[Digihoho]

Sorry for another Diesel v Petrol thread. Here are the facts first:

Annual mileage:8K
Daily use: commute to and from work/Home
Route: A roads to city centre (non motorway)

Current car: 52 Reg 1.4 Petrol Corolla (68K on clock), averaging 35-40mpg
Works required for next MOT: New Clutch, front and back discs and all pads.

Car only worth £1,500-£1,800, so instead spending to sort out the clutch and brakes, thinking changing to an 07-08 Corolla Verso, yes sticking to Toyota, so reliable and boring I know, but you cannt fault Japanese cars!

So do I go for a Petrol or diesel Verso, considering the mileage I do a year, I am sure many will say not worth going for a diesel. But the 1.8 Petrol will do less MPG compared to my Corolla which is not great either, so prefer 40+ mpg on any car I choose from now. Noticed that Diesel now costs around £0.09 more than unleaded, so to fill up a full tank will cost over £5 more which can buy me roughly 4 litres more unleaded and take me further so to speak. How do I decide? Just based on the MPG?

[blackrod]

What about purchase price and residual values?

[NewBeetle]

Usually diesel version will be more expensive to buy and service. Obviously when doing big miles this is offset with the better MPG but low mileage drivers rarely see any benefit from a diesel.

[Digihoho]

I have set a budget of £8k, so probably looking at 07 Diesel or 08 Petrol. Yes servicing will probably be more for the diesel version, but Road tax is £50 cheaper for the diesel. Insurance I would think the same. I don't know, it's just when you hear diesel drivers bragging 50+ mpg compared to 35mpg on my current car, makes you want a diesel!

[blackrod]

I fully understand, it is hard to work out the true cost of ownership so hopefully those with a lot more knowledge than me will be along shortly to disregard my initial opinion to go with the petrol!

[TRL]

At 8k miles per year, I really wouldn't bother. The Toyota diesels I've driven we're gutless compared to the German and even the French cars, so one more diesel advantage (big torque) won't be there. At 8k miles, I'd be buying a bigger petrol engined car with all the toys, and enjoy the thing.
Thinking about it, your daily commute is so short, you'll NEVER achieve the claimed mpg anyway, by a long long way.

Tony

[mbren26]

To get decent mileage from a diesel they need a decent run. My daily commute is 8 miles each way. I avg 38mpg. Can get 50+ on a decent run but not on my daily commute. I'm seriously considering chopping my car in (Volvo s60 d5) and getting a Honda civic type r. Fuel consumption is nowhere near as good but after factoring in slightly cheaper insurance cheaper servicing and cheaper parts ( if things go wrong) also cheaper fuel. For the sheer fun factor alone I think it's well worth it and don't think it will be that much different, cost wise.

[Trollslayer]

If it helps, I have been thinking aobut a new car and it turns out that on a new car you have to be doing 20,000 miles a year to make diesel worthwhile.
Can't calculate it but 8,000 miles on a seocnd hand car doesn't sound like diesel mileage.

[Delvey]

I swapped from petrol to diesel for one reason mainly, I needed a bigger car for towing

I had a 1.3L Hyundai accent. Brilliant car that was reliable (owned 5 years, new clutch but that was my fault) and good on fuel around town. On motorways it was good around 60mph but over that due to small engine it drank fuel.

Bought a 406 diesel estate, and can say the MPG is roughly the same. However on the motorway the 406 is brilliant. Comfy and quiet, with lots of pull for overtaking.
I have the option of using A and B roads or the motorway for commuting, and now with the diesel I use the motorway, as I do average 45-55mpg. It's a 30 mile round trip on the motorway compared to 20 on the smaller roads, but the diesel is going further than the petrol

[Inked]

Originally Posted by Trollslayer

If it helps, I have been thinking aobut a new car and it turns out that on a new car you have to be doing 20,000 miles a year to make diesel worthwhile.
Can't calculate it but 8,000 miles on a seocnd hand car doesn't sound like diesel mileage.

That depends on the costs of the cars in the first place, the difference in fuel economy, and any differences level of depreciation between the petrol and diesel models

[TRL]

To get the performance of my four cylinder twin turbo diesel Merc I'd need a 3.0/3.5 litre V6 petrol. Nuff said.

[Trollslayer]

Originally Posted by Inked

That depends on the costs of the cars in the first place, the difference in fuel economy, and any differences level of depreciation between the petrol and diesel models

This was on a Golfwith the Blue motion option.

[GBDG1]

Honestly, it's not worth obsessing about MPG at your milage. Based on current prices the difference between a petrol doing 35mpg and a Diesel doing 45mpg would be....

*Drum roll*

£18 per month!

In my opinion that is not enough to justify the higher purchase cost, more expensive servicing, poor power & performance. If I did your milage I would buy a bargain uneconomical car and waft around, spending the money saved on petrol

[FZR400RRSP]

Originally Posted by GBDG1

, poor power & performance

This bit baffled me, please explain.

[TRL]

Me too. ��

[mjn]

Me 3!

[un1eash]

I've just brought a diesel over a petrol and we only did 3-4k miles last year.

Yes the petrols are cheaper to buy but the diesel is cheaper to insure, run, tax and has better performance then the petrol models.

[itcosthowmuch]

Thing that concerns me with such low mileage and short runs is the failure of a diesel particulate filter, there seems to be quite a few horror stories about these failing because they are not regenerated and the cost to renew would certainly wipe the smug 'low mpg-cheap insurance/tax' grin off

[FZR400RRSP]

Originally Posted by itcosthowmuch

Thing that concerns me with such low mileage and short runs is the failure of a diesel particulate filter, there seems to be quite a few horror stories about these failing because they are not regenerated and the cost to renew would certainly wipe the smug 'low mpg-cheap insurance/tax' grin off

The simple answer to that is that if a DPF fails, you don't replace it.
No need to.
They're an item the manufacturer is required to fit by law, but there's no requirement in law for you to keep it fitted.
Not part of the MOT or anything.
Of course, there is a cost in getting a DPF bypass done (it requires ECU changes)
But I'd venture it's cheaper than a new DPF, only for you to face the problem again in time.

[paulyoung666]

Even with the new mot regulations coming out ...

[FZR400RRSP]

Originally Posted by paulyoung666

Even with the new mot regulations coming out ...

The new rules state petrol cars fitted with a catalyst when sold must still have it fitted at MOT.
But there isn't anything I've seen to state that a diesel car fitted with a DPF when sold must still have it fitted at MOT.
It also mentions ECU mods for power, but not ECU mods to get around DPF removal.

[PCthug]

I had a Saab 9-3 diesel, it had 175bhp, 0-60 in 8 seconds (or there abouts), 125mph, 56mpg, handled really well, service interval of 18,000 miles, cheap to service due to not having plugs (except glow plugs). Great car...

HOWEVER, i had the EGR valve go twice on it (plus LOADS of other problems not due to being a diesel i might add).
I heard that the EGR valve on diesels soots up quite regularly on low mileage diesels as they really dont like short journeys (i did a 40 mile commute, and about 18,000 per year though).

[un1eash]

Both my dad and sister only do short trips to and from work, less then 5 miles and neither have had any problems with their diesels.

If it goes on my Alfa its an easy diy fix to clean it out.

[paulyoung666]

Originally Posted by un1eash

Both my dad and sister only do short trips to and from work, less then 5 miles and neither have had any problems with their diesels.

If it goes on my Alfa its an easy diy fix to clean it out.

Do they have dpf's though ...

[Prowse]

How long (in time) is your commute?

8,000 miles/year is certainly in the petrol region rather than diesel.

If your run to work is in traffic or stop-start then you certainly won't get the benefit from diesel. I had a BMW 123D M-Sport Coupe, lovely car (and fairly quick), but only got 33MPG on my (7 minute) daily commute. On a motorway run I did manage 65+MPG, exactly as the specs.

It's been suggested that DPF's are going to become part of the MOT as the government is looking at the particulates diesels produce - if your car was originally fitted with one, it will have to be present and working.

If your commute is 20 minutes or so and a clear run, then you may see some benefits.

Personally, I'm back in the petrol camp - new petrol engines are much more efficient for most running about. Anyone doing 12-15,000+ miles a year would be better (economically) in the diesel camp IMHO.

[Digihoho]

Daily commute journey time 30 to 40min covering around 10 miles, so roughly 20 miles a day.

Still undecided, the 1.8 Petrol is within budget, going for a diesel means going for an older car ie 07 Petrol or 06 Diesel (with more miles on clock too).

[Pistachio]

Here are a couple of links that may help. The first is a tool that can help determing running costs of your specific petrol vs diesel query.

The second is a bit of a scare story about maintanance costs of diesels. It does sound like a daily mail type story, but worth having a quick read. I am sure there are a huge number of drivers that have no problems at all with their diesels. I guess that there are probably similar stories for people with petrol engines.

Just some food for though :-)

http://car-costs.parkers.co.uk/parke...used_total.php

http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2012...of-diesel-cars

[TRL]

That's just a garage not knowing what it's doing. The type of engine isn't relevant.

Tony

[Curry Monster]

I own 2 cars:

VW touran 1.6s petrol - does 8K a year averages 35-40mpg

and

VW Golf mk5 1.9tdi - does 30K a year averages 50-55mpg

The golf is quicker,smoother and pulls like a steam train everywhere...The touran is fine for dropping the kids off to school etc but any long trips are done in the golf.

Wish I had bought the touran with a diesel engine originally...

[Exemplar]

Ditto the above we have a Mini Clubman petrol and a Renault Grand Scenic diesel and the Renault is quicker, smoother, more powerful and more economical even round town.