[Azzin]

Looks possible.....

Originally Posted by El Reg

The days of O2's exclusive hold on the iPhone are probably numbered - T-Mobile has told us it's in talks with Apple about ranging the iPhone 3G in the next few months.

The deals being discussed only include the iPhone 3G, and O2's exclusive on the 3GS seems to be secure. But even this represents a major shift in how Apple markets the iPhone, which currently relies on network exclusives to get a decent subsidy; giving that up shows either greater confidence or reflected disappointment in how O2 has priced up the latest offering.

T-Mobile has been telling callers that the company is in talks with Apple about ranging the iPhone 3G, and Orange is also rumoured to have plans regarding Apple's last-version handset. That would leave O2 to explain to users why the 3GS is better; doing Apple's marketing for it.

O2's exclusive on the iPhone will have cost it dearly in terms of subsidy - manufacturers know what an exclusive is worth and use them to extract a big subsidy. Several years ago your correspondent wrote a piece claiming the iPhone would fail, largely because of Apple's reluctance to accept the operator shilling in the form of handset subsidy. Apple may have been naive about the mobile industry, but it learnt quickly (more quickly than your author expected) how important the subsidy was, and how the company paying that subsidy is the real customer - which is why we suddenly see MMS enabled, and tethering disabled.

The other way to increase subsidy is to link to lots of operator services - a menu item for "Get more games" is worth a few quid, while a pre-installed music application linked to the operator can make an expensive handset cheap. But those options aren't available to Apple, which wants all the services revenue for itself.

In the USA AT&T had hoped that its exclusive on the iPhone would make the company "cool", but in reality it's become the whipping boy for everything that goes wrong with the handset - blamed for poor reception, limiting tethering and failing to support MMS. Customer loyalty is to Apple, not AT&T, and much the same thing has happened in the UK, where iPhone users love Apple but have little time for O2.

So Apple have little to lose by allowing the iPhone 3G on to other carriers in the UK, even if the 3GS remains exclusive to O2 for the moment. Customers don't consider themselves to be using Orange, T-Mobile or O2 any more, they're Apple's customers regardless of who happens to be carrying the signal... which is just how Cupertino would like it.

Linky.

[PoochJD]

Hi,

To be honest, this is one of the situations where it's clearly "too little, too late".

With the option of unlocking and jailbreaking an iPhone, being an easy option for most average PC users now, which then results in an iPhone being usuable on almost any UK mobile network, I think the only real losers here, are the networks themselves.

The iPhone will sell, no matter what network has it, because it's a bloody good product!

The fact that only O2 had it available in the UK, was - as far as I know - because they were the only UK network willing to let Apple dictate how the iPhone could be used on their network, whereas Orange, T-Mobile and Vodafone refused to allow Apple so much leniency on their respective networks. (Ultimately, that's their loss, not Apple's!)

Those of us who wanted an iPhone, but didn't want to use it on O2, simply unlocked and jailbroked our iPhones.

Simply put, the other three main mobile networks are going to have to offer customers something more than just good network coverage and the handset, to get people to take an iPhone directly from them, rather than go via an O2, CPW or online O2 store. And now, because they've seen how good and popular the iPhone is, they now want their share of the pie.

However, the networks won't be able to offer much of a reduction on monthly fees, because of the initial cost of the handset, being around £600. Plus, there's only so many minutes and texts a customer can use-up in a month, so that's not going to be of much help to getting customers to come to Orange, or T-Mobile, over O2, e.g. by offering, say, 1500 minutes and unlimited texts and wi-fi/net access for X pounds a month. So, they've pretty much well lost the battle already!

But as I say, it's too little, too late, and they have pretty much lost any chance of clawing back customers from O2 / Apple, because they decided to stick their heads in the sand, and refused Apple the option to use their Networks. They can therefore only hold themselves responsible, now they are losing custom, due to the iPhone's popularity!


Pooch

[dvdrip]

I called Tmobile last night to cancel my contract with them and the operator on retentions asked why i wanted to leave.
Once i mentioned the iphone he groaned and said he wished tmobile would strike up a deal with Apple as he was losing countless numbers to the iphone.
I asked if tmobile would be getting it and he said unfortunately not .However he told me Orange were getting it with an offical release date of 1st Oct ,with advertising due to start at the beginning of Setpember!
We'll just have to wait and see what happens on Orange...

[adrian3221]

[QUOTE=dvdrip;9923084]I called Tmobile last night to cancel my contract with them and the operator on retentions asked why i wanted to leave.
Once i mentioned the iphone he groaned and said he wished tmobile would strike up a deal with Apple as he was losing countless numbers to the iphone.
I asked if tmobile would be getting it and he said unfortunately not .However he told me Orange were getting it with an offical release date of 1st Oct ,with advertising due to start at the beginning of Setpember!
We'll just have to wait and see what happens on Orange...[/QUOTE]

This persons an idiot.

He's moaning about losing customers to O2...then he's happy to push you in the direction of Orange! Sounds like Gil from The Simpsons!

[Officer M168]

I canclled last week & the guy i spoke to said he was losing lots of customers, treid to tell me that the new Vario was better then the ipod but i told him i've had nearly all the variants of The Vario & none have come close due to them insisting on using Windows Mobile.
But he never mentioned that they were getting the iphone or anybody else was.
And at the moment You can't get an iphone anywhere.
O2 online have no 16GB & i ain't paying the Fee's or going on a high tariff just to get the phone for free on a 32GB.
also my local store told me they got a delivery today but alas no 16GB where in it and they have had shed loads of enquires.

[chrism_scotland]

I can't see how any of the other networks can match O2 to be honest, they're not my favourite company but they basically treat iPhone Customers as one company and the rest as the the rest.
If it wasn't for the unlimited internet and free wifi when out and about the iPhone just wouldn't be the same, aside from T-Mobile (which may yet become part of O2) none of the other networks can offer the wifi hotspots when out and about, its expensive yes, but you do get a fair amount for your tariff.
I also can't imagine that handset costs will be any different between networks, as I imagine its pretty much set by Apple.

T-Mobile would be better sticking with Android, they're already seen as the leading Android carrier in the UK, developing in that would be a better plan than spending millions buying rights to the iPhone.

Orange won't want to take the iPhone, they won't be able to ruin the phone with their own rubbish firmware and forced software, and a 250mb "unlimited" data bundle isn't really going to cut it.

All this said though, O2 much have had a reason for signing the exclusive deal on the Palm Pre, losing iPhone exclusivity could be that reason.

[Sy1441]

Originally Posted by PoochJD

Hi,

To be honest, this is one of the situations where it's clearly "too little, too late".

With the option of unlocking and jailbreaking an iPhone, being an easy option for most average PC users now, which then results in an iPhone being usuable on almost any UK mobile network, I think the only real losers here, are the networks themselves.

The iPhone will sell, no matter what network has it, because it's a bloody good product!

The fact that only O2 had it available in the UK, was - as far as I know - because they were the only UK network willing to let Apple dictate how the iPhone could be used on their network, whereas Orange, T-Mobile and Vodafone refused to allow Apple so much leniency on their respective networks. (Ultimately, that's their loss, not Apple's!)

Those of us who wanted an iPhone, but didn't want to use it on O2, simply unlocked and jailbroked our iPhones.

Simply put, the other three main mobile networks are going to have to offer customers something more than just good network coverage and the handset, to get people to take an iPhone directly from them, rather than go via an O2, CPW or online O2 store. And now, because they've seen how good and popular the iPhone is, they now want their share of the pie.

However, the networks won't be able to offer much of a reduction on monthly fees, because of the initial cost of the handset, being around £600. Plus, there's only so many minutes and texts a customer can use-up in a month, so that's not going to be of much help to getting customers to come to Orange, or T-Mobile, over O2, e.g. by offering, say, 1500 minutes and unlimited texts and wi-fi/net access for X pounds a month. So, they've pretty much well lost the battle already!

But as I say, it's too little, too late, and they have pretty much lost any chance of clawing back customers from O2 / Apple, because they decided to stick their heads in the sand, and refused Apple the option to use their Networks. They can therefore only hold themselves responsible, now they are losing custom, due to the iPhone's popularity!


Pooch

That parts totally inaccurate so it kind of makes your argument pointless.

O2 became the sole network supplier due to having the closest 'brand' alignment with apple, a strong distribution infrastructure and the willingness to invest an immense amount of capital in a yet unknown product.


As for the Iphone coming to T-Mobile and Orange, its not new news to me as Orange were in talks with apple this time last year and although I cant comment on what stage T-Mobile are at I can work out the MRC's for the phone based on the supply cost and I dont see it becoming a massive player in out portfolio.

[PoochJD]

Hi Sy,

Originally Posted by Sy1441

That parts totally inaccurate so it kind of makes your argument pointless.

I'm sorry, but it's you who are wrong on this one. And no, it does NOT make my argument pointless!

According to the online version of the Times Business Newspaper, which can be seen here:

Arun Sarin, Vodafone’s chief executive, had been pushing hard to secure a deal for the iPhone... However, as negotiations reached a climax, he is thought to have decided that the commercial terms on offer were not viable.

Apple’s agreement with O2 is thought to include a continuing share of the revenues generated by each iPhone customer. O2 hopes that the Apple deal will help it to cement a niche as the country’s major music mobile operator. The group has already rebranded the former Millennium Dome as the O2 and transformed it into a concert and leisure venue.

Apple, which had initially considered striking one Europe-wide deal, is thought to have felt that it could maximise revenues by negotiating individual market tie-ups. The California-based group is also thought to have been keen to ensure that it worked with the strongest operator in each country.


Pooch

[Sy1441]

Originally Posted by PoochJD

Hi Sy,



I'm sorry, but it's you who are wrong on this one. And no, it does NOT make my argument pointless!

According to the online version of the Times Business Newspaper, which can be seen here:

Arun Sarin, Vodafone’s chief executive, had been pushing hard to secure a deal for the iPhone... However, as negotiations reached a climax, he is thought to have decided that the commercial terms on offer were not viable.

Apple’s agreement with O2 is thought to include a continuing share of the revenues generated by each iPhone customer. O2 hopes that the Apple deal will help it to cement a niche as the country’s major music mobile operator. The group has already rebranded the former Millennium Dome as the O2 and transformed it into a concert and leisure venue.

Apple, which had initially considered striking one Europe-wide deal, is thought to have felt that it could maximise revenues by negotiating individual market tie-ups. The California-based group is also thought to have been keen to ensure that it worked with the strongest operator in each country.


Pooch

You've kind of backed up my point with this post ?

Voda pulled out because they couldn't agree on commercially viable options i.e. not pumping money into an yet unknown product.

The bit about the music is exactly what I was on about when I mentioned brand alignment.

I think were actually both agreeing here but have somehow managed to disagree

[UEF]

I'm on o2 and when my contract is up I'm probably gonna stay with them purely as I can't find another provider who does unlimited (not 500mb or something silly) data packages. Are o2 really the only ones?

[chrism_scotland]

Originally Posted by UEF

I'm on o2 and when my contract is up I'm probably gonna stay with them purely as I can't find another provider who does unlimited (not 500mb or something silly) data packages. Are o2 really the only ones?

Yeah for the moment they are, although T-Mobiles 3GB limit is very reasonable, I can't see how you would use more than that seen as most video streaming isn't available via 3G on the iPhone.

[UEF]

Originally Posted by chrism_scotland

Yeah for the moment they are, although T-Mobiles 3GB limit is very reasonable, I can't see how you would use more than that seen as most video streaming isn't available via 3G on the iPhone.

True but its nice to have it unlimited. A bit like having a watch that's water resistant to 1000m - you know that if you drop it in the sink a few times, it's gonna be OK.

[usenetz]

Originally Posted by UEF

True but its nice to have it unlimited. A bit like having a watch that's water resistant to 1000m - you know that if you drop it in the sink a few times, it's gonna be OK.

What sort of sink have you got?

john

[Professor Chaos]

Originally Posted by Officer M168

.
And at the moment You can't get an iphone anywhere.

wrong. Im pretty sure Apple online have the PAYG version. Mine was delivered next day when i got it last week (quoted delivery was over 7 days)

[Desmo]

I got mine from Apple Sotr online no worries and my GF bought hers from the Apple Store at lakeside. Just strolled right in and picked one up.

[Professor Chaos]

Originally Posted by Desmo

I got mine from Apple Sotr online no worries and my GF bought hers from the Apple Store at lakeside. Just strolled right in and picked one up.

Apple stock checker showing the 16GB white and black out of stock in ALL stores tonight ...

Apple Retail Store - iPhone 3GS availability at the Apple Store