New Cinema Under Way

paulw77 · 16-12-2003, 11:02 PM

I've just started a website which will document the construction of our new home cinema. You can keep up to date with it's progress here :

http://www.btinternet.com/~paulw77

It's a bit sparse at the moment !

ReTrO · 17-12-2003, 8:55 AM

Idea: If you're going to put a false wall across the chimney end then you could have your front speakers all hidden away in it, then you can have a nice clean wall with just the screen visible.

X3ELS garage conversion was done like this and looks brilliant.

paulw77 · 17-12-2003, 9:07 PM

Thanks for the suggestion Retro.

I had considered that, but won't they sound a bit boomy in what is, in effect, a large box.

ReTrO · 17-12-2003, 9:11 PM

What speakers will you be running?

If done correctly you should be able to get a very good sound out of most. The most problematic ones being those that are rear ported.

*banners* · 17-12-2003, 10:04 PM

Have you considered a built in sub-woofer or two in the front false wall? Obviously going the DIY route with such an idea. It eliminates them taking valuable floor space!

Cheers Steve

paulw77 · 17-12-2003, 10:09 PM

Retro,

The front speakers are Eltax Symphony 8.2 and Eltax Symphony centre (I know, but they've always sounded OK to me, but I plan to upgrade in the not so distant future).

As far as I can remember, they are front ported.

banners,

I am a bit wary about a sub (let alone two!). The room directly joins onto our neighbour's bedroom. We have only lived here for three months so I don't want to upset her.

*banners* · 17-12-2003, 10:13 PM

CHICKEN!!

I understand perfectly! It would be more than likely a problem with the rear wave.

Cheers Steve

ReTrO · 18-12-2003, 9:20 PM

I'm not 100% how it would sound. But if you could mount your speakers very securely, so they don't move at all, and with their front baffles flsuh with the front of the wall it should work pretty well. I think you'd be best fixing the speakers in with a layer of neoprene to hold them secure, but isolate them from the wall.

Best see if Mr X3ELS has any ideas.

paulw77 · 30-12-2003, 11:06 AM

A few more pictures added - progress is slow !

woody67 · 30-12-2003, 4:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by paulw77
I've just started a website which will document the construction of our new home cinema. You can keep up to date with it's progress here :

http://www.btinternet.com/~paulw77

It's a bit sparse at the moment !

This may be just the perspective of the photo and too late now, but it looks like you are cutting the boards to fit your timber stud spacing - you should use full boards and have the timber spaced to suit these. The board in you last picture (29/12) is very small and you are going to have loads of joints across the wall.

Timber spacing should be at 450 mm centres horizontally and 900mm vertically. Less than this and the boards will flex too much

Also the board nails look too far apart

The more joints you have the more chance of the plaster skim cracking - even with board tape applied.

If nailing you should space them at 150mm centres - but better still use screws and this will prevent the nail heads poping any plaster skim off when the wall starts to expand/contract

paulw77 · 01-01-2004, 5:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody67
This may be just the perspective of the photo and too late now, but it looks like you are cutting the boards to fit your timber stud spacing - you should use full boards and have the timber spaced to suit these. The board in you last picture (29/12) is very small and you are going to have loads of joints across the wall.

Timber spacing should be at 450 mm centres horizontally and 900mm vertically. Less than this and the boards will flex too much

Also the board nails look too far apart

The more joints you have the more chance of the plaster skim cracking - even with board tape applied.

If nailing you should space them at 150mm centres - but better still use screws and this will prevent the nail heads poping any plaster skim off when the wall starts to expand/contract

The boards I am using are standard 1800x900mm from B&Q. The only ones I have had to cut are the ones at the left hand end which is unavoidable.

Nails ???? I'm using screws. Also I won't be skimming with plaster. I will be covering the wall with carpet tiles.

brendank · 08-01-2004, 11:23 PM

woody67 is correct in what he is saying paul,

the b+q plasterboards you are using are one sheet of plasterboard cut in two this is to enable easy transportation for the diy person but only for small jobs not to cover a wole wall. They would never be used on a building job for the reasons woody67 mentioned however as you are covering them it isnt an issue as such.

If i was you i would put some more screws in though

paulw77 · 11-01-2004, 10:45 PM

No, woody67 is not correct (at least in the assumptions he made about the way I have gone about things) i.e.

1. I have not had to cut the boards to make them fit my timber.
2. I AM using full boards (albeit smaller than what would be used in the trade).
3. I am not using nails.

The wall was completely rigid and secure with one layer of plasterboard. Now that the second layer of plasterboard is up (which has been bonded to the first layer with adhesive) the wall is solid as a rock. I realise that I should use "full size" boards (I assume 2.4x1.2m but as you rightly say, they don't fit in cars easily do they ?)

Also, having looked into the price or carpet tiles (around £100 for the whole wall), and the fact that they're not exactly nice to look at, I think I will be wallpapering the wall and painting it.

This may mean that I will have to look into acoustically treating the room somehow as it may be too bright. Maybe panels filled with Rockwool acoustic slabs (as John Revill did on Discovery Home and Leisure in his cinema room, for those who saw it).

wandgrudd · 12-01-2004, 7:39 PM

Why not just use normal carpet should be cheaper than carpet tiles

Gary Lightfoot · 12-01-2004, 8:07 PM

Hi Paul,

I used a cheap charcoal black carpet from Carpet Right, and have seen a much deeper black one since. The carpet I got was £1.99 per square meter (or yard - I can't remember), and the blacker stuff was £3.99, with a percentage off (30 or 40). You should only need two or three meters, so will be 8 to 12 square meters, which could be £32 to £48 at £4 per mtr at most.

I had a lot of trimming to do with mine, but it should be easier for you with square walls.

I put a good coating of wallpaper paste on the wall, and a few days later, pasted the carpet (cut to approximate but slightly over size) with a good coat of thick paste. It took two of us to put it up, and as far as I can remember, it didn't slip down.

I can't remember if I tacked a small nail or two in to hold it, but I think I leant some wood up against it at the top to stop it slipping while it dried. It's abit of a messy job, but worth it in the end I think.

Gary.

brendank · 12-01-2004, 8:18 PM

Hi all

Gary i have been following your threads with great interest

the carpet you installed ... how does it look visually

how does the room feel i.e in warm weather is it overly hot

what allowances have you allowed for ventilation

what type of lighting system have you installed

what would you change/adapt/modify if you had to do it again

paulw77 · 12-01-2004, 10:26 PM

Thanks for the tips Gary, I will certainly bear it in mind. I have already bought the lining paper and wallpaper, but I can always take it back.

Gary Lightfoot · 13-01-2004, 12:55 AM

Brendank - great questions!

1. The screen looks good to my eye, though a pure black one would have been better. Definately better than a colour in my opinion. The side walls are in keeping with the upper wall and ceiling colour (Kodak 18% grey for neutral light reflection on the screen). There are some pics on my website if you've not seen them. I can do more if you like.

2. Being a loft, it does get approx 3 degrees hotter than the landing below, but that's because of the sun on the south facing part of the roof. I don't think the carpet makes a great deal of difference insulation wise, as it gets cold in winter too.

3. I fitted a sliding vent into the ceiling and the velux window also has vents. I was going to use remnant of the old brick kitchen cooker chimney as an extract outlet to aid ventilation, but I haven't needed to yet. It doesn't get stuffy up there at all. I think the cross ventilation within the roof helps this, and I'm going to fit a filter onto the sliding vent to reduce dust ingress.

4. I'v only installed 3 halogen 50w (240v) spots into the ceiling which I bought from Argos. Along with a remote dimmer, it gives the room enough light to do most things, and looks cosy at the same time.

5. I would either install reflective material into the roof prior to fitting the plasterboard, or easier still, use the plasterboard that comes with it built in. That would reduce the heat gain in the summer a little.

I may change the screen wall carpet for pure black one day.

I might get the floor up and have a floating one fitted with steal beams so that I can get the purlin supports removed.

I will cover the purlin supports with black carpet or felt instead of repainting them black again.

That's all that comes to mind at the moment..

Gary.

Gary Lightfoot · 13-01-2004, 12:57 AM

Paul,

Painting it black will look just as good I'm sure. Some black paint is susceptable to leaving marks though, so it might be worth having a look at what black paints other people have used.

It might be possible to still paste the carpet to the paper if you change your mind, but not sure if it'll want to come down easier.

Gary.

paulw77 · 13-01-2004, 1:17 PM

Gary,

Thanks for the reply. I just checked into Carpetright and the cheapest they had was £2.49/m. I was very light, which I suppose would help when putting it up.

Did you put yours up in one section, or did you cut it to make things easier ?

The paint colour I am going for at the moment is Dark Chocolate from Craig and Rose's Opulence range.

http://www.craigandrose.com

It's very dark, and will look black with the lights off. I need a matching colour (not too light, not too dark) as a contrast for the other walls.

I was going for carpet to make the room less bright. I remember reading that a good way to do this was to use carpet on the rear wall and up to ear height on the side walls. Can anyone confirm that to be the case ?

ReTrO · 13-01-2004, 6:46 PM

Acoustics wise, you want a dead front wall and side walls upto ear height. Back wall I'm pretty sure will be ear height also.
Don't fully carpet the back wall or you'll have nothing for creating rear ambience from the surrounds.

paulw77 · 15-02-2004, 10:05 AM

Some new photos up, including finished screen.

Gary Lightfoot · 16-02-2004, 3:35 PM

Sorry Paul - I didn't get the email telling me you'd replied (quick replies don't get email updates

).

I put the carpet up as one piece and trimmed when it was up. I then wiped off any excess paste.

Richard - according to Dennis Erskine, the rear wall only needs treatment up to ear height as you suggested. If you have a sofa there, then you don't necesarily have to treat it. I didn't more or less for that reason, and it sounds fine.

Gary.

Nimby · 20-02-2004, 6:46 PM

Hi
Just a thought regarding the suggestion to "bury" speakers up to the baffle surface in the alcoves. Don't!

Narrow speaker faces usually aids imaging. Placing the speaker baffles at false wall level in the alcoves is probably not a good idea.

"Building in" the speakers will also affect the frequency response. Perhaps not for the better. It would probably increase the output at lower frequencies for all the drive units due to the increased baffle area. Which would give a bumpy response. Speakers are usually carefully "voiced" for the specific size and shape of box used by the manufacture.

There are also all sorts of diffraction effects going on as the sound waves "bend" round the corners of the box. This is also frequency dependant.

Just look at a B&W Nautilus speakers and the carefully shamfered corners on Missions for examples of speaker shaping to aid sound reproduction.

Alcoves can be used to house subwoofers. Though the subs would have to be designed for the purpose.

NIMBY

paulw77 · 20-02-2004, 10:42 PM

Nimby, I decided not to go for that idea in the end (more because it was too much trouble to be honest !)

Cinema is ocming along nicely - some new pics up (a new section devoted to the projector mount).

paulw77 · 07-04-2004, 10:32 PM

Plenty of new photos and sections on the website now - the carpet is down and the room is in a usable state - although I would hesitate to call it finished (no beer fridge yet !)

Comments anyone ? Feels a long time since Xmas when I was putting up plasterboard !

Gary Lightfoot · 07-04-2004, 11:03 PM

Hi Paul,

Things are looking good! Nice colours that probably look black under viewing conditions too. How is the soundproofing? Working as well as expected?

I noticed the white door - did you leave it white or darken it down a bit? I was wondering if it will reflect onto the screen at all.

I bought some more 'cheap' carpet to cover my DIY 'Gramma' isolation speaker platforms. Good stuff at just £2.49 a square meter. i used the black stuff - must be the same as your blue, as the description matches. That's the same carpet that I glued onto my wall if it is..

Gary.

paulw77 · 08-04-2004, 8:43 PM

Yes Gary, the colours do look black when the lights are off - as for the door, I do intend to do something with it - white gloss - not good !

I am very happy with the way the carpeted wall turned out and would recommend it to anyone.

dapex · 09-04-2004, 9:08 AM

Please feel free to shoot me down here but I have just been looking at your site and in particular the screenshots. I was very surprised at how dark the picture appears to be??? Is it like this in normal viewing or is it just the way the picture has been taken?

I only ask as I was going to order the Z2 but after seeing those screenshots, it has made me wonder how dark a normal film maybe after all things the monsters inc normally look outstanding on a crappy PJ???

nathsea · 09-04-2004, 10:15 AM

Hi Paul,

Just looking at your theatre (looks great!) where did you get the trunking from?

Many Thanks

Nathan