our place in pop hierarchy. I think it should be more recognised.

"I was reading an old music magazine's article, Important Records From the Seventies, and we never seem to get mentioned in those things.

"It's always Bowie and Queen and that gets on my nerves a bit."

Discuss.

Steve W

[risetoaddiction]

Maybe it has something to do with 10cc being rather mediocre compared to the artists who get the deserved praise.

[Tony Devils]

Very underated band.

[quarry2006]

I don't think it's so much that 10CC were underrated as Queen and Bowie were overrated. Queen's kudos came about after Freddie Mercury's death. Sure, they were a big concert drawer but they never cracked America and I think, whilst isolated tracks of theirs are pretty good, the albums were largely inconsistent, inconsiquential affairs. Bowie's always been overrated in my book; all a lot of fuss over very little as far as I can see.

Whilst I do find some Bowie and Queen listenable, though, I always switch off when 10CC comes on. Life is a minestrone, indeed.

[Pecker]

I love '70's Bowie, and I think Queen were pretty good, too.

But I started listening to a bit of 10CC again a few weeks ago, and they were very decent band.

I used to have most of their albums on vinyl. I now have the first two and their Greatest Hits.

Whilst they're not as good as Bowie, I'd agree firstly that they're totally ignored in most retrospective polls & essays on the '70's, and secondly that this is quite unfair.

Steve W

10cc are good.

What about deep purple. Also under rated.

There are probably many bands like this.

Some bands/people just have a wider apeal.

m.

[overkill]

Originally Posted by quarry2006

I don't think it's so much that 10CC were underrated as Queen and Bowie were overrated. Queen's kudos came about after Freddie Mercury's death. Sure, they were a big concert drawer but they never cracked America and I think, whilst isolated tracks of theirs are pretty good, the albums were largely inconsistent, inconsiquential affairs. Bowie's always been overrated in my book; all a lot of fuss over very little as far as I can see.

Whilst I do find some Bowie and Queen listenable, though, I always switch off when 10CC comes on. Life is a minestrone, indeed.

Well there you go!

Queens sense of humour and style is an acquired taste. I love the series of albums from Queen II to Jazz. There is hardly a duff track on any of them. What seems lightweight is Queen taking the ****. In the same way ELP used too.

As for Bowie, agree with that one. The albums Hunky Dory to Diamond Dogs were ace, but before and after that, largely tosh.

However, I would correct the Queen comment. Queen broke the US with Sheer Heart attack, then 'big' with Night at the Opera. However, by the time 'The Game' was released the US bubble had burst.

I can see Gouldmans point to a limited degree. 10CC produced some great material, however, bar 'Deceptive Bends' their albums were patchy. Although this is seen as 'blasphemy', for me the Godly and Creme tracks on albums like 'How dare you' and 'Original Soundtrack' brought down what would have been classics had Stewart and Gouldman written all the material. Those two just seemed to be trying to be experimental but never had the ability to carry it off.

[emporer]

I dont think 10cc could even come close to Queen, whoever said Queen's kudos came after Mercury's death obviously doesn't know his music history, they were one of if not themost popular band of the 70s/80s, i'm old enough to remember the buzz going around after Live Aid that Queen were at that time (1985) the best band on the planet.

As for Bowie, not my kind of thing really but have to respect what he has done for the music industry.

[IPaintSara]

Given the immodesty of their name I'm not surprised they feel under appreciated. I still like Live And Let Live but nowhere in the same league as even Queen or Bowie's lesser offerings much less anywhere near as influential

[Pecker]

Bowie stands head and shoulders above the others, IMVHO.

From Hunky Dory through to Let's Dance he barely set a foot wrong - that's 11 'proper' studio albums on the trot.

10CC not influential? Have you not heard anything by The Feeling?



Steve W

[overkill]

Originally Posted by Pecker

Bowie stands head and shoulders above the others, IMVHO.

From Hunky Dory through to Let's Dance he barely set a foot wrong - that's 11 'proper' studio albums on the trot.

10CC not influential? Have you not heard anything by The Feeling?



Steve W

That really depends on music taste pecker. I can't listen to Station to Station or Lodger without getting bored, while Low and Heroes are just, well 'just' really. I tried to like them, I really did, but I just can't. They are Eno's influence at his worst.

As for Scary Monsters, that is the only album I've ever bought for 50P that was so bad I really felt I'd been ripped off!

It went back to the shop I bought it from!

[Pecker]

Originally Posted by overkill

That really depends on music taste pecker. I can't listen to Station to Station or Lodger without getting bored, while Low and Heroes are just, well 'just' really. I tried to like them, I really did, but I just can't. They are Eno's influence at his worst.

As for Scary Monsters, that is the only album I've ever bought for 50P that was so bad I really felt I'd been ripped off!

It went back to the shop I bought it from!

Station to Station is a gem I think. It's one of those great after-thought follow albums (in this case to Young Americans) which are maybe less polished, but altogether more satifying than the more populist original.

I love Zooropa too, for much the same reasons.

Steve W

[Steven]

Queen is overrated. There are/were better rock bands

[quarry2006]

Originally Posted by emporer

I dont think 10cc could even come close to Queen, whoever said Queen's kudos came after Mercury's death obviously doesn't know his music history, they were one of if not themost popular band of the 70s/80s, i'm old enough to remember the buzz going around after Live Aid that Queen were at that time (1985) the best band on the planet.

As for Bowie, not my kind of thing really but have to respect what he has done for the music industry.

It was me who said their kudos only came after Mercury's death. My name's to the left of the post for convenience .

And whilst I don't think it's necessarily fair that they had to wait until their lead singer died to get plaudits (for example, they didn't receive a Brit award until they did the Miracle album, when Mercury was quite shockingly visibly ill) that is what happened.

[brian s]

I loved the original 10cc. One of the greatest pop/rock bands ever. The later versions after Godley and Creme left were variable. They had four talented singer/song writers, musicans, producers and an engineer. The very best band of their type. I like Bowie and Queen but I adore 10cc. I saw the original line up several times including their last gig. They were brilliant.

Bri

[Kenny Glasgow]

I like 10 CC, I like Queen and I like Bowie

10CC did have a golden period up to Bloody Tourists and the Live & Let Live double live set. I agree that most of Godley & Creme's stuff was experimental and didn't work most of the time.

If GG is talking about that period ('74 - '79) then he may have a good case.

Bowie's biggest selling album was Let's Dance which came out in 1983 and the single was his first US number one

Queen's biggest selling album was The Game and the only album to reach no.1 in the US & UK and Another One Bites The Dust is their biggest selling single. Both came out in 1980

[JohnG]

I always thought that 10CC were OK but couldn't take a full album at a time. I seem to remember my brother had a double album of theirs that I listened to quite a bit but can't remember what it was called
I was into Queen in the early days much more than the later stuff and for me nobody else matched that excitement of Queen bringing out a new album. I think you just had to be there in the 70s to appreciate just what a new Queen album meant to a lot of people. Those were the days when they printed "no synths" on the album amongst the lyrics and credits
Edit - I believe Queen did start to do well in America but they lost favour with them after releasing that video where they were in drag. The Americans couldn't take that in those days

[epicdream]

I have just got into listening to 10cc (I am going though some sort of 70's phase ). I am not too keen on their earllier stuff and agree with the comments about Godley & Creme being too experimental at times. I feel that the band settled down into a formula (rightly or wrongly) when G&C left.

I love Deceptive Bends album.

I am also getting into ELO too, I think they have a good shout to be up there with the rest... (I know that many people hate them too! )

I have no problems with either Queen or Bowie, I think they have made enough memorable music to get the respect they deserve.

[brian s]

One of the joys of 10cc was the contrast between the two pairs. Godley and Creme were more experimental and Gouldman and Stewart had a very strong commercial sensibility. The two pairs worked together so well rather than against each other. The first four albums with the original line up were masterpieces. I don't regard any further studio albums as being by 10cc.

Deceptive Bends had some very fine moments but it wasn't a patch on the previous releases. Likewise Godley and Creme's output couldn't quite match those albums, apart from L.

Cheers
Bri

[pabsjl]

Originally Posted by Kenny Glasgow

Bowie's biggest selling album was Let's Dance which came out in 1983 and the single was his first US number one

I was always thought "Fame" (1975) was Bowie's first US number one single.

pabsjl

[Kenny Glasgow]

Originally Posted by pabsjl

I was always thought "Fame" (1975) was Bowie's first US number one single.

pabsjl

apart from Fame.....

[krish]

Originally Posted by emporer

I dont think 10cc could even come close to Queen, whoever said Queen's kudos came after Mercury's death obviously doesn't know his music history, they were one of if not themost popular band of the 70s/80s, i'm old enough to remember the buzz going around after Live Aid that Queen were at that time (1985) the best band on the planet.

I recall that the buzz going round after Live Aid was that Queen were the best band at Live Aid. It was the Live Aid buzz that influenced their subsequent huge (and of course final) Magic tour. Before that, they were not as huge as you think ... they'd already burnt their bridges in the States, and Freddie's adoption of the gay moustachioed look didn't help matters with ultra-conservative US rock fans. They were kind of stagnating during the early 80s until Geldof put them on the Live Aid bill. I also regard Floyd and Led Zep as much much bigger bands ... way more popular in terms of touring and album commercial and critical success

As for 10cc, they deserve some recognition for naming themselves after ejaculation volume, but not much more imho.

[karkus30]

I'm not sure that Queen and Bowie were particularly big influences anyway. More influenced than influencial, so that puts 10cc right up there with them plus about a million other bands around the same time.

It's difficult to pick the strongly influencial artists from the 70s and 80s. Roxy, Talking Heads and U2 spring to mind.

[Pecker]

Originally Posted by overkill

That really depends on music taste pecker. I can't listen to Station to Station or Lodger without getting bored, while Low and Heroes are just, well 'just' really. I tried to like them, I really did, but I just can't. They are Eno's influence at his worst.

As for Scary Monsters, that is the only album I've ever bought for 50P that was so bad I really felt I'd been ripped off!

It went back to the shop I bought it from!

I was reminded of this thread (particularly this post) last night when we listened to Scary Monsters after tea. I'd not had it on for a few years, and it was simply 'its turn'.

I was struck by how it foreshadowed much of what was to come. Immediately It's No Game Part 1 had a groove that put's it right on collision course with Robert Palmer's Addicted to Love (of all things), whilst Up the Hill Backwards was clearly an influence on Talking Head's Speaking in Tongues and Little Creatures.

The album goes on to pre-reference just about everything the new romantics were to later serve up, as well as sounding in parts like Echo and the Bunnymen and Suede.

A cracking album!

Still, each to their own.

Steve W

[overkill]

Originally Posted by Pecker

I was reminded of this thread (particularly this post) last night when we listened to Scary Monsters after tea. I'd not had it on for a few years, and it was simply 'its turn'.

I was struck by how it foreshadowed much of what was to come. Immediately It's No Game Part 1 had a groove that put's it right on collision course with Robert Palmer's Addicted to Love (of all things), whilst Up the Hill Backwards was clearly an influence on Talking Head's Speaking in Tongues and Little Creatures.

The album goes on to pre-reference just about everything the new romantics were to later serve up, as well as sounding in parts like Echo and the Bunnymen and Suede.

A cracking album!

Still, each to their own.

Steve W

Well, I had ( I got rid soon as poss) Scary Monsters and I still have all of the albums that you list as 'influenced by'. I'm not sure I'd agree tbh, in particular as all of them were released many years after that LP was. An artist may influence long term, but albums rarely do.

If you are holding up that Scary Monsters resulted in the New romantics, Echo and the bunnymen and Suede, then I not only nominate it as the worst album to come from the 70's (by a million miles), but a candidate for a mass record burning!

Cracking is the word.

But not as you mean.


Back to 10CC, it's interesting seeing the old divergence between those who like the band opening up again. I must admit I never thought 10CC really 'cracked it' due to G&C's inability to write a tune without trying to be a 'poor man's' Zappa/Beefheart rather than that being a cause of their success.