[andy8757]

Hi All,

Basically Im going to be having a dedicated cinema/poker room with a PJ based system, with these components which Im toying over: Onkyo TX-SR705 or TX-SR805, whats looking to be the the Toshiba HD-EP35, xbox 360 and a bottom end 1080p PJ (Mitsubishi HC5000?!) with a roughly 2M width screen and eventually something like the iQ5-7-9 set from Kef. 5.1 or 7.1?!

The room itself is is roughly 13-14ft (front to back) by 8ft (left to right) with brick walls on 3 sides back, left and front (as in front being the screen wall joining to my neighbours) with a stud wall joining the room to the staircase to the loft and landing, the door to the room is also on this wall.

Im basically trying to keep as much sound in the room as poss within the room and my neighbours thinking its world war 3!! The Back and left wall are not attached to anything as our house is the end terrace but there is a chimney breast on the back wall directly by where the seating area will be.

Sorry to waffle I will post pics and plan shortly but would love to hear everybodys comments/advice as I want to get this room as good as poss with my limited budget and knowledge.

Thanks for any help in advance

Andy

[albriscoe]

Hi Andy

I think if you post a plan/pic of your room it will help us to see what "happening". I might say, I don`t think you`ll be dissappointed with the Onkyo as mine is awesome.

Anyway I`m sure some other the other gang will post here as soon as a pic or 2 is to be seen

cheers and good luck

Allan

[lone ranger]

Originally Posted by andy8757

Hi All,

Basically Im going to be having a dedicated cinema/poker room with a PJ based system, with these components which Im toying over: Onkyo TX-SR705 or TX-SR805, whats looking to be the the Toshiba HD-EP35, xbox 360 and a bottom end 1080p PJ (Mitsubishi HC5000?!) with a roughly 2M width screen and eventually something like the iQ5-7-9 set from Kef. 5.1 or 7.1?!

The room itself is is roughly 13-14ft (front to back) by 8ft (left to right) with brick walls on 3 sides back, left and front (as in front being the screen wall joining to my neighbours) with a stud wall joining the room to the staircase to the loft and landing, the door to the room is also on this wall.

Im basically trying to keep as much sound in the room as poss within the room and my neighbours thinking its world war 3!! The Back and left wall are not attached to anything as our house is the end terrace but there is a chimney breast on the back wall directly by where the seating area will be.

Sorry to waffle I will post pics and plan shortly but would love to hear everybodys comments/advice as I want to get this room as good as poss with my limited budget and knowledge.

Thanks for any help in advance

Andy

Hi Andy, I am still doing mine, same as yours, cinema/ poker room,its still a live thread on here just needs updating.Link below,you may get some ideas hopefully.

New Cinema build/Poker room

I think Albriscoe was perhaps referring to me in his response with a sly dig to put some more photos up

hope this helps.

[albriscoe]

Originally Posted by Stel

I think Albriscoe was perhaps referring to me in his response with a sly dig to put some more photos up

hope this helps.

Would I ??

[lone ranger]

Originally Posted by albriscoe

Would I ??

you are on a mission, youve built a house in the same time i havent even finished this room and your ripping me 1

[andy8757]

Right, I have uploaded a few images of the room as it was and with the on going clear up operation. I have also attached a rough plan of what Im aiming for.

I was thinking if a speaker is next to the storage under the stairs it may cause an echo (not sure on the tech definition) or some unwanted isssue with the sound, so I though of maybe putting some kind of door on to try and avoid this?!

Hope this helps!?

What have I started here.......... its a minefield of problems ahead lol

[andy8757]

Left the screen Label off on my crappy diagram ooopppps! lol

Im sure everyone knew what its meant to be ey..... hehe

[lone ranger]

hI ANDY, you will get loads of great advice I am sure,will put my views on it tomorrow as i must go out now,did my thread help you any or give you any food for thought?

regards

Stel.

[andy8757]

Hi Stel,

Loving your room if mine ends up half as good as that then i'll be more than happy. Theres a few little things that have helped already and what does that poker genie do and how much is it?

Cheers
Andy

[lone ranger]

Originally Posted by andy8757

Hi Stel,

Loving your room if mine ends up half as good as that then i'll be more than happy. Theres a few little things that have helped already and what does that poker genie do and how much is it?

Cheers
Andy

Poker genie plans your whole tournament for you,manages the blibds change,timing etc.

you enter how many players,how much each has got,what denominations of chips you got etc etc basic info and it works out your whole blinds structure,brilliant and alerts you when you change up the blinds so it manages your tournament from start to conclusion....roughly £40.

link below wher i got m ine but i think you can get em on ebay and uk poker supply stores to.

http://www.magnusanderssonab.com/tillbehoreng.htm

[andy8757]

That looks a quality gadget, I shall see how the wallet is after everything else hehe

Hacking all the plaster off the walls in the morning.......going for that coal miner look!!

[andy8757]

Just a quick update which I forgot to post up!

Notice I couldn't resist drawing up the screen on the wall, I showed the misses to which I got the reply "you're mad.....whatever! "

I am looking at taking the plasterboard off of the stud wall and putting some insulation in and putting some sound proofing plasterboard on (not sure what its called lol) has anyone got any recommendations on any soundproofing that I could do Instead or aswell as to this wall to keep as much sound in as poss!?

Thinking of adding a stud/false wall between us & the neighbours (now stop me or politely tell me im talking rubbish) but I was thinking of putting a layer of carpet underlay or something like that between the stud wall and the brick wall to maybe try and at least stop a little sound from passing through?! It might be a silly impractical idea but I thought Id throw it in the mixer and hopefully come out with not all of you thinking Im a chimp!! LOL

I know its not going to be perfectly sound tight but id like to make the effort while Im at this stage.

Cheers
Andy

[andy8757]

Anyone?

[MarkP80]

Hi Andy,

The false wall is a good idea to reduce sound transmission to your neighbours. You need to be careful how you construct this though, in order to make it effective. There's a section in the building regs that gives some guidance on this, but the main thing is to avoid any contact between the false wall and the wall behind. You need to construct the outline frame by fixing it to the floor, ceiling and two side walls, then build the support studwork between.

I'd suggest using 2x2 to make the frame. You don't need a big gap between the two walls (minimal in fact), but I would fill the gap with rockwool. As I say, the key is to avoid any fixings onto the wall behind, as this is what transmits the sound.

HTH,
MarkP

[andy8757]

Thanks Mark, I have a slight problem that the right hand wall is an existing stud wall which I have stripped off the plaster board to better insulate for sound but this wall is attached to the front brick wall (see IMG_0019.jpg) how can I overcome this link to the back wall? Can I put neoprene/rubber strips or green glue between the joints if I attach the new front stud to the existing right hand stud?!

What is the bays ways for insulating the stud wall esp round the door ( IMG_0021 & IMG_0025) layers of "????"

Thanks for your advise
Andy

[andy8757]

Hi All,

Im getting the floorboards up in the morning and actually making a start with the soundproofing for the floor. I have chosen to take the approach in this link:

http://www.soundstop.co.uk/solutions...solution_1.php

going to use one of these solutions, got the batten downstairs all ready to go!

Does anyone have any advice, pitfalls or opinions on these solutions? Would be grateful for any comments before i take the plunge?

Hope everyone is having a good start to 2008!

[andy8757]

Right another brief (LOL) update......

I have now lifted all the floorboards and proceeding to the best of my knowledge and ability (not much) attempting to sound proof the floor and run all the cables I may or may not need!

With regards to the sound proofing under the floor Im using the method in my previous post but have stopped that to check that by sealing the under floor up I may restrict the airflow leading to dry-rot or something along those lines

I have attached the picture of the floor as it it at the moment, you may be able to see the batten on some of the floorboards that will support the plasterboard under the floor for the sound proofing?!

I have also attached a Pic of the Spaghetti junction of pipes right where I need to fix the stud wall to floor! Im sure I can avoid fixing to this point in the floor so shouldnt be too much of a problem!? Im slightly worried about being able to include soundproofing around this area due to the maze of pipes though (any suggestions welcome). I didnt realise how bad older houses were for bodge jobs and uneven walls, floors etc. I know they didn't have all the kit we do back so i'll let them off lol

I did think about putting the old floorboards back down but most were shot, so I think a chipboard floor is in order, all the more reason to get this right the first time as it wont be easy to get the boards up as it was before!!

As Im probably going to be networking the whole house via a Gigabit Network I have plenty of cables heading through this room in order to reach it destination. Most being the AV Rack (to be), If I wanted to take a few notches out of each joist to get some trunking under the boards to maybe make future cable additions or changes, will this weaken the joists?

Sorry to bore you all with the mundane mind numbing stuff but i promise the interesting gadgety bits will come when I get this lot over with lol

If there are any good deals on the kit I want at this years sound & vision, I may have something more exciting to talk about, problem then would be Id end up trying to balance he sofa on the joists cos i wont be able to wait to finish the room to play with my toys! LOL

Thanks for being patient with me.

Any comments or advice welcome as always!

Cheers
Andy

[MarkP80]

Hi Andy,

Some fancy solutions to stop the noise under the floor there! I note that they generally seem to be aimed at stopping sound from below travelling upwards - not sure what the effect will be in reverse? The simplest solution seems to be to simply get some tight fitting rockwool in there. I'd also put a sealer in the tongue-and-grooves of your new flooring, maybe a silicone? - Any gaps here will let sound through - it tends to be gaps that allow it, so also make sure you get the rockwool right to the edges.

What did you decide to do about the party wall to next door?

MarkP

[andy8757]

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the reply!

Well Im trying to do as much as poss to avoid any sound leaking anywhere 1. To avoid the neighbours hiding under their dining table thinking Zee Germans are attacking whilst Im watching saving private ryan and 2. Stop the other half moaning that all she can hear is "that bloody room".

My mates and prob most people think im going slightly over the top but I figure while the room is gutted I may aswell take advantage and do all in my power to achieve as much sound proofing as poss.

With regards to the party wall Im going to build the stud wall as Ive been advised with the air gap, the layer of rokwool, 2 layers of 15mm (maybe 12.5mm) acoustic plasterboard and something like acoustic blok (anyone know of similar cheaper or better product?) rubber matting before I attach the 1st layer of plasterboard? Not sure if attaching a layer of carpet underlay to the party wall before erecting the stud wall may add a little more sound proofing to the situation, as underlay wont break the bank and at the end of the day surely an extra layer cant do any harm.........can it?!

Still not sure what to do down near the pipes as my batten method may not fit to well there!? I will be insulating each pipe I can with the circular foam insulation which may help with sound going through the pipes and may help microscopically reduce our heating bill or I could just sit the misses in the oven as she is always cold and sneaks the heating to levels lizards would feel to hot in!!

Does anyone know the cheapest place to get acoustic sealant?

[MarkP80]

My mates and prob most people think im going slightly over the top

- they won't when they're all in there enjoying the fruits of your labour, believe me! (I've done two projects now, and had plenty of visitors passing through during construction and shaking their heads. They're all happy to sit in the rooms now though...)

With regards to the party wall Im going to build the stud wall as Ive been advised with the air gap

- I think you're right to go to the trouble of doing this. It will really help keep the noise away from the neighbours, especially with the double skin plasterboard. I'm not familiar with the use of the specialist acoustic block materials, so can't advise really. I did look up construction methods for soundproofing, as these are now part of Building Regs. From memory, they don't advise using anything like this, the main thing is to get the wall up with the gap (although I'd be happy to hear from anyone with specific experience of the added benefits of specialist materials). The primary thing you have to try to achieve is no contact with the party wall, as this is what will conduct the sound. Also, no air gaps for sound to pass through, so the double layer plasterboard with staggered joints is good. (Again, does it really need to be special acoustic plasterboard?) Not sure what the carpet underlay on the wall will achieve, but that would be a cheap thing to do, so why not?

But no bracing back to the wall is the key!

Still not sure what to do down near the pipes as my batten method may not fit to well there!?

- How about filling any remaining gaps using an expanding foam? Air gaps are your enemy, as that is where the sound will pass through.

Keep us posted!
Cheers,
MarkP

[MarkP80]

Ooh, 300 posts !!!

[andy8757]

Hi All,

Another Very "Brief" update!!:

Thanks for the reassurance Mark, I have a few tins of expanding foam ready for action!

So...... Ive started running the Cat5e cable throughout the house ready for anything i may want to put through it and looking to purchase a 24 port Gigabit Switch, patch panel and a nice cabinet to hide it in! Again my mates are like why.....?! O well!

I have ran a coax from the lounge to split the signal going into the V+ box and will have another power lead in the cinema room so I can watch the sport etc in HD on My PJ, I know it means unplugging the box downstairs and lugging it upstairs but Im on a budget here people!! LOL

Waiting on my mate for some alarm cable so I can finish the wiring so I can get on with sticking the insulation etc into the floor and getting the floor down and start getting the shell back to a room!

Im looking to have a set of headphones by the seating area from the amp etc on the otherside of the room, can anyone recommend what wire and connections would best help me retain quality across that distance? Looking to have a socket on the wall at each end.

Thats all for now Folks

Sorry for boring you all.....

Andy

Looking forward to Sound & Vision in Bristol where I may purchase my toys

[MarkP80]

Andy,

I think you're right to run the Cat5e at this stage. I didn't really research this when I did my projects, and now I know a bit more about it, I wish I had done it. I'm planning on getting a PS3 for a bit of streaming from the PC, and that would have been ideal. Too late now, engineered flooring down....

The coax is a good idea though - and I did have the foresight to do that! You did use proper cable tv-spec coax, not just uhf? (Just checking, before you get the carpets down!)

For your headphones, what wire is it - I suspect 4 core? I use Van Damme cable for speakers, it's excellent quality and great value. For 4-core, have a look at this - Link
- 2.5mm2 CSA should be more than adequate. Why not post a question on the cable forum for a few opinions?
I have a similar setup for the centre speaker in my cinema. This speaker only comes out when in use, so the cable has a pair of banana plugs on, and a wall plate to accept them. You should be able to get a headphone jack wallplate to do something similar.

Cheers,
MarkP

[andy8757]

Hi All,

Another quick update, I decided to go mad and buy a gigabit switch, patch panel and cabinet which I decided to put in the cupboard under the stairs which needed some tweaking to accommodate it! I have attached some pics of my efforts which were only meant to be a quick just to make somewhere I could put the bloody thing (its only a cupboard after all nobody will see it) but it quickly turned into more than that as I got fussy (not to fussy) but enough to make me wanna start painting it and now every that'll do is annoying me (live n learn hehe). I have attached a few pics of my progress!

So got all the cables I have run throughout the house into a nice bundle to go into the unit and power etc So all ready to start wiring the patch panel! Should be fun

So the room itself has just had some rockwool added to the floor and walls with some of the sound proofing applied to the floor. I chuck a photo of the room up when I get home.

Went for a demo last weekend and im like a kid at christmas now! Even the misses actually admitted she was impressed and a little excited, probably because when this is finished she has a big list of things for me to do after!!!!! So Im ordering my Kit the weekend at the Sound & Vision Show in Bristol, went for the Panasonic AE2000, onkyo 875, kef iq7se's, iq6c and the dipole surrounds. I ordering now as I got a cracking deal and I need all the cables etc to put into the floor, wall and ceiling!

I have set myself a task of getting the Room ready for kit in 6 weeks! Everyone laughed when I said that......we'll see! LOL

[andy8757]

Right just a few pics:

1 of the finished Network cabinet and a few pics of the room as it is. I made a mock up of the screen, which Im scared is a little big but Im sure it'll be fine!!

Im now waiting for a plumber and a sparky to move some pipes and sort the electrics so I can get the floor down the weekend! Saying that Ive been waiting nearly 2 weeks now! Sometimes I think favors just ain't worth it!

Hi Mark, I have indeed got some good coax, straight from a local cable company infact

Now the Base for the network is done Im gonna look into some of the uses for Cat5 and what toys I can link up with it hehehe

All the Av Kit is on its way too, got what I consider to be a good deal, so Im pretty happy! Cant wait to get the panny up on the ceiling and chucking a picture on my stupidly big screen!! lol

Having discussions with the boss on the decor and lighting etc So any ideas would be appreciated, Im thinking on the lines of a light ish suede paint for the 3 walls and maybe some MDF panels with foam glued to it and a dark brown fabric over the top and mounted to the wall flush with the screen, giving the effect that the screen is sunken into the wall!?

Anyway, dont wanna bore you any longer........
Andy

[MarkP80]

It's all coming together Andy!

That network cabinet looks the business, what a great job you've made. A lot of effort now, but you'll reap the benefits in the future, when you start linking things up.

The soundproofing looks good too. Just don't put any screws through those cables when you put the floor down!

I made a mock up of the screen, which Im scared is a little big but Im sure it'll be fine!!

- It will indeed be fine - don't worry.

Sounds like you've got yourself a great projector too. I've got the old 900, which I think is great, I daren't demo the new models....

So, networked up you'll be able to think about media streaming from the PC to your projector. Plenty to think about there!

This has been a good project Andy, all the hard work is coming to fruition. I've done a couple where at times you wonder why you started, but it'll soon be all worth it.

MarkP

[MarkP80]

Having discussions with the boss on the decor and lighting etc So any ideas would be appreciated,

- Careful with paint. I've used suede feature paint before, and although it looks great, the slightest brush against it leaves a mark. Maybe ok for a back wall, but I personally wouldn't put it on walls people are walking past. Even worse if you have kids (I do). Try a sample and see what you think.

Dark walls are best at controlling light and reflections, so I'd give that some thought. Also, they make the room cosy, which may be what you want considering the use it's going to be put to. I used a dark red in my cinema, we were slightly worried it might be too dark before we put it on, but love it - lots of people comment on it too (but they might just be being polite!). Have a look at the end of my signature project to see how dark the paint is.

As always, it's not just the colour, but the lighting that gives the feeling to the room. Downlights are always effective. Or how about coloured LED wall lights to wash the wall in subtle coloured light? Or a dropped ceiling (MDF panel say 18" in from the walls) with a rope light inside, washing light out over the ceiling? Have a look through the galleries on this site for some ideas.

Cheers,
MarkP

[tojo]

Just bumped into this thread and I'm glad I did.

This is coming together really well - looking forward to seeing how it all turns out. I'm about to make a start on our front room and it sounds mighty similar to yours. Victorian house etc. dreading the moment I lift the floorboards up!

Look forward to seeing more as it all comes together.

[albriscoe]

Ey up Andy

you`ve been busy mate and what I`ve seen so far looks excellent, the patch panel looks the dogs as well, veeerrry neat.

you know what they say bigger the better so the screen will look great believe me, in fact you`ll wish it was bigger after a few days trust me.

Anyway keep it up mate its a sterling job

cheers Allan

[andy8757]

Well thanks for all the great input chaps, especially looking at your projects its great that you have taken your time to help!

Im hoping I can get mine half as good!!!!!!!!!

The smallest update yet (LOL): WAITING FOR SPARKY & PLUMBER SO I CAN GET THE FLOOR DOWN!! Nearly 2 weeks lost due to (favours)

A long shot but how much roughly should I be paying to get a Radiator moved from the front wall to the left hand wall but Im just gonna have the pipes there ready for the radiator as Im thinking with all that insulation and onkyo 875 and the PJ I'll be more than warm enough LOL

I think while im waiting on people I can knock up a DVD shelf behind the door between the chimney & the wall!? What would the best way to do this do you all think, build an MDF shelf then screw it to the wall or Build a frame in position!?

Cheers again chaps!