ipods & mp3's

malc1 · 07-12-2003, 8:03 PM

I'm new to the forum so I'll apologise in advance if you've heard my questions before. I've been reading about ipods in this weeks' newspaper but, are mp3's as good as cd audio and if so, what do Iuse to change cd audio to mp3.

Frankie_D · 07-12-2003, 9:25 PM

mp3s can be as good as CDs as you can change their quality, but even at normal quality most people cant tell the difference between cd and mp3.

You can use iTunes to convert songs from cds onto mp3s on your computer, that software should come with your iPod.

Frankie

malc1 · 07-12-2003, 9:58 PM

Thanks Frankie_D, but if cd audio is "ripped" to mp3 at a lower bitrate, how can it be restored to "better" mp3, isn't information lost on each conversion? As I only listen to mp3's on a Pc and have no way of comparing that with the cd sound from my hifi, I'm sceptical until I've done so. What I'd really like to try is to rip cd to mp3 and then "unrip" it to see if I can tell the difference. If I can't then everything is cool and I can move to mp3 and feed those into my hifi.(with some additional hardware)

Frankie_D · 07-12-2003, 10:01 PM

well you cant unrip them only delete but after that you can re-rip them at a higher bit rate and compare then

malc1 · 07-12-2003, 10:34 PM

So, there is no way of converting mp3 to cd audio?

Frankie_D · 07-12-2003, 10:37 PM

no because you have already taken out alot of the data

malc1 · 07-12-2003, 11:14 PM

Thanks again Frankie_D, that has closed one avenue, going back to ipods, isn't it one of the sad facts of life that all hard drives fail eventually, is it better to wait until card capacity is raised enough to have an "ipod with no moving parts?

andy572 · 08-12-2003, 6:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by malc1
So, there is no way of converting mp3 to cd audio?

Yes, you can convert mp3 files to CD audio. However, depending on the listener, 'severity' of the mp3 encoding and hardware used, they may not sound as clean as an original CD track.

Why not follow your earlier thoughts and go through the CD > mp3 > CD process and see what you think? Your own ears are the best, after all!

N.B. If that needs clarification, what sounds good or bad to one person may be quite the opposite to yourself.

So, go on - give it a go!

Frankie_D · 08-12-2003, 9:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by malc1
Thanks again Frankie_D, that has closed one avenue, going back to ipods, isn't it one of the sad facts of life that all hard drives fail eventually, is it better to wait until card capacity is raised enough to have an "ipod with no moving parts?

Well i think hard drives last for ever really ive still got a computer 8 years old which still has a working one, and it wont be years and years until sold state catches up if ever.

Frankie

malc1 · 09-12-2003, 6:41 PM

Andy I would try it if I could find some software that will do mp3>cdaudio.

Frankie_D The reliability of hard drives is something I've read. I had two hard drive failures but it was on new drives but the replacements were okay.

Frankie_D · 09-12-2003, 8:25 PM

Well hard drive failiures are usually due to pc manufacturers buying the cheapest possible eaning poor quality but you can rest assured apple always chooses quality over price, just look at their computers!

malc1 · 09-12-2003, 8:33 PM

Fankie_D. I've little experience of Apples but the odd one I have used has been OK. The report I read was in the Telegraph on Saturday and the emphasis was on functionality and what it means to the cd industry rather than sound quality and reliability. Has anyone done a review that concentrates on all aspects of the ipod?

cwick · 09-12-2003, 8:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by malc1
Has anyone done a review that concentrates on all aspects of the ipod?

This review is pretty comprehensive.

malc1 · 09-12-2003, 9:38 PM

It is pretty comprehensive, unfortunately I'm part of the 90% of computer owners who uses a PC, if I've understood the article it praises the AIFF which is only available to Apple users. As you say, it may be possible that the mp3 is perfectly good enough for my ears but up to now mp3's don't have the sublety of well recorded cdsalthough I haven't yet heard them through my system to get a good comparison. This may be where we started but thanks a lot Frankie_D for the info and your views.

cwick · 09-12-2003, 9:47 PM

malc1,

Just re-read your posts. I'd suggest you try downloading Apples iTunes and playing around with it. It will support AIFF and AAC formats on your PC, it will let you rip to whatever format you choose (MP3 also), play them back for comparison, and burn CDs of your compilations.

It's a free download from here

Cheers, Carl.

malc1 · 09-12-2003, 10:20 PM

cwick Sorry I didn't acknowledge you in my last message, it is a good review. I'll try your suggestion. Thanks

Ivor_Monkey · 11-12-2003, 10:17 PM

Why are people hung up on mp3? Ipod allows better quality than mp3. For example, AAC (similar to mp4 -I think) are better quality sound formats and larger file sizes.

Ipod also allows you to store digital images.

Ipod allows you to play your digital music library thru your hifi without the sound of noisy computer fans.

There are cheaper players (look for dell), but ipods are the undoubted market leader. Burning cds is now old technology.

itunes (which is available even for windows) is a brilliant music classifying system.

Do you mean you haven't been to an ipod party yet?

malc1 · 12-12-2003, 10:04 AM

I hadn't heard of ipods until last weekend.
I've now downloaded itunes for windows but I still have 600 cd's.
My cd player plays nothing but audio cds.
My car cd player plays nothing but audio cds.
Wy portable cd player plays nothing but ausio cds.
No one has said that ipod quality is better than audio cds

JohnG · 12-12-2003, 12:10 PM

I'm hoping to save up enough pennies to buy one to take to the Euro Championships in Portugal next year. Something like this is ideal - saves you taking loads of cds or minidiscs, and it's also a topic of conversation with the local females

malc1 · 12-12-2003, 1:25 PM

Hope you save up enough pennies in time, and that you have time to get your music on to it. I thought I read the other day that itunes is not available in UK yet.

cwick · 12-12-2003, 1:47 PM

The iTunes Music Store (iTMS) isn't available outside of the US yet, although you can browse and listen to 30 second samples - in itself a fantastic resource for finding new stuff.

Personally, I wouldn't use it anyway. I'd rather pay a little extra and have the CD (or the option to pay a little extra, have the CD shipped, and the MP4's downloaded - now that would be nice).

JohnG · 12-12-2003, 4:06 PM

A couple of questions
I assume I'll be able to recharge abroad using one of those European plug conversion thingies ?
Can you get little travel speakers for it ?

cwick · 12-12-2003, 4:29 PM

JohnG,

Yes to both.

The UK Apple Store sell Creative TravelSound portable speakers, but pretty much anything will work - just use the 3.5mm jack on the top of the iPod to plug 'em in.

Cheers, Carl.

JohnG · 12-12-2003, 4:40 PM

Thanks Carl

malc1 · 12-12-2003, 5:21 PM

cwick. The article I read in the Telegraph last week predicted the demise of cds in three years. Technology marches on and if cd and mp4 can march side by side then so much the better. Increased quality and/or more compact storage(smaller files) are good reasons to move on and backward compatibility eases the pain.

16-12-2003, 6:42 AM

1. I tunes lets you set your preferred format and compression rate.
2. Including importing uncompressed AIFF or WAV.
3. There is a Mac Itunes "plug-in" that lets you rip using the open-source Lame (generally considered the best sounding MP3 encoder) That's what I now use. Lame is available for Wintel too.

As regards hard disk failures - you would normally have your music library on one or more computers as well as the ipod, so you should be safe against a single drive failure.

malc1 · 16-12-2003, 7:33 PM

ancientgeek
I've not got round to looking at itunes yet but.
Isn't AIFF exclusive to Apple, I run a PC, is AAC as good?
What's WAV quality like, I've only seen it used for Windows sound effects?
Where is Lame obtainable from?
To find out out if I like things, I've been downloading mp3, that's all that seems to be available.

*Whiting* · 16-12-2003, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by malc1
ancientgeek
I've not got round to looking at itunes yet but.
Isn't AIFF exclusive to Apple, I run a PC, is AAC as good?
What's WAV quality like, I've only seen it used for Windows sound effects?
Where is Lame obtainable from?
To find out out if I like things, I've been downloading mp3, that's all that seems to be available.

malc1, you're best bet is to simply experiment and see what suits your good self. Spend an evening ripping/encoding the same track(s) from a CD into different formats/bitrates (constant and variable) and see which one you are happy with/can live with...like most people you'll end up wanting to trade filesize against quality of sound.

E.g. I know a couple of people happy with MP3's ripped at 128kbps which provides a relatively small filesize but to my ears, I can hear the limitations so I go for a variable bit rate (via LAME) of approx 200 kbps which (I THINK) gives better listening quality but results in a larger file and therefore I can store less tracks on my iPod than my 128kbps friends....

...that's just an example...I've not tried other (e.g AAC) formats as I've reached something I'm happy with for the time being.

malc1 · 20-12-2003, 3:30 PM

Whiting. Is there a Lame player you would recommend, I've a dvd player that is connected to my hifi that plays mp3, is Lame compatible. The sound quality from my pc isn't up to much.

*Whiting* · 20-12-2003, 8:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by malc1
Whiting. Is there a Lame player you would recommend, I've a dvd player that is connected to my hifi that plays mp3, is Lame compatible. The sound quality from my pc isn't up to much.

Sorry -- I should have been a bit clearer. LAME is an encoder used for creating MP3s (either from ripping from CD or by converting from another format). The product I use on my PC (Media Center) has a LAME plugin which allows me to use it to convert WAV files to MP3.

Do a search on google for more info...or someone here may point you towards a freeware piece of software which uses the LAME encoder.

16-12-2003, 6:42 AM	#26
ancientgeek Guest Posts: n/a	1. I tunes lets you set your preferred format and compression rate. 2. Including importing uncompressed AIFF or WAV. 3. There is a Mac Itunes "plug-in" that lets you rip using the open-source Lame (generally considered the best sounding MP3 encoder) That's what I now use. Lame is available for Wintel too. As regards hard disk failures - you would normally have your music library on one or more computers as well as the ipod, so you should be safe against a single drive failure.
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