[signothetimez]

Which has better picture/overall quality?

[Chanser]

Pioneer obviously....

[signothetimez]

why, I thought LED had better overall quality?

[signothetimez]

anyone? I need as detailed a reply as i can get!

[Suave]

Originally Posted by signothetimez

anyone? I need as detailed a reply as i can get!

Hi,

I was in the same predicament & went for the Kuro in the end. It is a much more complete product and the reliability, build quality and superior components swung it for me. The Pio has much better blacks, more natural picture, better motion, natural skin tones and none of the backlight bleeding probs. I think Sammy have a really great exterior but can't help thinking they use the cheapest components to make their products - At least with the Kuro, one does not have to worry so much about it going wrong or having the nightmare of dealing with Samsung customer service! No review I have read of any LED LCD has had the reviewer saying that they will be getting rid of the Kuro and replacing it with an LED LCD set, especially an edge-lit one!


Suave!

[signothetimez]

Wow, thanks so much. It must be a shame Pioneer decided to quit the business of making/selling TV's.

[LV426]

As this is not about OLED nor FLCD, I'm moving it. However, it could go to either Plasma or LCD. Randomly, I'm choosing LCD. Moving >>>>>>>>>>>

[Nielo TM]

I blame Samsung for this LED confusion

[Nielo TM]

Originally Posted by Chanser

Pioneer obviously....

That's debatable

Providing the Pioneer in question is an LCD and the Samsung is edge-lit, the difference between the two could be made negligible via professional calibration.

All you need is a colorimeter, PC and compatible software (along with a little background knowledge in displays).

[Bloodflowerz]

The real question you have to ask is whether you prefer the plasma picture or an LCD (LED) picture. I for one find plasma TVs to be dull. LCD Tvs are more in your face.

My old Samsung LE46A786 LCD had local dimming LED backlight which had perfect blacks (better than any Pioneer). With the B9000 series out soon which will also be local dimming LED, I am confident that it will too surpass the Pioneer. I have not done any research into the Sony X4500 but that is LED local dimming so that should have perfect blacks too.

And for anyone who does not believe my A786 had perfect blacks, see here:

Samsung LE40A786 Review

"True black (0 cd/m2) possible with [Smart LED] on"

[Bloodflowerz]

Best word of advice is take a few bluerays with you and go see the Pioneer and Samsung. Do not go by what anyone tells you is better. Everyone has there own preferences. Some love the plasma look, some love the LCD look. You need to decide the type of picture you like....

[beardtm]

Originally Posted by Bloodflowerz

The real question you have to ask is whether you prefer the plasma picture or an LCD (LED) picture. I for one find plasma TVs to be dull. LCD Tvs are more in your face.

My old Samsung LE46A786 LCD had local dimming LED backlight which had perfect blacks (better than any Pioneer). With the B9000 series out soon which will also be local dimming LED, I am confident that it will too surpass the Pioneer. I have not done any research into the Sony X4500 but that is LED local dimming so that should have perfect blacks too.

And for anyone who does not believe my A786 had perfect blacks, see here:

Samsung LE40A786 Review

"True black (0 cd/m2) possible with [Smart LED] on"

cmon you know as well as i do thats only if its displaying a pure black screen.
it cant do that with stuff on the screen.

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by beardtm

cmon you know as well as i do thats only if its displaying a pure black screen.
it cant do that with stuff on the screen.

"...LED TVs can turn areas of the screen completely off...."

[stuman]

ok, it might be able to atain perfect black, but then put anything on the screen and you get a glow effect around the lit area. this will be an issue until they have 1920*1080 LED's behind the screen. and then at the end of the day you will still get LCD motion issues.

the only reason to get an "LED" samsung would be if you want to use the least amount of power possible and don't mind compromising picture quality for it.

At the moment in my opinion LED is a compromise.

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by stuman

ok, it might be able to atain perfect black, but then put anything on the screen and you get a glow effect around the lit area. this will be an issue until they have 1920*1080 LED's behind the screen. and then at the end of the day you will still get LCD motion issues.

the only reason to get an "LED" samsung would be if you want to use the least amount of power possible and don't mind compromising picture quality for it.

At the moment in my opinion LED is a compromise.

The glow affect was a problem with last years local dimming LED panels such as the A786 and A956. However, I had the A786 for 4 months and not once did I ever see this glow. I am not saying it is not there, just that I never noticed it.

The glow thing hopefully will be solved in the upcoming B9000 series. As for 1920 * 1080 LEDs, that is something I am looking forward to. God knows when that will happen.

People worry too much about what reviews and others say about a particular TV and never end up purchasing, thinking that they would rather wait for the perfect TV, which will never happen. Yes, it is nice to get an overal feel as to which one consumers feel is better, but here, the OP is comparing plasma with LED backlit LCD. Two very different panels. We all know there are a lot of differences between a LCD and plasma. You just have to search these forums.

All I am trying to do is get the OP to demo both panels and choose the one which is preferable. Has anyone bothered asking the OP what the TV will be used for? Gaming, HD, SD, a mixture of all? This, along with viewing angles, input lag, lighting conditions will help the OP to make up his/her mind.

Signothetimez, tell us what you will be using the TV for. If you want a "detailed" reply, then you need to give us a detailed explanation as to what you will be using the TV for.

[signothetimez]

Well, I own a PS3 to play Blu-Ray movies on mainly. So I would say Blu-Ray and TV picture quality. Thanks for the nice response btw!

[stuman]

Originally Posted by signothetimez

Well, I own a PS3 to play Blu-Ray movies on mainly. So I would say Blu-Ray and TV picture quality. Thanks for the nice response btw!

well if gaming isn't on the menu then go with plasma as it will give you a better picture with normal tv. lCD's have a harder time with upscaling pictures.

Stu

[5to1]

Originally Posted by stuman

well if gaming isn't on the menu then go with plasma as it will give you a better picture with normal tv. lCD's have a harder time with upscaling pictures.

Stu

Actually I would disagree with the upscaling comment in this case. IMO the new Samsungs are excellent upscalers (I believe the review on this website agrees on this point). Given the reputed investment they put in, that would probably be expected.

Purely judging upscaling I'd say its on par with the Kuro.

I do agree with the other points you made about the Kuro though.

The only point I would add is that aesthetically I believe the 6/7/8 series Samsung LED TV's are a huge notch above the competition. Given the response I've had from friends and family, I would think I'm not in the minortiy with that opinion.

This may not matter to some, but its a perfectly valid reason to consider when purchasing. In most households the TV is the focal point of the living room, so you should consider how it looks when its off.

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by 5to1

Actually I would disagree with the upscaling comment in this case. IMO the new Samsungs are excellent upscalers (I believe the review on this website agrees on this point). Given the reputed investment they put in, that would probably be expected.

Purely judging upscaling I'd say its on par with the Kuro.

I do agree with the other points you made about the Kuro though.

The only point I would add is that aesthetically I believe the 6/7/8 series Samsung LED TV's are a huge notch above the competition. Given the response I've had from friends and family, I would think I'm not in the minortiy with that opinion.

This may not matter to some, but its a perfectly valid reason to consider when purchasing. In most households the TV is the focal point of the living room, so you should consider how it looks when its off.

Well, for me picture is first and foremost. You are spending all that money not for a picture frame, but for a TV. However, yes, the Samsung B6000, B7000, B8000 and the prettiest TV's out there but I always liked the Pioneer design too. None of that stupid Sony speaker bar crap attached to the bottom. Just a minimalistic rectangular frame. No silly curves, just the way I like it.

I have to agree that the new Samsung SD upscalling is amazing! It totally rips my A786 to shreds. They apparently spent over a Billion dollars on the upscalling chip and it sure as hell shows! Great stuff.

@signothetimez,

Are the TVs the same price?

What is the warranty for each?

The Pioneer will give you better viewing angles but will you be viewing at an angle more than 90 degrees?

The Pioneer will give you better motion handling. However, unless both screens are side by side, you will not notice the difference.

The SD upscalling may be marginally better with the Pioneer, but if it is, this margin is very small compared with the latest Samsungs LCDs.

The Pioneer has the least amount of input lag but as you are not a gamer, this does not matter anymore.

I will not recommend you a TV because I do not like Plasma screens myself and so my opinion is biased, especially considering the fact that I own a Samsung B7020. Take into account the points I raised above and get a demo of both of them. The Pioneer may have a better picture overall because of better blacks but only you can decide which TV is best for you....

Good Luck.

[Bibby_83]

Hi,
I just wanted to say that Pioneer Elite is a brand that is only used in the US for their higher end stuff like Plasma and Projector TVs. It started when Pioneer introduced an expensive Hifi range in the late 80s and through the 90s. It is known as Pioneer reference over here and in Asia I think; the Elite tag is for the USA, to make them feel special.

[5to1]

Originally Posted by Bloodflowerz

Well, for me picture is first and foremost. You are spending all that money not for a picture frame, but for a TV. However, yes, the Samsung B6000, B7000, B8000 and the prettiest TV's out there but I always liked the Pioneer design too. None of that stupid Sony speaker bar crap attached to the bottom. Just a minimalistic rectangular frame. No silly curves, just the way I like it.

I'm not suggesting aesthetics should be a primary reason, but given a TV for most will be a focal point in the room I think its an important factor. One which people often overlook in reviews etc. Could it be because of their (the reviewers) target demographic? Quite possibly I think.

I can tell you from experience it was the reason this TV even entered my shortlist (my GF fell in love with it). Ofcourse the picture then had to be acceptable in comparrison to the others on the list. In the real world I imagine aesthetics have a bigger impact on choice then marginal differences in pq.

[stuman]

ok, with the aesthetics of the TV, yeah mention no extra speaker bars, and silly curves, well how about the silly transparent edging? or the soft plastic they make it out of that gets swirling on it as soon as you try to scrub off the layers of dust that the glossy plastic conducts?

another thing, build quality. as much cheap soft plastic as can be conceived into a TV is where samsung lies. touch buttons that rarely work and i believe i have heard better sound quality from a mobile phone on loudspeaker.

sorry about this rant however im biased against samsung. because of their deliberate mis-information in the advert and any company who use that sort of marketing ploy cannot be given the time of day.

stu

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by stuman

ok, with the aesthetics of the TV, yeah mention no extra speaker bars, and silly curves, well how about the silly transparent edging? or the soft plastic they make it out of that gets swirling on it as soon as you try to scrub off the layers of dust that the glossy plastic conducts?

another thing, build quality. as much cheap soft plastic as can be conceived into a TV is where samsung lies. touch buttons that rarely work and i believe i have heard better sound quality from a mobile phone on loudspeaker.

stu

I actually like the transparent edging. It is sexy!

I agree about the soft plastic issue. When I attempted to clean my A786, it had horrible scuff marks as a result. I now only clean the bezel with compressed air, which works great and only takes like 10 seconds!

I never touch my bezel and I use the remote so could not care less about the touch buttons. And, as for speakers, I really do not think they are as bad as you lot make it out to be. Surely, if you are spending so much money on a TV you should have a decent Dolby/DTS setup to go with it? Otherwise, it's like watching a movie with when eye closed LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!

[stuman]

Originally Posted by Bloodflowerz

I actually like the transparent edging. It is sexy!

I agree about the soft plastic issue. When I attempted to clean my A786, it had horrible scuff marks as a result. I now only clean the bezel with compressed air, which works great and only takes like 10 seconds!

I never touch my bezel and I use the remote so could not care less about the touch buttons. And, as for speakers, I really do not think they are as bad as you lot make it out to be. Surely, if you are spending so much on a TV you should have a decent Dolby/DTS setup to go with it? Otherwise, it's like watching a movie with when eye closed LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!

the transparnt edging is then a subjective taste item then as much as the speaker bar on sony or the curve panasonic insist on using.

i understand that using surorund sound is pretty much called for nowadays, but with speakers that bad, why include them at all? (if your going to do something, do it properly)

once again why use touch buttons that don't work, save some pennies and put normal ones on.

but wait, these things make it an easy sale as the general public like gimmicky crap. much like the name "LED TV" which is my biggest hate.

THIS is a LED TV - http://media.techeblog.com/images/cowboystadiumled.jpg

NOT THIS - http://www.uncrate.com/men/images/20...ung-led-tv.jpg

mod comment: images altered to links, don't hotlink to images from servers you do not have permission to do so from

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by stuman

THIS is a LED TV - http://media.techeblog.com/images/cowboystadiumled.jpg

mod comment: images altered to links, don't hotlink to images from servers you do not have permission to do so from

Hey, I got one of those in my back garden too!

What Samsung should do is put proper buttons on the top of the TV, like Sony W4000 series, and either not include speakers, or include a detachable sound bar.

The Panasonic lip curve at the bottom is just plain wrong man!

Actually, I said to my brother the other day that Samsung are false advertising as on the box of my B7020, it states LED coloured in Red, Green, Blue when actually the LED bulbs are only white!

[Bloodflowerz]

Originally Posted by 5to1

In the real world I imagine aesthetics have a bigger impact on choice then marginal differences in pq.

Unfortunately, this is true, this is so damn true...