Fantasia And Fantasia 2000

[ARNOLD AKIEN]

No doubt I'm looking in the wrong places BUT I've been unable to find any listing of either Fantasia or Fantasia 2000 - or indeed the American Box Set of both films that had all sorts of add on extras - in The Lists of either of the Two High Definition DVD standards.

I'm just doing a little preliminary digging around, since I don't have a Samsung BD-UP5000 yet, but it strikes me that Walt Disneys Fantasia in all of it's incarnations is the Ideal High Definition DVD. So - am I missing something somewhere ?

[FOXCLOSE]

Originally Posted by ARNOLD AKIEN

No doubt I'm looking in the wrong places BUT I've been unable to find any listing of either Fantasia or Fantasia 2000 - or indeed the American Box Set of both films that had all sorts of add on extras - in The Lists of either of the Two High Definition DVD standards.

I'm just doing a little preliminary digging around, since I don't have a Samsung BD-UP5000 yet, but it strikes me that Walt Disneys Fantasia in all of it's incarnations is the Ideal High Definition DVD. So - am I missing something somewhere ?

Fantasia is a Disney Crown Jewel title.

They only release these once every ten years, if we are lucky! Disney expects to start releasing crown jewel titles in HD next year.

[the_pauley]

Has anyone actually considered how much a cartoon will be improved in HD over a decent standard DVD transfer? It's something I've always wondered about, as I've never seen a cartoon on DVD that has made me sit up and take notice over the picture quality, unlike hundreds (thousands?) of "real" movies.

It's not as if there is the level of detail that needs to be resolved that there would be in images of real people, objects and surroundings. Most colours on characters will be perfectly flat and background colour shadings will have nowhere near the gradations of hues that real images have. Also what is there (of consequence) that could be sharper or better defined? The pencil lines of the drawings?

Anyone know of any articles / links that have discussed this?

[dbs2]

Originally Posted by the_pauley

Has anyone actually considered how much a cartoon will be improved in HD over a decent standard DVD transfer? It's something I've always wondered about, as I've never seen a cartoon on DVD that has made me sit up and take notice over the picture quality, unlike hundreds (thousands?) of "real" movies.................

Have you not seen 'The Simpsons Movie' trailer.... I downloaded the 1080p one on the PS3 and on the PJ it is just Superb..

Yes but The Simpsons is a 2007 movie , Fantasia is 1940.I doubt very much that cartoon animation which is essentially 2d will be significantly improved.However im happy to be disproved.

[Moosh]

Not to take this thread too off topic but to answer the question about whether or not older cartoons would look any better in high-definition...

If you've got a copy of The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938) on HD DVD then there are two remastered Looney Tunes classics included: "Rabbit Hood" with Bugs Bunny, and "Robin Hood Daffy" with Daffy Duck. They are very, very good and show how good remastering can be. It does also make you impatient wondering if they'll ever release the whole Looney Tunes collection on high definition!!

Cheers
Moosh

[andythescientis]

To actually answer the question, the only disney "classic" announced so far is sleeping beauty, which i believe is slated for august 2008 release.

I think the market is still far too small at the moment for disney to wade in with any of their big classics. Particularly as their likely to continue the short release runs, only re-releasing every few years. Their certainly not going to release them when the best selling titles are selling in the 100,000s rather than the millions.

[the_pauley]

If you've got a copy of The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938) on HD DVD then there are two remastered Looney Tunes classics included: "Rabbit Hood" with Bugs Bunny, and "Robin Hood Daffy" with Daffy Duck. They are very, very good and show how good remastering can be.

I have this disc and whereas the reaction on seeing the main feature when compared to the standard DVD was "Wow!", the reaction on seeing the cartoon shorts when compared to the superbly remastered Looney Tunes DVD box sets was - "Hmm - not really a lot of difference." Hence my initial point about how much real improvement there is to be gained with HD versions of cartoons.

The "Robin Hood" main feature had images of real people and objects and surroundings to resolve - the weave in the fabric of clothes, the texture of hair, subtle gradations of flesh tones, the dense shrubbery of the forest, the subtle gradations in the shading of the foliage, the sheen of metal, etc, etc, all areas where HD excels.

Whereas all there was to be resolved in the cartoons was red, blue, green, yellow, and any other number of flat colours and the black outlines around them. How much is there to improve on after the already sterling remastering job on the standard DVDs? How do we make a flat area of coloured paint look more "real".

[ARNOLD AKIEN]

It all Depends doesn't it? Just consider that whilst the original Fantasia was launched in the 1940s ..... dependent on where in the world you were of course since travel wise it was a VERY different world way back then ... it was State Of The Art at that time and Walt Disney himself was devoted to the Concept of Fantasia which was that it was a film that should be continually up-dated. In any event way back then the film was intended to be shown at its best in specially equipped theaters that had very special sound systems.

Even given the last release of Fantasia with Fantasia 2000 and all sorts of add on extras I do doubt whether we have seen the original movie as it was originally intended to be seen ... and we certainly haven't seen it at home no matter how sophisticated our home cinema projections/multiple speaker systems might be the available technology simply isn't up to it. Still, given that the color gradations on Fantasia were quite subtle on many of the segments in the 1940s original let alone the 2000 version, and the sound must have been astonishing way back in the 1940s, I do think that a Twenty First Century Hi Def Version of the last release with all the added extras would be a real market leader for any High Definition system so, even granting Disney's tight Grip upon their Legacy material, I wonder why they aren't building The Anticipation of a High Definition Launch of a Fantasia Package?


In the mean time, and thinking of cartoons, I must have a look at the list of available Hi Def titles and see if it includes " Who Framed Roger Rabbit " I mean .. 4 Academy Awards, Spielberg .... they just can't have missed that one can they?

[the_pauley]

It took years for RR to arrive on DVD, so don't hold your breath for a swift HD release.

The colour gradations on a cartoon image are nowhere near as complex as the colour gradations in real images. They are simply combinations of a few (often as little as two or three) flat colours and nowhere near the complexity of the shading and detailing on something like human skin.

There is nothing in Fantasia in terms of fine detail that would present a challenge for the resolving capabiities of standard DVD, let alone hi def. Indeed Snow White in places probably has a finer and more delicate colour palette than Fantasia and the DVD managed stunning results.

Based on what I've seen so far HD doesn't benefit cartoon material enough to make a difference. I'd love to be proven wrong and find that there is more visual pleasure to be gained from the likes of Fantasia and Pinocchio, but I doubt it.

Perhaps if Mr.D is reading this he could enlighten us? Are you there Keith?