'A Day In The Life': The greatest song of all time

Gorshin · 16-12-2004, 10:41 PM

The Beatles at their absolute zenith, and for me the greatest piece of popular music ever recorded. what do you think?

Floodedstatue · 16-12-2004, 10:55 PM

It's up there, Gorsh, I'll give you that! Certainly one The Beatles standout tracks

mik · 17-12-2004, 9:58 AM

absolute tosh!!
Compare the beatles to Dylan and there really is no comparison

nabby · 17-12-2004, 11:06 AM

Maybe lyrically it's one of their best but musically and as an overall package (lyricas and music), I'd say Strawberry Fields is better and more innovative. And Eleanor Rigby is top class!
To my ears I find the Paul McCartney interlude kind of upsets the rhythm of the song (A Day In The Life) - but by all accounts he put it in there cos he was a tad jealous of Lennon's bit being so good.

But what about The Kinks? Waterloo Sunset, Sunday Afternoon, Days...they're all excellent!
Also, God Only Knows by The Beach Boys.

Hey, I seem to be stuck in the 60's...Help!

CJROSS · 17-12-2004, 12:15 PM

Here comes the sun !!!

Surely !!

**Flimber** · 17-12-2004, 12:37 PM

No, no, no.

The Most Perfect Song of All Time Award goes to...

..."Northern Sky" by Nick Drake.

HTH,

Mike.

**Flimber** · 17-12-2004, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

absolute tosh!!
Compare the beatles to Dylan and there really is no comparison

You're right, Lennon and McCartney are pop geniuses whereas Dylan is a gibbering, croaky twit who wrote a handful of genuinely good songs (if that). The rest is myth made up in fans heads. Sorry if the truth hurts

Mike.

Ian J · 17-12-2004, 1:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

Compare the beatles to Dylan and there really is no comparison

I am sure that most of us will agree with you. Dylan was good but as you say, there is no comparison.

Kenny Glasgow · 17-12-2004, 1:33 PM

Yes ADITL is one of my all time fav's of all time

To suggest that Macca was jealous of Winston's song so he made up the middle section is absolute drivvell!

If you listen to early versions of the song and even the latter versions (with the humming outro) then you'll know the truth.

SFF is also a contender as is Across The Universe, Fixing A Hole, Tomorrow Never Knows, Paperback Writer, Here Comes The Sun etc etc etc etc

mik · 18-12-2004, 10:48 AM

perhaps that is why they use to sit and bow in his hotel room. What were the beatles anyway? a handful of studio albums, where is your proof of genius, paste it up here and lets see.
A day in the life is a blatant rip off from many dylan songs of taking news and turning into song but the key being that dylan was doing it in 1964 and added to the fact that the beatles lyrics are more nursery rhyme and of no significant meaning other than the song

A Day In The Life

I read the news today oh, boy
About a lucky man who made the grade
And though the news was rather sad
Well I just had to laugh and
I saw the photograph

The Lonesome Death Of Hattie Carroll

William Zanzinger killed poor Hattie Carroll
With a cane that he twirled around his diamond ring finger
At a Baltimore hotel society gath'rin'.
And the cops were called in and his weapon took from him
As they rode him in custody down to the station
And booked William Zanzinger for first-degree murder.
But you who philosophize disgrace and criticize all fears,
Take the rag away from your face.
Now ain't the time for your tears.

The beatles go on to tell us that about potholes in blackburn while dylan goes on to condemn the society he lives in which is still very resonant in the world of today, some 40 years later. Did they sort the potholes out?
So I guess flimber you are kinda right, there are 2 kinds of people in the world, those that get dylan and those that dont but dont worry m8, we dont hold it against you

Kenny Glasgow · 18-12-2004, 11:20 AM

Mik

What's your problem? Dylan is great but so are the Beatles. I have evrything by them both so I think I can compare

Yes Bob wrote poetry to music with political comment, satire and great humour and so did John & Paul, to a lesser extent, I agree.

However everyone's tastes are different!

FWIIW, the greatest ever Dylan song is Sad Eyed Lady of The Lowlands.................in my opinion

**Flimber** · 18-12-2004, 7:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

...
So I guess flimber you are kinda right, there are 2 kinds of people in the world, those that get dylan and those that dont but dont worry m8, we dont hold it against you

Of course I 'get' Dylan. I just think he's a gibbering, croaky twit

And that's because he is.

Cheers,
Mike.

the_pauley · 20-12-2004, 12:13 AM

I'm a fan of both Dylan and The Beatles, and if Mik knew half that he thinks he does about Dylan, he'd know that the Zimm was / is a huge admirer of The Beatles work. Unless of course you think Dylan's opinion is worthless Mik?

He is on record as saying that hearing The Beatles inspired him to change his musical direction "Man their chords are outrageous! Remarkable!" is the famous quote.

Without the influence of The Beatles we probably never would have had "Highway 61 Revisited" or "Blonde On Blonde", just as without Dylan we might never have had "Rubber Soul" or "Revolver".

As for Mik's ramblings about The Beatles singing about potholes while Dylan gave us lyrics of political import, well that is a highly selective reading isn't it? Putting the shoes on the other feet, the Beatles showed simultaneously poetic and political with "Blackbird", with some of the most sublime lyrics ever to grace a pop song, while Dylan quite often resorted to lyrical trivia. "All the Tired Horses" anyone??? A beautiful song but hardly a lyrical stretch...

And as for the lyrical style of "A Day In the Life" being a rip of Dylan, Dylan in turn "ripped" the style from Woody Guthrie, who in turn took it from some black bluesmen, who in turn took it from the folk traditions of many European countries when their migrant citizens brought their music with them to America. Do your homework Mik.

Music and art does not exist in a cultural vaccuum. Even the greatest artists draw influence from what came before and from their contemporaries. It's not theft, it is quite simply the absorbing of cultural influences. What makes them great artists is what they do with those influences.

Dylan and the Beatles were two of the pivotal acts of the rock era, and a creative symbiosis clearly existed between the two, a fact that both parties have often confirmed. It speaks more to Mik's limitations than to The Beatles music that he cannot recognise this.

I suggest you go and watch "Don't Look Back" - the brilliant D.A. Pennebaker documentary on Dylan's early '60s UK tour - and see how Dylan demolishes the prat in the dressing room and the reporter at the press conference when they attempt to trumpet their ignorance as fact. The man would have you for breakfast for what you said Mik...

captaindobie · 20-12-2004, 1:28 AM

This really wasn't meant to be a 'my favourite artist is better than yours' thread was it?
And anyway....Mr Johnny Cash p****d on anything Dyan ever did...well, didn't he?
Oh, back to the thread. Yes, 'A Day In The Life' is fantastic. I often site this as my favourite Beatles track. Although, as i am subject to wild mood swings, 'Across The Universe' & 'Tomorrow Never Knows' often take its place.
However, at this moment in time, i will settle for 'In My Life' as the greatest song ever... (by the Beatles)

mik · 20-12-2004, 9:15 AM

The_Pauly no it isnt selective reading, I picked that song because from the top off my head they were both taken from the broadsheets. Add to the fact I never said Dylan invented the form, it was to illustrate that the beatles chased Dylans tail in the 60's of which there is no doubt. Just because I didnt mention 16th century ballads doesnt mean I am unaware of them. Add presumption to trumpet and ignorance and that would be poetic.
My initial post stated my opinion on the thread titled "'A Day In The Life': The greatest song of all time" and to me lyrically Dylan far outshines The beatles so I feel there is no comparison and stated that. Captaindobie is quite correct perhaps the thread should have read "greatest song ever... (by the Beatles)" though he isnt about Johnny Cash although Dylan himself would probably agree

Btw greatest song ever... (by the Beatles) one of Harrisons but hard to say which

the_pauley · 20-12-2004, 2:15 PM

Quote:

The_Pauly no it isnt selective reading...

Yes it was. Highly selective. You stated that the Beatles wrote nothing that wasn't nursery rhyme and "...of no significant meaning other than the song..." (a statement that is absolute twaddle in itself) and that Dylan wrote songs of political import. You then selected two songs to prove your point. I then used the same tactic (selectivity) to disprove your point.

You make it sound like "political import" is the yardstick by which one measures the worth of a song. Again if you knew Dylan as well as you think you did, he eschewed that viewpoint and all but abandoned the political for the personal/introspective after his first three or four albums and had no time for anyone who berated him for doing so. Again, see "Don't Look Back".

Quote:

it was to illustrate that the beatles chased Dylans tail in the 60's of which there is no doubt.

Highly subjective not to mention totally wrong. History and the recorded testimony of both Dylan and The Beatles state otherwise. Each, for a while, influenced the other in pretty much equal measure. Neither chased the other's tail. There was mutual admiration and respect. No one "bowed" to anyone - get real mate!

Quote:

A day in the life is a blatant rip off from many dylan songs of taking news and turning into song

If as you say Dylan didn't invent the form, then why say that the Beatles ripped him off? Surely more accurate to say that lyrically the song was in the style of a centuries old lyrical tradition as were many of Dylan's. But no, you state that The Beatles stole from Dylan, because that suits your puerile "my band is better than your band" stance. Truly sad!

Quote:

Just because I didnt mention 16th century ballads doesnt mean I am unaware of them. Add presumption to trumpet and ignorance and that would be poetic.

Where did I presume that you were "unaware" of anything of the sort? And who mentioned 16th Century ballads?

Quote:

...lyrically Dylan far outshines The beatles...

Totally irrelevant. The Beatles were more melodically inventive and innovative and Dylan was more so lyrically. So what? All that matters is the end product and particularly how form and content merge, which from both parties was outstanding and has more than stood the test of time.

Besides, how do you compare "Masters of War" to "Something"? As a love song the former fails miserably, while as a "protest" song the latter sucks. A completely pointless exercise. One of Dylan's lyrical Gods is Cole Porter. not much of "...political import..." to be found in his catalogue is there?

I thought this kind of debate was dead and buried by the end of the '60s. You sound just like a pre-teen girl bickering over which boy band is best. Get a life...

mik · 20-12-2004, 3:41 PM

the_pauly your not even seeing what is being said, you should step down from your high horse and read my reply. Also go and watch "Dont Look Back" (your Dylan reference) and see where "the pratt in the dressing room" btw a highly successful prat who went onto found his own record label and Dylan lays into him for putting his own interpretations onto Dylans much like you are with me.
Read my previous reply, I chose hattie carroll because it was taken from a broadsheet the same as a day in the life of, no reason other than that. Where have I mentioned political import, again see the "pratt in the dressing room"
About the beatles influencing dylan, that is without doubt and I havent contested it though the equal measure I would and there lays my comment about being ripped off and following dylans tail. Perhaps I could have phrased it different and for you not to acknowledge that Dylan blazed the way in the 60s and everyone not just the beatles followed his tail shows how little you know of the man.
The beatles were indeed more melodically inventive and innovative but have I said otherwise? Again we come to "political import" what has this to do with me?? again see the "pratt in the dressing room".
I'm not bickering with anyone the_pauly and if anyone looks like a bickering schoolgirl I know where my money is. I offered an opinion and got shot at for doing so, if it differs from the norm well I apoligise but the world is full of opinions and btw, I love the beatles

the_pauley · 21-12-2004, 1:23 AM

Quote:

Where have I mentioned political import...

"...while dylan goes on to condemn the society he lives in which is still very resonant in the world of today, some 40 years later..." - is what I was summing up with the phrase "...political import..." I consider lyrics that "...condemn the society he lives in..." would come under the umbrella of political / social comment. I take it you weren't refering to the price of fish?

Perhaps like the "...prat in the dressing room..." you need it "writ large"?

Quote:

Read my previous reply, I chose hattie carroll because it was taken from a broadsheet the same as a day in the life of, no reason other than that.

Yes you've already mentioned that and I've already answered the point.

Quote:

Perhaps I could have phrased it different and for you not to acknowledge that Dylan blazed the way in the 60s and everyone not just the beatles followed his tail shows how little you know of the man.

Er, in a previous post I stated...

"Dylan and the Beatles were two of the pivotal acts of the rock era..."
And you accuse me of refusing to "...acknowledge that Dylan blazed the way in the 60s..." You really are struggling here aren't you? Don't forget - other people are reading this too and can see you making yourself look foolish.

Quote:

I offered an opinion and got shot at for doing so,

No - someone merely disagreed with you. Careful - your persecution complex is showing...

Quote:

and btw, I love the beatles

Jeez - I'd hate to hear your opinion of them if you hated them.

mik · 21-12-2004, 9:25 AM

[QUOTE]...while dylan goes on to condemn the society he lives in which is still very resonant in the world of today, some 40 years later..." - is what I was summing up with the phrase "...political import..." I consider lyrics that "...condemn the society he lives in..." would come under the umrella of political / social comment. I take it you weren't refering to the price of fish?
Perhaps like the "...prat in the dressing room..." you need it "writ large"? [QUOTE]

you are missing the key point and it is not political, it is the depth of the song!! Your whole argument is based on points that I am not making, can you not see that? Your whole comments in this thread are based on me staking a value on political import and it makes you appear to me pretty one sighted, your own.

[QUOTE] Yes you've already mentioned that and I've already answered the point.[QUOTE]

and missed again

[QUOTE]No - someone merely disagreed with you. Careful - your persecution complex is showing... [QUOTE]

You wasnt the person that shot, the only shots you fired were at yourself

[QUOTE]Jeez - I'd hate to hear your opinion of them if you hated them. [QUOTE]

Far from hate them and they played a very major part in the history of popular music and the music we hear today but it is undeniable that Dylan opened the doors and the rest followed.

the_pauley · 21-12-2004, 6:32 PM

Oh God!

This is getting scary! I think you genuinely believe you scored a few points there!

One last little thing before the rest of us catch the shuttle back to Planet Reality...

Quote:

...but it is undeniable that Dylan opened the doors and the rest followed.

Er, no. That would have been Elvis Presley. Dylan (and Lennon for that matter) has also stated that in several interviews.

Feel free to ramble on unfettered. Would love to carry on the debate but my head is beginning to hurt from banging it against that brick wall...

Bye.

mik · 22-12-2004, 6:20 PM

The_pauly is the last word important to you my friend? Scored a few points? I never realised that this board operated on a point system, wheres the scores?
tbh I was going to leave this thread but today I came across a dvd while shopping and watched it this afternoon, i recommend it to you or indeed anyone who is a fan of 60's music and is interested in the history of the 60's. It is called "Tales from a golden age, Bob Dylan 1941-1966" the_pauly I suggest you buy it and watch it and then come back to this thread and re-read it and then maybe you will realise what a sanctimonious p**k you are

Mylo · 22-12-2004, 6:21 PM

Ok guys time to leave there I think.

Mylo

**Stuart Wright** · 23-12-2004, 9:28 AM

the_pauley and mik both get a 1 day ban for using language and tone which is clearly against the rules.