[edward]

And another thing...

Those stealth bays close beautifully because they're damped and on a black case they really are very "stealthy" but they're bloody noisy when they open.

[alexs2]

The end result of all the bickering over value for money etc is that if you're prepared to pay for your own PC in bits,build it to your own spec,and in your own time,plus install all of the relevant software,and do the inevitable troubleshooting,plus configure it to your own AV/HiFi system(s),then you will undoubtedly save money.

As far as I'm concerned,the prices that UVEM quoted me when I bought,were pretty reasonable VFM for a ready-built machine,and even more so when the installation was done for free,along with the software loading and configuration.

The presales help was superb,and at no time was any pressure applied,and the ability to tailor the PC to your own requirements was extremely useful.

Those that doubt that the "person who built it" also does the installation,should be reminded that it was indeed the case here...Phil Hale himself.

Perhaps another salient point is that none of those who own them seem to have any complaints at all,and Graham's comments about quality are also relevant,esp so from an industry insider.

[dejongj]

Also it is not that unheard of that the 'guy' who built the system comes along for the installation...Part of job satisfaction and rounded customer service etc....And having someone there who can really understand how it works....

When I bought two IBM Pseries servers the guy who build them (from France) came over to oversee the installation etc.....Part of the standard service....

[bad robot]

I think this thread will be split between those who are fortunate enough to easily cough up 3k for a system and think nothing much of it and those that see it as overpriced. However they get it all done for them and enjoy what seems to be a good personal service.

It has to be pointed out though that i think regarding the specs mentioned for such 3k systems these fall far below what really should be included. Im not in such a position to just through money at it and tbh part of the project/enjoyment is picking and building the system. Its also alot more satisfiying to boot.

Ive carefully chosen what i know are quite recent but good performance components and really i dont think i could of bought better for such a budget. It has taken quite a bit or price searching but i found scan to be very competitive for most components. Having rsearched each component believing they work well together which sometimes may be a problem, particulary with recently released motherboards/ram/cpu/graphics causing problems usually regarding bios or driver/upgrades.

All in all its possible to create a much better system than these guys are selling and for alot less money, no offence but the charges they seem to have for such customer services may indeed be more suited to the well heeled, aint it.

Everyone wants good service but by eck sometimes you REALLY pay for it.
You cant put a price on satisfaction though and 3k to me may be alot more than it is to many others here ^^^. From a business point of view im sure they need a good profit margin for the time involved with regards such systems and installs but im surprised many others havnt tried offering such services/business ideas from their garages. Really theirs nothing more to such a business than having the hardware/software knowledge, knowing where to buy components from wholesalers and being polite with good customer relation skills. 1k profit a system could easily be possible.

Maybe time i built a garage lol

[Mr.D]

Originally Posted by alexs2

Perhaps another salient point is that none of those who own them seem to have any complaints at all

And are more than happy to send them back for a rebuild even.

Originally Posted by alexs2

,and Graham's comments about quality are also relevant,esp so from an industry insider.

We don't all find it necessary to repeatedly mention what we do to give our comments more weight.

Originally Posted by edward

Hi Bad Robot,
have you read the reviews of the LC14?
http://www.sysopt.com/features/cases...2024_3549061_1
http://www.moditory.com/index.php?op...d=133&Itemid=1

I've gone for this case and it does look damn good - a spare stealth bay for a Blu Ray or HD DVD or Samsung combo reader as well as a writer. Fortunately, I didn't have the challenges that the reviewers encountered - Uvem did ;-)

How cool and quiet is that IBM drive?

LC14 is a very nice case. It's a bitch to keep cool and quiet though, but can be done. At least silverstone have addressed these issues with the new chassis uses by the 16,17,18

Originally Posted by edward

And another thing...

Those stealth bays close beautifully because they're damped and on a black case they really are very "stealthy" but they're bloody noisy when they open.

Taking the draw fascia off helps a little....not a lot but a little....
Now could you be so kind to answer my earlier question? PM if you wish

[bad robot]

Originally Posted by Skunkpipe

LC14 is a very nice case. It's a bitch to keep cool and quiet though, but can be done. At least silverstone have addressed these issues with the new chassis uses by the 16,17,18

Yeah the intake and 60mm exhaust fans are noisey. I have 2 silverstone cases. Although the stock fans could be replaced by much quieter stealth fans such as those from "vantec".

Changing from a AMD/Intel RRP packaged noisey CPU cooler to something much larger but superior performance should as ive done in the past mean no exhaust fans are really required. Okay leave a PCI plate or two off for added ventalation if need be. Ill report if i run into problems with the dual core with this idea but then id certainly spend a few quid more obtaining 2x 60mm stealth fans if heating stability was an issue.

I wonder if these such specialists use performance cooling or retail/stock fans, would like to know.

You could look at putting a Zalman CNPS 9500-LED in there - you won't need the exhaust fans then.
The problem with the intake is that is it is just holes punched into the case - best cut this out with a dremmel

Originally Posted by bad robot

I wonder if these such specialists use performance cooling or retail/stock fans, would like to know.

I couldn't speak for UVEM, but we do. (in our top line HTPC for instance the quiet PC cooler, fans, silcone fan mounts, HDD coolers/vibration isolation etc. retail for about £250)

[bad robot]

Originally Posted by Skunkpipe

I couldn't speak for UVEM, but we do. (in our top line HTPC for instance the quiet PC cooler, fans, silcone fan mounts, HDD coolers/vibration isolation etc. retail for about £250)

Hey i like your system spec seems im on the right tracks then.

[Mr.D]

There is nothing I like better than taking a really expensive case and cutting a dirty great hole in it!

It lets the demons out!

Originally Posted by Mr.D

There is nothing I like better than taking a really expensive case and cutting a dirty great hole in it!

It lets the demons out!

it's ok if the hole is hidden behind a nice shiny fascia

[alexs2]

Originally Posted by Mr.D

And are more than happy to send them back for a rebuild even.




We don't all find it necessary to repeatedly mention what we do to give our comments more weight.

In answer to both of these comments....

I've had the PC for over 2 yrs,and it hasn't crashed once.
If something simple needed upgrading,I can manage that myself,and for sure,if it needs anything else,why shouldn't it go back.
Would a Dell or IBM owner have a problem with returning a machine for a repair?

Your second point...I have mentioned Graham's reply,and happen to agree with his views.

No-one is forcing anyone to buy one of these,but a number of us evidently feel that you do get the quality and back-up that you pay for.

Originally Posted by alexs2

In answer to both of these comments....

I've had the PC for over 2 yrs,and it hasn't crashed once.
If something simple needed upgrading,I can manage that myself,and for sure,if it needs anything else,why shouldn't it go back.
Would a Dell or IBM owner have a problem with returning a machine for a repair?

Nobody said anything about a repair - infact it was mentioned that it "ain't broke"
I read (and maybe I read it wrong) it as it was going back for a rebuild in the same way you'd send you amp away for a service - this was what was being questioned? What does it entail and why would it be deemed necessary by uvem. I'm seriously interested. As a small supplier selling kit at Artisan and slightly above prices and offering a more personal service (admittedly I don't do the install personally, although I would if local, but there's nothing else mentioned in this thread that uvem do that I don't - ooooo apart from rebuilds(?), I want to offer these value added services for my customers to set me apart from the box-shifters like elonex. Now I've never thought of providing a rebuild service, as for a PC, I feel it's totally unecessary - but if there's a good reason for it and people want it, I'll look into offering it. Shame edward has avoided answering that one.)
HAving been a HiFi enthusiast for over 20 years now I've become a bit cynical and jaded by the amount of snake oil products and services on the market, I don't think it's bad to question the validity or pricing of items, in fact it's quite healthy - it's not as Graham say an 'attack', it's simply a question why. PPL think they're overpriced, and they're questioning why, no body said they were bad. WE got an answer, the service. Now some will question if the service is worth the doubling of the price tag, some will accept that, others won't - simple as that.
What sad is the fact people don't like their purchasing descisions being bought into question and then throw their toys out of the pram if someone disagree

[alexs2]

Skunkpipe....I was simply replying to a couple of comments made by MrD,as you'll see above,and not to anything that you'd said.

I personally have no problems with anyone questioning the price of an item,or the service provided by a manufacturer,and at no time did I imply that people had been saying they were "bad".

What I would say was that the price tag which seems to be floating around bears no resemblance at all to the price I paid for mine,and I do agree that if someone is happy to pay an agreed price for something,it is their decision,and getting upset when questioned about it seems unneccessary.

[lisag]

I would be interested to see a full list of components used in their current retail models, and a price that they are selling it for - just so we can see what the charge for 'service' is.

lisa

[alexs2]

Originally Posted by lisag

I would be interested to see a full list of components used in their current retail models, and a price that they are selling it for - just so we can see what the charge for 'service' is.

lisa

Given the discrepancies between the prices that some of us have paid,Vs those being quoted around,maybe the best thing is to actually ask UVEM for a price for a given spec,and work from there.

My own impression when I bought was that the labour/service/installation etc came to less than £200,after I'd totted up the bits,although that was nearly 2yrs ago now.

[bamber]

Originally Posted by bad robot

Hope this interesting thread doesnt get out of hand...

See what you guys think.

internals:
AMD 64 X2 3800 / 2GB Corsair 3500 PRO / Asus Premium A8N (silent pipe)
Theraright XP120 (massive 120mm heatsink) / Stealth 120mm fan (quietest i could find) Nvidia 6600 256mb Silent/fanless cooling / ibm 500Gb 16mb cache sata II / 450w PSU (cant mind make but only 22db) Pioneer DVDr /

externals:
Silverstone LC14s-M (stylish case includes remote and VFD)
MS MCE keyboard & MCE Remote

bad robot

I recently built a similar system:

AMD 64 X2 4400 (overclocked to 2.519Ghz 229FSB)/2GB Corsair 3500LL (2-3-2-5 1T)/Asus Premium A8N/XP120/Akasa Amber 120mm/ATI GTO2 with Zalman V7cu/Seagate 500GB sata II/Seasonic 600W PSU/Silverstone LC14-M

I disconnected the 92mm front intake fan and one 60mm rear extract fan as they are very loud. The reason I mentioned the overclock above is even when playing BF2 on max settings the temps are all fine.

I ran 2 x copies of SuperPi, one on each core to heat things up and the max temps reported were 28c Motherboard 44c CPU and 57c GPU(after 2 hours BF2). The idle temps are 25c MB/32c CPU and 43c GPU.

System should be silent once I replace the other 60mm rear fan.

Overall I'm very pleased with the results.

Originally Posted by lisag

I would be interested to see a full list of components used in their current retail models, and a price that they are selling it for - just so we can see what the charge for 'service' is.

lisa

That's not so much an issue, it's fine to pay for service on top of that, but what services are included in the extra...

[alexs2]

Originally Posted by Skunkpipe

That's not so much an issue, it's fine to pay for service on top of that, but what services are included in the extra...

Skunkpipe....as a retailer,you may well be asked the same questions relating to your own products.

In my case,and in a number of others reported here in this thread,you will note that the service included home delivery,installation and setup by the manufacturer himself,plus any support required by phone or email thereafter(aside from the manufacturer's guarantee).

I'd suggest that it's perhaps not best for one retailer to start down that particular path,and to leave it to any customers who may wish to compare.

[bad robot]

Originally Posted by gazza982

bad robot

I recently built a similar system:

AMD 64 X2 4400 (overclocked to 2.519Ghz 229FSB)/2GB Corsair 3500LL (2-3-2-5 1T)/Asus Premium A8N/XP120/Akasa Amber 120mm/ATI GTO2 with Zalman V7cu/Seagate 500GB sata II/Seasonic 600W PSU/Silverstone LC14-M

I disconnected the 92mm front intake fan and one 60mm rear extract fan as they are very loud. The reason I mentioned the overclock above is even when playing BF2 on max settings the temps are all fine.

I ran 2 x copies of SuperPi, one on each core to heat things up and the max temps reported were 28c Motherboard 44c CPU and 57c GPU(after 2 hours BF2). The idle temps are 25c MB/32c CPU and 43c GPU.System should be silent once I replace the other 60mm rear fan.

Overall I'm very pleased with the results.

Cheers for the reply.
I wont be gaming on this system though unlike yourself. However your bound to be getting great results with your setup. Are you using it alot for HTPC duties and HD playback, sure sounds good mate.

Originally Posted by alexs2

Skunkpipe....as a retailer,you may well be asked the same questions relating to your own products.

In my case,and in a number of others reported here in this thread,you will note that the service included home delivery,installation and setup by the manufacturer himself,plus any support required by phone or email thereafter(aside from the manufacturer's guarantee).

I'd suggest that it's perhaps not best for one retailer to start down that particular path,and to leave it to any customers who may wish to compare.

As a retailer I want to keep an eye on the competition. If they offer something I don't, then I want to know so I can think about offering the same as I see service as the only thing that seperates us small folk from the big box shifters. I think this thread has covered (almost) everthing the uvem service consists of. Home delivery isn't something I'll offer - I have an alternative solution for that....Rebuilds? well I'm intruiged on the reasoning behind that one if I've understood it correctly (i.e. it ain't broke) - I'm certainly not going to critisise it until I know the why's and wherefores

[bamber]

Bad Robot,

The main purpose will be for playing various media including HD. I'm not really a hard core gamer but it's always good to see how a PC you build performs. I would be interested to hear what you think of your system once completed.

As for the UVEM debate I enjoy the hours spent configuring a system but can understand why others would rather pay UVEM for this service.

[alpit]

2 years ago I knew diddly squat about HTPCs. All I knew was that I wanted to watch a better picture through my recently purchased Sanyo Z2 projector. I surfed AV Forums and came across the name of UVEM. At that time I had neither the skill, knowledge or inclination to build my own HTPC, so I telephoned Phil at uvem for advice on what a HTPC could do. He invited me and my Z2 to his house (by no means a mansion!!) and I spent an enjoyable afternoon watching and learning what a htpc could do. Anyway, I decided to buy a uvem.
Phil came to my house one evening to set it up, and I haven't looked back since. I now tweak, upgrade and try different setups without fear of ever 'breaking' my htpc, and haven't spoken to Phil since the day of the install. For me, having a htpc pre configured with tt, dscaler, xlobby etc. was a godsend as I'd probably have given up on htpc had I (with no knowledge) had to do it all myself.
So anyway, what I am trying to say is that the £2200 I spent 2 years ago was probably one of the best decisions I have ever made. It has been a extremely reliable bit of kit, it has been in use for close to 4000hrs (I always have it on while my projector is on, so know the hours) and is still as quiet as the day I bought it.
So all I can say is that if you don't know a lot about htpcs and what they can do, but would like to, I would definitely recommend a uvem.

[JohnnyScot]

Many thanks to all who have given the various sides of this debate. I saw a Uvem for the first time last week, liked what I saw, thought it was pricey and knew I would get all the answers here re VFM, reliability, service etc.

Graham's post was of particular interest. I have fancied getting into the HTPC market for some time. My life is very busy and whilst I really enjoy 'tinkering' 'playing' 'learning' I feel my (short) patience levels might get the better of me if I build my own. I like the idea of starting on the right foot with a top on the line system and learning from a working state.

Thankfully for me money is not really an issue, lucky (actually hard earned!) situation to be in so on balance I think the Uvem way is the way to go for me.

Thanks again for a balanced argument and a call to uvem in the new year is in the offing.