downloading movies - Good? Bad?

Originally Posted by Ger

apart from the morality side of this, is it not dangerous to download these considering the amount of worms/viruses/trojans............... that are out there. the websites that offer these may not be 100% safe (I have never done it myself).

I dont use websites, i get them from 0 Day FTP Sites

This new Anti Piracy campaign they have going though is hilarious, making out that everyoner who downlaods pirated DVDs is sort sort of smuggler and organised criminal lol

[Simon6776]

Originally Posted by Garyd

I love the idea that its ok to "recieve stolen goods" as long as your not a thief Out of interest do you think the stuff would have been stolen if there was no market for it? after all by downloading you are helping and encouraging that market. or do you think that the uploaders are some kind of robin hood figures protecting the world from the "nasty evil film companies".

I wasn't saying it's OK, I was trying to clarify the term 'thief', which is technically being used incorrectly. If you bought a kettle from a market stall, knowing it was stolen, that doesn't make you the thief.

Of course, if there was no market for illegal downloads (i.e. if there was no Kazaa, Morpheus, Supanova, etc), then it would simply drive people who were intent on distributing bootleg material, back to the CD Fairs and car boot sales. What do we do, ban everything? There will always be a market for illegal products, and no one is going to stop it, but that doesn't mean I approve. I just don't take the moral highground that bootlegging is killing the industry. 'The Industry' is a multi-billion pound / dollar organisation, and it will take more than a bloke at the back of a cinema with a camcorder to bring it down. Furthermore, as most of the people in this thread (and on these forums) are avid DVD collectors (I have well over 400), even if people do download the odd movie to 'preview', if they are going to later buy it, where's the problem?

[CarlB]

The poster with "60 DVDs" made me laugh. I have over 600 DVDs and quite a few of those I would not have bought had I seen the film in advance. Did I choose to download and 'try before you buy'? No. Is it because I am stupid. Some may say 'yes', but I say it's because downloading/copyright infrigement/theft is illegal, plain and simple.

Attempts to rationalise this and somehow push blame back onto studios for releasing sub-par product is a joke. If it's that bad, why waste your time to download and watch it? If it interests you enough to watch, then pay for it as you know you should, and trade it if you don't like it (my Dad's collection would be non-existent otherwise). My new, self enforced policy, due to lack of space for DVDs is to wait until titles come to Sky that I am not that bothered about. If it was good enough that I would be tempted to download, then its good enough that I want to buy. Still, Hellboy proved that as a system it sure isn't perfect...

Just don't try to convince us it's some moral crusade to fight the capitalist studios. The people that worked on the film you're downloading have no say over how the studio chooses to release it - how soon the SE comes, how soon the 3 disc Extreme Edition comes, but a film that was a big smash on sales might just help them land their next job.

[Gary D]

I'd just like to point out that i'm not taking the moral high ground on the subject. my own thoughts are that i didn't pay 5k for a HC to put pirated disks in it. Or to watch movies that are much better seen on a large screen, why would anyone want to ruin spiderman 2 watching it on pirate?

we all make our own choices on this subject.


Gary

[sapper44]

How about this then.What if you buy the dvd all legal like,then you lend it to family and friends to watch so they don't have to pay for it either what is that classed as.Is this not wrong as the people watching them are not paying the film makers ets,etc.

[Simon6776]

Originally Posted by sapper44

How about this then.What if you buy the dvd all legal like,then you lend it to family and friends to watch so they don't have to pay for it either what is that classed as.

That's classed as having family and friends who let you pay for DVDs with your money, then take advantage of your good nature by borrowing them from you. Tell them to buy their own!

[Azrikam]

Originally Posted by sapper44

How about this then.What if you buy the dvd all legal like,then you lend it to family and friends to watch so they don't have to pay for it either what is that classed as.Is this not wrong as the people watching them are not paying the film makers ets,etc.

Good point. Unless I'm mistaken, that falls under "fair use" as far as copyright law is concerned. But, these "fair use" addendums are slowly being taken away from consumers under the guise of protecting the industries from "pirates". That's one of the reasons why copyright law needs an overhaul.

So, is borrowing a DVD from someone theft?
How about borrowing it from a library?
How about if someone rips off a copy of their DVD and sends it to you, then you delete it after watching it? How is this any different from borrowing their DVD? How is this any different from downloading the film to "sample" it?

I've got no answers, just questions. But I don't think this issue is as black and white as some people think.

[CrispyXUK]

Originally Posted by Garyd

I'd just like to point out that i'm not taking the moral high ground on the subject. my own thoughts are that i didn't pay 5k for a HC to put pirated disks in it. Or to watch movies that are much better seen on a large screen, why would anyone want to ruin spiderman 2 watching it on pirate?

we all make our own choices on this subject.


Gary

Im with you on that one, but at the end of the day if I can copy a full quality dvd for free I will, if it is a film a really like I will hunt down the best available version.

wish I'd copied eight legged freaks

Originally Posted by CarlB

The poster with "60 DVDs" made me laugh. I have over 600 DVDs and quite a few of those I would not have bought had I seen the film in advance. Did I choose to download and 'try before you buy'? No. Is it because I am stupid. Some may say 'yes', but I say it's because downloading/copyright infrigement/theft is illegal, plain and simple.

Attempts to rationalise this and somehow push blame back onto studios for releasing sub-par product is a joke. If it's that bad, why waste your time to download and watch it? If it interests you enough to watch, then pay for it as you know you should, and trade it if you don't like it (my Dad's collection would be non-existent otherwise). My new, self enforced policy, due to lack of space for DVDs is to wait until titles come to Sky that I am not that bothered about. If it was good enough that I would be tempted to download, then its good enough that I want to buy. Still, Hellboy proved that as a system it sure isn't perfect...

Just don't try to convince us it's some moral crusade to fight the capitalist studios. The people that worked on the film you're downloading have no say over how the studio chooses to release it - how soon the SE comes, how soon the 3 disc Extreme Edition comes, but a film that was a big smash on sales might just help them land their next job.

I tell you what makes me laugh that you think i am trying or even want to justify anything, to be perfectly onest i dont care what you think or anyone, i will carry on downloaidng regardless lol i am 1 hour away from Kill Bill Vol 2 i will watch and see if its worth my purchase, nothing will change i will keep on doing it

Downloading and trying before i buy is precisely why i dont have 600 DVDs many which i will never watch and are a complete waste of money the 60 i have i bought after watching a download first because i will watch over and over, i dont just buy any old rubbish

[Gary D]

Originally Posted by sapper44

How about this then.What if you buy the dvd all legal like,then you lend it to family and friends to watch so they don't have to pay for it either what is that classed as.Is this not wrong as the people watching them are not paying the film makers ets,etc.

my DVD's go to no one! not even my old mum.


Gary

[Marc]

Originally Posted by betamac

Thats fine i am happy for you, i personly dont want to pay for a movie twice (cinema and then DVD) so i will download it and watch it, whatever works for you,

P.S I have over 60 bought DVDs and i have to say onestly if i had not of downloaded the movies first i would probably have less than 10 DVDs

I agree, i'm not a fan of the cinema, because of all the other annoying people, and i'm even less of a fan of paying £6.50 to see a movie then spend another £15 to see it again. Whether it's legal or not, i'll download a movie rather than see it in the cinema. Then if i like it enough i'll buy the DVD. I own over 500 DVD's, so there's not a person around who can say i'm taking money from the pockets of the people behind the movie. Maybe if they did legal downloads of movies for £1 or something, then i might do that, but i will very rarely go to the cinema.

[CarlB]

I tell you what makes me laugh that you think i am trying or even want to justify anything, to be perfectly onest i dont care what you think or anyone, i will carry on downloaidng regardless lol i am 1 hour away from Kill Bill Vol 2 i will watch and see if its worth my purchase, nothing will change i will keep on doing it

Downloading and trying before i buy is precisely why i dont have 600 DVDs many which i will never watch and are a complete waste of money the 60 i have i bought after watching a download first because i will watch over and over, i dont just buy any old rubbish

I have Kill Bill vol 2 arriving tomorrow on Region 1 legitimate DVD. The only thing that will stop people downloading is if people start getting nicked for it, which I would like to see happening. I have always been against all forms of piracy, from music to software to movies, it's all the same. Someone somewhere has profited, even with downloads someone was probably paid to get the master copy to make a download available in the first place. Plus these great copies available for download only server to make the life of a pirate that much easier, they can source great copies of films for duplication without even leaving home. It's all a nasty business and seems to be one of the socially acceptable crimes these days, but I still think it's totally wrong on every level. It's a minority opinion though, most people I know don't even think twice about downloads and think it's the main benefit of broadband.

[Philly112]

Of course most people don't think twice about downloading!! As far as the CD/DVD downloaders are concerned, as long as the technology allows them to do it, and it's all nice and comfy in their own homes, surely they're not criminals. Criminals don't own PC's right, and wouldn't know how to use them if they did.
And they don't shave.
It must be the studios fault for churning out rubbish, or overpriced CD's. And those REAL crooks at Blockbuster... And the cost of cinema tickets - my god, what is the world coming to.
Lets face it guys, it's something for nothing; lets have no justification, just admit it - it's easy to do with no comeback.
Doesn't make it morally or legally justifiable though.

[Azrikam]

Originally Posted by CarlB

It's all a nasty business and seems to be one of the socially acceptable crimes these days, but I still think it's totally wrong on every level.

On every level? Do you think it's a crime to have friends over to watch a DVD? What about watching them with a boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife? I'm sure very few couples buy 2 copies of all their DVDs. If I buy a DVD and a few friends come over with a few beers to watch it are they stealing from the studios? What if I hang around Blockbuster long enough to watch an entire DVD they have playing on the TV screens? I saw it, yet I didn't pay for it. How about bringing a DVD over to your dear old grannies house during a rainy day when her arthritis is acting up so she can watch it while you do some handy-work around her house? (ok, that's low, but you see what I'm getting at )

See, I don't see any difference between these actions and "sampling" films. I can count on two hands the number of DVDs I own that I bought sight-unseen. All the rest, I either saw on video, at a friends, on TV, in the theatre, or on my PC.

Are there people who go too far? Yes. But the point I'm trying to make is that downloading a film doesn't necessarily make you some kind of arch-criminal.

[CarlB]

Do you think it's a crime to have friends over to watch a DVD? What about watching them with a boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife? I'm sure very few couples buy 2 copies of all their DVDs. If I buy a DVD and a few friends come over with a few beers to watch it are they stealing from the studios?

These are actions are perfectly legal as they do not constitute a "public showing" of the material which would then be a breach of copyright. It gets messy to be sure, but if you charge or advertise the 'event' you are in breach, but it is entirely legal to watch a film with your wife without incurring the wrath of FACT or whoever.

As an aside, whatever happened to "looking forward" to something, the event of a big release drawing near? I really want the new Prodigy album due in August, and I know it is readily available for download on the internet thanks to the postings on these boards, but I wouldn't think of downloading.

And you' re right, downloading does not make you an arch-criminal! Just a plain old criminal.