[cardiel]

I just bought a Sony 40W4500 and im satisfied with it, but i just found out that the shop i bought it at just got 40W5500 in for just 100£ more. So now im wondering is there big differance between these two? Probably the W5500 should be better cause its an upgrade of the W4500 ? or am i wrong? So im not sure what to do , either i keep my W4500 or should i get the W5500? Is it worth the extra money??

[ChrisGgr]

Well,from what it seems,the W5500 is a worthy upgrade with new features,not only technical improvement(blacks,colours are the main areas)

[Foxy77]

Originally Posted by CHRISGEO

Well,from what it seems,the W5500 is a worthy upgrade with new features,not only technical improvement(blacks,colours are the main areas)

What are the improvements to blacks and colours?

[andymc]

The W5500 is an 8 bit panel whereas the W4500 is a 10 bit panel. I have no idea what difference this makes but I have a feeling that the 10 bit panel is better. Im sure someone with more technical knowledge will pick up on this and explain more. I have the same situtation as I was about to go and buy a 46W4500 this morning and now I am wondering if I should wait!!! Any suggestions

[munkymorgy]

10 bit Panels seemed to be selling point for panels in 2008, however it is my understanding that most samsung and sony panels are going to be 8bit for 2009.

10bit panels should technically be better but all current video sources are 8bit.
so the scaling to 10bit is an extra processing step that will introduce distortion.

This thread [http://www.avforums.com/forums/lcd-t...t-v-10bit.html] seems to have some good answers to the 10bit vs 8bit panel. It looks like Sony are saying the 8 bit panels is cheaper to manufacture but the improvements from bravia 2 to the new bravia 3 means the 10 bit panel is unnecessary.

[ChrisGgr]

Originally Posted by Foxy77

What are the improvements to blacks and colours?

much deeper blacks and better colour reproduction

Originally Posted by andymc

The W5500 is an 8 bit panel whereas the W4500 is a 10 bit panel. I have no idea what difference this makes but I have a feeling that the 10 bit panel is better. Im sure someone with more technical knowledge will pick up on this and explain more. I have the same situtation as I was about to go and buy a 46W4500 this morning and now I am wondering if I should wait!!! Any suggestions

in actual content no benefit!

[Foxy77]

Originally Posted by CHRISGEO

much deeper blacks and better colour reproduction

Sorry but what is this based on? Having scanned through the HDTV review it seems to suggest that if anything the 4500 has superior colour repro due to different backlight technology? Also whilst it talks about excellent black levels it does not say over and above the 4500.

I realise this is one review but please explain where you are deriving this from

[ChrisGgr]

the blacks are about equal after reading the HD TV TEST review,but with auto dimming the blacks are much darker down to 0,02cd/m2 vs the 0,05 which is the normal measure.Colour reproduction although looking worse in charts in reality is about the same(after calibration)

[mlodyosiem]

i was waiting for 40w4500 for 3 weeks to find out that the manager of the shop decided to cancel his order for w4500's.
he assumed everyone will want the free upgrade to w5500, the catch was that i had to wait a month...
one month later and i'm still waiting, supposed to get it yesterday but i'm still waiting

i have read both threads for w4500 and w5500 and i am not really sure if that "upgrade" if you like is actually better than w4500: Input Lag, Game Rendering, 8 Bit panel, narrow viewing angle.
Does it mean Sony didn't actually improve the quality of the picture and speed of the connection and instead just added some cheep gadgets like: 4th HDMI, AppliCast or 100 000 contrast ???

I play a lot on my PS3 so Input Lag and Game Rendering (if noticable) would be my main concern.
apperantly w4500 has + 0-10ms where w5500 has +17-33ms comparing to some samsung F96 which already has more or less 30-35ms

head to head comparising:
Face to Face : cameras, printers, ... - DigitalVersus

You can perfectly see what difference does it make not to have input lag in here:
http://redirectingat.com/?id=223X354...ouselaggn6.swf

According to hdtvtest viewing angle in w5500 100' in w4500 90' but if you look at the pictures from the head to head w4500 is a definite winner, so what is truth????

w4500
Sony KDL40W4500 / KDL40W4500U Review
w5500
Sony KDL40W5500 Bravia LCD Calibration & Benchmark Tests

These are from the same range, older and younger series so we can't say that one is better for gaming and the other one is better for watching movies.
So which one is better?

[Tequila Sunset]

i know people will say what hi-fi are 'in love' with sony.

but this video made me buy my 40w4500

What Hi Fi Awards 2008

best purchase i have ever made.....

they only rated the w5500 4/5 stars.

[ChrisGgr]

Originally Posted by mlodyosiem

i was waiting for 40w4500 for 3 weeks to find out that the manager of the shop decided to cancel his order for w4500's.
he assumed everyone will want the free upgrade to w5500, the catch was that i had to wait a month...
one month later and i'm still waiting, supposed to get it yesterday but i'm still waiting

i have read both threads for w4500 and w5500 and i am not really sure if that "upgrade" if you like is actually better than w4500: Input Lag, Game Rendering, 8 Bit panel, narrow viewing angle.
Does it mean Sony didn't actually improve the quality of the picture and speed of the connection and instead just added some cheep gadgets like: 4th HDMI, AppliCast or 100 000 contrast ???

I play a lot on my PS3 so Input Lag and Game Rendering (if noticable) would be my main concern.
apperantly w4500 has + 0-10ms where w5500 has +17-33ms comparing to some samsung F96 which already has more or less 30-35ms

head to head comparising:
Face to Face : cameras, printers, ... - DigitalVersus

You can perfectly see what difference does it make not to have input lag in here:
http://redirectingat.com/?id=223X354...ouselaggn6.swf

According to hdtvtest viewing angle in w5500 100' in w4500 90' but if you look at the pictures from the head to head w4500 is a definite winner, so what is truth????

w4500
Sony KDL40W4500 / KDL40W4500U Review
w5500
Sony KDL40W5500 Bravia LCD Calibration & Benchmark Tests

These are from the same range, older and younger series so we can't say that one is better for gaming and the other one is better for watching movies.
So which one is better?

narrow viewing angle was reported only by one review,we dont know if this is true.8bit panel has proven not to make a change.Game rendering is again sth used only by 1 review and I am not at all sure that its evident.Input lag now,other than the measures,I didnt see any owner complaining about evident gaming lag.As for the dynamic contrast,I only keep the actual blacks advantage it gives,other than the numbers.The same applies to the much better processing

[Foxy77]

Originally Posted by CHRISGEO

narrow viewing angle was reported only by one review,we dont know if this is true.8bit panel has proven not to make a change.Game rendering is again sth used only by 1 review and I am not at all sure that its evident.Input lag now,other than the measures,I didnt see any owner complaining about evident gaming lag.As for the dynamic contrast,I only keep the actual blacks advantage it gives,other than the numbers.The same applies to the much better processing

Are you actually paid by Sony to come on here and promote the new model Chris? You seem to determined to reel off flimsy reasons why the 5500 is superior but frankly the reviews don't seem to back that up, at the very least its no better and I think the poster above hit the nail on the head regarding tacking on useless gizmos just to make the spec list longer.

People need to realise that the likes of Sony have to release new models every few months as a marketing ploy not because they actually have a better model. In the current climate it is not unthinkable that they've cut a few corners with this one.

[ChrisGgr]

If I was actually working or paid off,I d heavily promote the W4500,in order to sell the few pcs left.Maybe you are looking for a reason to oppose to the W5500?Do you think that BE3 is a useless gizmo?let alone the multimedia features which are limited(only applicast has and will show its potential very soon).The panel downgraded,so what?If there was a notable disadvantage I would be the first to point this out,and in the case of 10bit panel I ve always been of the opinion that it is just a marketing trick,and yes this was a trick to make the spec list longer last year and on the 2009 models that will use it,along with xv colour.

[Craig uk]

Having seen both in action I really couldn't see any difference in the black level. Maybe the 5500 just edged it but the overall tone and colour of the image is nicer on the w4500 to my eyes anyway. I was looking to upgrade to 5500 but I simply don't think its a better tv.

After testing panasonics 42g10 today which I was also thinking of upgrading to, I can safely say Im sticking with the w4500 for now anyway.

[JoeA3]

Originally Posted by Craig uk

Having seen both in action I really couldn't see any difference in the black level. Maybe the 5500 just edged it but the overall tone and colour of the image is nicer on the w4500 to my eyes anyway. I was looking to upgrade to 5500 but I simply don't think its a better tv.

After testing panasonics 42g10 today which I was also thinking of upgrading to, I can safely say Im sticking with the w4500 for now anyway.

Can I ask why you'd even consider upgrading so quickly? Surely the W4500 is "future-proof" for at least 12-24 months (and for most people, a lot longer than that!), and by swapping it any sooner the significant cost surely well out-weighs any tiny benefits?

[Craig uk]

Originally Posted by JoeA3

Can I ask why you'd even consider upgrading so quickly? Surely the W4500 is "future-proof" for at least 12-24 months (and for most people, a lot longer than that!), and by swapping it any sooner the significant cost surely well out-weighs any tiny benefits?

Yes sure.

If the 5500 was a improvement I would sell my 4500 and just pay the difference, it would only be a matter of a couple of hundred pounds

I usually upgrade my tv every year....yes I know I'm mad

[mlodyosiem]

...i just came back from the shop and the delivery date of the W55 is unknown again, but.... apparently the W45 is coming in tomorrow's delivery

i suriously was afraid to go for W55 so this helped me in making up my mind.

na input lag and a stunning picture that's what i want

[Ozzie]

I love playing my PS 3 especially my shooters and of course the legendary PES.

Anyway cut a long story shory I have the 46W4500, which I've had now for about 3 months and find the lag negligable allthough it is noticeble if youve just been on the PC, but hey ho nuthins goona beat me old monitor.

Anyway my m8 has upgraded his old Plasma to the 46W5500 and so we all headed to his house on sunday night for a few games instead of mine to try out the new set.

Oh dear, what a disappointment, it was like the old days of waiting for the cross hairs to catch up to where your pointin, seriously sloow.

So if you do a lot of gaming then there's no point going for the new set, but then theres not too many 45's left now.

[mlodyosiem]

this is exactly an answer that i was looking for, buddy!!!

now i know for sure that award winning telly of the year can't be replaced that easily.

so all those fancy gadgets and pointless accessories my arse!!!

i didn't even like the look of it anyways

now i just hope your man will have my set tomorrow.

[jamesh1000000]

Ive not noticed input lag at all on the 40W5500 and I play First person shooters on xbox 360 and PS3, I guess its one of those things that picky people find that are trying to find faults with everything, in my opinion the 40W5500 is a great TV as im sure is the 40W4500.

[mlodyosiem]

Originally Posted by jamesh1000000

Ive not noticed input lag at all on the 40W5500 and I play First person shooters on xbox 360 and PS3, I guess its one of those things that picky people find that are trying to find faults with everything, in my opinion the 40W5500 is a great TV as im sure is the 40W4500.

James,
most likely you are right, it all depands on user's needs and what's in buyer's head.

i have seen 45's picture, but i've never seen 55's one.
i guess i'm a little bit afraid to buy something without seeing it first.
45 has the best picture i have seen so far (or maybe i'm being biased again).

i just really hope he'll get them today

[chewie2k]

Im still confused over this whole "lag" argument. Ive got the W5500 and I cant see ANY lag... and to be honest I think you need to be a ninja or a cyborg to notice 20-40ms lag times differences

Quote from Wiki

"
Simple reaction time is the time required for an observer to respond to the presence of a stimulus. For example, a subject might be asked to press a button as soon as a light or sound appears. Mean RT for young adults is approximately 190 milliseconds to a detect visual stimulus, and approximately 160 milliseconds to detect an auditory stimulus.[5]"
"


so we are talking an additonal 20% of your normal reaction.... hmmmmm cant see it making a difference... but Im sure I will "inflame" the masses with my ignorance... ho hum....

[Arcaine]

Originally Posted by chewie2k

Im still confused over this whole "lag" argument. Ive got the W5500 and I cant see ANY lag... and to be honest I think you need to be a ninja or a cyborg to notice 20-40ms lag times differences

Quote from Wiki

"
Simple reaction time is the time required for an observer to respond to the presence of a stimulus. For example, a subject might be asked to press a button as soon as a light or sound appears. Mean RT for young adults is approximately 190 milliseconds to a detect visual stimulus, and approximately 160 milliseconds to detect an auditory stimulus.[5]"
"

so we are talking an additonal 20% of your normal reaction.... hmmmmm cant see it making a difference... but Im sure I will "inflame" the masses with my ignorance... ho hum....

I think it does depend on the person, back in the day I was an online unreal tournament player and after months of playing everyday in clan matchs and practice you will notice (and get annoyed at) very small changes in connection speed/lag so I can understand how sensitive people can get to this kind of thing.
That being said I have a PS3/W5500 and have yet to give the whole system a proper test in terms of input lag. I will try this weekend and post my thoughts. I find it hard it hard to find the time because the Wife gets motion sickness if she looks at the screen when I am playing FPS games.

[mlodyosiem]

i got my 40w45 since tuesday night and i'm absolutely amazed with the quality of the picture, but.......

the same night in the middle of watching united - porto match the sound disappeared and instead horrible noisy static blasted and nearly gave me a heart attack.
the same thing happened this morning.

unfortunately will have to return this unit and get it replaced, definitely not going to buy some other set though

PS
40 inch is enough for a normal size leaving room (semi detached house)

[Craig uk]

I was able to audition a w5500 last week for a couple of days with the view to buying the set

First thing to note was the exceptional black level, this was the best offering I have seen from a non led model. Unfortunately the clouding on this panel was quite bad and unacceptable in my opinion.

So I was able to take the set back and try another w5500, this second one was better but still had some spotlighting in the corners which was annoying but acceptable IMO.

I promptly calibrated it to the same settings I have on my 4500. The clouding was still noticable with dark scenes and it was obvious that this set had a different colour pallet to the 4500.

I wasn't sure if it was better in the first place, so I done back to back tests with my 4500, first with skyhd (hollyoaks) then the dark knight on bluray. Like I said the colour pallet was clearly different and to me the image looked
slightly sharper on the 5500 but I also noticed the image wasn't quite as smooth as my 4500. Motionflow was enabled but I found myself noticing harsh paning of the camera and a slight loss of detail in movement which I have never noticed on my 4500, I have always been very impressed with motionflow on my 4500 and use it with all my viewing, the 5500 simply didn't seem as smooth. Getting back to the colour tone, I felt that the 5500 had more pop off screen and the greens seemed to look more saturated, I really did struggle to decide which had the better colour. After watching the first couple of chapters of the dark knight I began to come see that the overall colour tone of the 5500 just looked a little forced and not as easy or natural to my my eyes. IMO the 4500 had a nicer tone which appeared more natural to my eyes, once I realised this there was no doubt which one I prefered.

Three reasons really made me send the 5500 back. 1- noticably more clouding, I know this is not representitive of all panels but I checked 2 and they were both a lot worse than my 4500 which is just about perfect. 2- motionflow (to me) didn't seem to work quite as well as 4500. 3- colour tone didn't appear as natural on the 5500, bearing in mind I have been watching my 4500 for 6 months and had 2 days with 5500 I felt happy that I had spent enough time to really judge.

This is just my opinion and I don't doubt for a second that many will disagree, yes the black level is considerably better and white balance is a great bonus but it just wasn't enough to convince me that the 5500 was an improvement over the w4500.

[5ilencer]

@craig uk
nice comparison BUT, your signature says u have the z4500!! so u compared z4500 with w5500?? then there is no doubt in your decision cause the z-series is better i think...

[Craig uk]

Originally Posted by 5ilencer

@craig uk
nice comparison BUT, your signature says u have the z4500!! so u compared z4500 with w5500?? then there is no doubt in your decision cause the z-series is better i think...

Yes thats right, first I had an 40x2000 then 40w4500 then I tried the 40W5500, returned two of them, then got a 40Z4500.

Yes about six months ago I wasn't convinced the the Z was worth the extra money over the w4500 but my opinion changed after I was able to test one at home.

You can look at tv's all day long in showrooms and read review after review but until you actually get one home and test it with different material its hard to really say just how the set performs.

Z4500 is clearly a better set then the w4500 or w5500 and now can be had for a reasonable price, thats why I snapped one up

And I would recommend the w4500 over the w5500, only problem is they are hard to get hold of now.

Hopefully sonys 2010 range will tick ALL the right boxes

[5ilencer]

alright then i think ill invest that extra money for the z-series, didnt read any seriously bad about that tv yet

[skyform]

Originally Posted by Craig uk

Having seen both in action I really couldn't see any difference in the black level. Maybe the 5500 just edged it but the overall tone and colour of the image is nicer on the w4500 to my eyes anyway. I was looking to upgrade to 5500 but I simply don't think its a better tv.

I agree, there is almost no difference between W4500 and W5500, it's not worth upgrading, especially not because new Sony TV's are made cheaper then last years and if you are a gamer you get a worse input lag.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Craig uk

Yes thats right, first I had an 40x2000 then 40w4500 then I tried the 40W5500, returned two of them, then got a 40Z4500.

Yes about six months ago I wasn't convinced the the Z was worth the extra money over the w4500 but my opinion changed after I was able to test one at home.

You can look at tv's all day long in showrooms and read review after review but until you actually get one home and test it with different material its hard to really say just how the set performs.

Z4500 is clearly a better set then the w4500 or w5500 and now can be had for a reasonable price, thats why I snapped one up

And I would recommend the w4500 over the w5500, only problem is they are hard to get hold of now.

Hopefully sonys 2010 range will tick ALL the right boxes

Just out of interest, where were you buying your tvs from?

Online I'm assuming?

What reason did you give for exchanging all your sets?

How did you get a demo in your home for a couple of days?

The reason I'm asking is because if you bought it froma sony centre for example I'd like to know how you manged to try all those tvs and exchange them no problem.

I've got the w5710 from sony centre and just noticed smearing on blacks and dark colours and I'm not impressed.

Does the w4500 suffer from that?

I wish I hadn't read these bloody forums, Someone mentioned the fault, I went to see if mine suffered from it and now that I know it's there I keep seeing it