[jagdeepp]

Ok, so we've had a decent summer (up until a couple of weeks ago). I've spent the past few months discovering parts of the garden which had been covered in moss, weeds and nettles quite some time before we moved in. Having cleared the entire lot up I've discovered a quite amazing space.

The house seems to have some history. The guy that built the house was an architect who designed and built 2 properties on the road. At the back of the garden he had an underground air raid shelter built which i'm told leads down to a set of chambers. I've uncovered the area and was able to walk across what is essentially a room underground approximately 5ft in height and 10 ft in length. I came across a couple of frogs and decided to make my exit rather swiftly. I digress. That area is simply to small todo anything with.. i'm looking to build on the land above it and to fill that in with the soil that'll be excavated when digging the foundations since skips are not cheap anymore!

The house initially had above ground a 7mtr by 6mtr pond which was home to a fair number of koi carp. It was taken down by the last owner. What remains now is a 6 ft by 4ft hole leading into the bunker which is actually just a glorified tunnel. The whole area has been concreted over and i intend now, having discovered the space to build onto it an outbuilding.

I've toyed with the idea of a log cabin but gave up on the basis that it'd be knackered within 15 years. Insulation wouldn't be great and it'd require a lot of maintenance. I've therefore decided to go ahead with a far more secure brick & block build with cavity walls and a pitched roof.

I'm preparing the building notice submission preparation work now. It is a permitted development so long as it's 2 mtrs away from a boundary wall and the roof (pitched) doesnt exceed 4 metres. I should be able to get work started next weekend!

For now the brain is storming away, painting picture after picture of the ideal build. Unfortunatey i'm suffering a little creative block and would like some assistance in that regard.

Here are the pics of the garden as it currently stands together with some shots where i've put the building in place (virtually):

Garden as it currently stands:

Garden with the outbuilding virtually installed:

Close up of the space where the outbuilding will be erected:

Outbuilding in place (again, virtually.. obviously.. because i havent built it yet..doh!)

Interior lay out as currently envisaged.

The building will have 1 significant partition. The right side will be the dumping ground (storage). It'll be accessible by its own door. If i did not implement this the entire building would in due course become a dumping ground.

Note the Ikea table on the left. I've added a small dividing partition which could feature half way into the room. There's a recess in the centre where i could install an attractive light feature.... that's what i'm telling the wife anyway. The truth is that i'll need somewhere to hang each of the rear surround speakers which i am to put at each side of the sofa around ear level. That'll be hung on the feature partition. As can be seen the Monitor Audio package has also been put into my 3d design. I'm planning a 9ft screen at this stage.

If anyone has any idea's or can refer me to any pics of well designed layouts i'd be most grateful.



Anyway back to it..


The room to the left will be far more substantial.

The building will be 8.5mtrs in length, thats around 8 internally. It'll be 6.6mtrs in length so around 6m internally. 2 mtrs on the right will be storage right along and the remainder will be the Haven/Den.

Items that MUST go in the haven are :

Projector
9ft screen (goo paint)
3-4 seater sofa
Ikea Galant corner desk (sitting in my garage since we moved to the house. She Who Must Be Obeyed persistently reminds me of the £400 i spent on this). Its got to be put to use and will make part of the room a study area..!(!?) Then again, i'm thinking maybe of giving this one a miss..(as you can see i'm completely undecided.
Storage unit for amp etc.
Monitor Audio RS6 packagag and BK Sub - these will come out of the lounge which will now house a satellite package. Simple reason being that the toddler will get at my equipment otherwise!!!
Treadmill - This is the awkward one. The Mrs insists again that this must be placed in the room. I'll have to somehow work around this one.. Design ideas massively appreciated..

Optional extras:
Pool table (6ft)..If i can get past swmbo.

Ps - I am NOT loaded. Au contraire mon fraire.. I was set to buy another car but have decided to keep the current one and put a little towards this build instead. Most people spend around £10-14k on a car. I choose to drive a banger from a-b and spend my money on developing my obsession for AV and interior design. Chasing the dream for some means a new BMW whilst for others it means a leather recliner in front of a PJ.
My builder has also agreed a good deal (Around 10k - labour!) and my dad is helping pay for the materials. Once the shell has been built, i'll be doing the decorating myself which will include the central feature wall, skirting, flooring and painting.

Building work starts in 7 days.

Any and all ideas in developing this project are massively appreciated!!!

[deadmonkey]

That green chair in the third photo down...



...that's where I snuck in and bagsied my seat ready for when it's finished

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by deadmonkey

That green chair in the third photo down...



...that's where I snuck in and bagsied my seat ready for when it's finished

lol.. funny, i'd not even noticed the green seat till you'd mentioned it. I'd got used to the rubbish there! Unfortunately being placed at that specific location will mean you'd be sitting bang in the centre of a false wall with a batten going right through your gonads.. Not a wise idea methinks! Kidding!

I estimate (subject to all going to plan) the build to be complete with in 2 months, the remainder within another 6 weeks. Pics all the way i hope!

As i say above, any tips re the design would be massively appreciated.

[MarkP80]

Hi Jagdeep, how's it going!

You like to keep yourself busy!

Building work starts in 7 days.
Any and all ideas in developing this project are massively appreciated!!!

OK, my first suggestion would be slow down! I really think you shouldn't be ploughing ahead until you have a fixed plan as to what you want to do, otherwise you stand a good chance of giving yourself a headache later.
Have you thought about plans? Foundation details etc? OK, you may not need planning permission, but you will need Building Regs approval, and that means involving your local council Building Inspector. Get him onside right from the start and it will sve you heartache later. Also, having a set of plans will mean there will be much less of a chance of disputes with your builder.
Think about all the other services. How are you going to get power there (and how much do you need?)? What about heating (or cooling!)? Water (for a cuppa!)?
Do a floorplan, and don't start work until you can demonstrate that the size and layout meets your requirements.

That would be my advice to begin with! Looks like it will be a great project though, good luck. I'm looking forward to seeing how it develops.
Cheers,
MarkP

[The Prof.]

Interesting project..
So what will be the finished size of the cinema?

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by MarkP80

OK, my first suggestion would be slow down! I really think you shouldn't be ploughing ahead until you have a fixed plan as to what you want to do, otherwise you stand a good chance of giving yourself a headache later.
Have you thought about plans? Foundation details etc? OK, you may not need planning permission, but you will need Building Regs approval, and that means involving your local council Building Inspector.

Hiya Mark! I've actually spent some time reading your thread again as i was looking to emulate your work with the bar area! Great to hear from you by the way.

I've prepared the building notice application already. It's going of today. I don't need planning permission and the building reg's team are onside. I've had a lengthy chat and have prepared my notice application in accordance with their advice.

Foundations will be inspected by the Council. The builder has been advised 1 mtr deep minimum plus a possible further amount subject to the surveyor. I've set everything out in writing for the builder including type of flooring, number of power points, number of halogen lights, stud partition structural points and drainage (soakaway). I accept there'll be other things cropping up but i'll work around it.

Central heating is a big no no. Too much work. Plus the garden is over 150ft so the pipe will have to be massively insulated. Way too much hassle.

No sink or anything at the back. The only thing on tap will be beer, soft drinks and spirits.

I may go with an electric fireplace.

The wife has agreed to ditch the desk idea so no Ikea table! Result!!

I can't over plan the room. I'll have a couple of kids growing and needs will change over the years. I'm easily bored. The only certain feature will be the cinema area which i'll prep up in detail. One further mini partition wall as a feature then we'll go from there me thinks?!

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by The Prof.

Interesting project..
So what will be the finished size of the cinema?

It'll remain open plan with the remainder of the annexe. Storage will be partitioned to keep the room clutter free. Screen size wise it'll be around 9ft.

[MarkP80]

Hi Jagdeep,
yes, good to hear from you again!

I've prepared the building notice application already. It's going of today. I don't need planning permission and the building reg's team are onside. I've had a lengthy chat and have prepared my notice application in accordance with their advice.

Sounds like you have this under control. Nothing worse than proceeding with building then find you have to redo something because you didn;t agree it in advance with the inspector.

I agree regarding getting central heating down there, electric is probably the way to go, but don't forget to include this in your electrical load list.

Other thing that occured to me was an internet connection. Maybe run a suitable ethernet cable down there (I don't know the specifics for running it outside, but sure someone will) or possibly you could do it over the mains using Homeplugs. Wireless would probably struggle over that distance. I was thinking in case you have say a PS3/XBox or a BD player with internet access - or maybe you would stream media from a server in your main house? (Or back tothe house from a server in your extension?)

Keep us updated,
MarkP

[albriscoe]

Hi Jag

good project mate, I like it

don`t know how much you have in the kitty but think about heating mate, what about a couple of solar panels to heat up the water for underfloor heating.

I would say for an outlay of say 1200-1500 quid you could have it all installed and whilst your pouring the concrete for the slab clip the pipe to the insulation

Its really very easy to do as well, think future heating bills Jag and it`ll pay for itself in no time.

cheers and keep us posted Al

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by albriscoe

Hi Jag

good project mate, I like it

don`t know how much you have in the kitty but think about heating mate, what about a couple of solar panels to heat up the water for underfloor heating.

I would say for an outlay of say 1200-1500 quid you could have it all installed and whilst your pouring the concrete for the slab clip the pipe to the insulation

Its really very easy to do as well, think future heating bills Jag and it`ll pay for itself in no time.

cheers and keep us posted Al

This sounds interesting. I never really gave it too much thought. £1250 long term isn't so bad. I don't know where to start though and i'm sure the builders wouldn't have a clue either! I guess i could employ someone to come in and sort out the heating. Solar panels may be the way ahead.

Young Al, you've been an inspiration of mine for some time. I've shown 'er indoors your home cinema and told her we're copying that. She smiled and walked away. I'll take that to mean 'ok love, go ahead'.

[albriscoe]

Originally Posted by jagdeepp

This sounds interesting. I never really gave it too much thought. £1250 long term isn't so bad. I don't know where to start though and i'm sure the builders wouldn't have a clue either! I guess i could employ someone to come in and sort out the heating. Solar panels may be the way ahead.

Young Al, you've been an inspiration of mine for some time. I've shown 'er indoors your home cinema and told her we're copying that. She smiled and walked away. I'll take that to mean 'ok love, go ahead'.

Young Al..young Al

wash your mouth out with soap n water

its really very easy is ufch, if you want to go down that way I`ll help as much as I can.

if I can do it anyone can and I can so you can. Lots of cans their

seriously I think its a good way of sorting out your heating, is the rear of the new building south facing by any chance. If so even better as the panels could go there and be outta sight.

Google solar panels Jag. they are either simple to make or quite cheap to buy, the pipe is cheap and a doddle to fit as well and your nearly there.

Infact I took a load of pipe to the tip a while back as no one wanted it on here

[Smurfin]

Looking forward to seeing the pics Only piece of advice I can give is....don't try to cram too much in! Difficult I know, especially with SWMBO, but the best setups you see are usually very clean with minimal else going on around. Not always possible, though I know...

[Kristian]

Looks like a good hideaway

Originally Posted by MarkP80

Other thing that occured to me was an internet connection. Maybe run a suitable ethernet cable down there (I don't know the specifics for running it outside, but sure someone will) or possibly you could do it over the mains using Homeplugs. Wireless would probably struggle over that distance. I was thinking in case you have say a PS3/XBox or a BD player with internet access - or maybe you would stream media from a server in your main house? (Or back tothe house from a server in your extension?

Seconded. When you dig your trench for your power supply make sure you drop some Cat5E (or Cat6) cable down there. I would do at least two runs, maybe even four - cable is cheap. You'd need to use exterior grade cable which will offer mechanical protection due to it being underground/outdoors. There needs to be at least 50mm separation from the power cable to avoid interference. You could use one of the cables for a phone back to the house. (Fibre is another possibility but is more expensive)

What about security e.g. alarms

I'd certainly think about central heating of some kind and lots of insulation in the floor, walls and roof.

Good luck

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by KrisLee

Looks like a good hideaway



Seconded. When you dig your trench for your power supply make sure you drop some Cat5E (or Cat6) cable down there. I would do at least two runs, maybe even four - cable is cheap. You'd need to use exterior grade cable which will offer mechanical protection due to it being underground/outdoors. There needs to be at least 50mm separation from the power cable to avoid interference. You could use one of the cables for a phone back to the house. (Fibre is another possibility but is more expensive)

What about security e.g. alarms

I'd certainly think about central heating of some kind and lots of insulation in the floor, walls and roof.

Good luck

Security..i wont reveal the type on here but yes, its being considered

Cavity wall insulation, insulation boards beneath the floor and insulation in between the ceiling joists is in mind. Double glazed doors and windows all round.

I may at a later stage think about extending central heating to the back with a seperate boiler but it depends on how often the haven is used. i tried looking up solar panels last night but got lost in all the google search results and £4k quotes. Way out of my budget. Once the build is complete i may think of heating but i think for now it wont be underfloor...

Broadband wise, yes, i'll be taking cable across. Dont know whether the signal will travel as far as it needs to quite so well.. The back is some 120ft from the house.

I've got standard cat5e outside at the moment which runs round from the study upstairs to the lounge downstairs. Around 10 meters outside. There are 2 runs and they're arent covered up or anything and seem to be running fine. They've been out for 2 1/2 years now. The back garden is however a different story of course and i accept that. Home plugs are an idea but i'm looking to those as a last resort. It may be a case of tubing for the cable buried underground or running along the bottom of the fence on the right. Any ideas always appreciated.

I've been google sketchup'ing away for the past few days. Even in the office i find myself doodling on the back of any piece of paper i can find whether that be a business card or official document!

Here's what i currently have in mind..

All ideas are so very appreciated. I've been viewing diy threads on here like theres no tomorrow. Just a few days now before the project (stress, moneyput) gets under way!

[MarkP80]

All ideas are so very appreciated.

- Make sure you plan the bar carefully, so that you've room for a fridge etc.

How about cable tv down there? The bar and screen make it a perfect place for sharing big sports events.

MarkP

[marshallp]

Hi Jagdeepp,

Just as a matter of interest what software did you create this picture with??

Phil.

[albriscoe]

Looking at the design

and I think I like the colour scheme

one thing you may have to think about and I could get shouted down a bit here

in your av rack which will have loads of flashing lights and led`s, might that distract you a little from the screen, it would me mate tbh.

Since doing the velvet and even covering my MK`s their is now nothing at all to distract me and its just great, you`d have to see it for yourself Jag (anythime you want) but its so much better imho trust me.

Shame about the ufch it really is very good

cheers Al

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by albriscoe

Looking at the design

and I think I like the colour scheme

one thing you may have to think about and I could get shouted down a bit here

in your av rack which will have loads of flashing lights and led`s, might that distract you a little from the screen, it would me mate tbh.

Since doing the velvet and even covering my MK`s their is now nothing at all to distract me and its just great, you`d have to see it for yourself Jag (anythime you want) but its so much better imho trust me.

Shame about the ufch it really is very good

cheers Al

Just when i think i've got it all right you bugger up my perfect vision.. Thanks Al ! Only kidding. I think you're right. The Arcam AVR 350 allows you to dim the screen. The 360 has a single light and Blu rays come with dimmable display.

Another issue of greater concern to me appears to be how i'm going to stretch a HDMI cable or 2 from that AV unit to the projector at the other end of the room at much greater height! I understand that 10metres is the maximum to avoid distortion. I'll require at least 15-20 metres me thinks. Dammit.. I think HDMI baluns are an option but definitely NOT a cheap one.. In terms of hdmi cable i'm a cheap as chips man. I will not spend hundreds for a cable! Component is an option but why compromise....I'm thinking 2 HDMI cables to the back and thats all. Nothing else needed.

Broadband will be taken across.

Sky at the back may be an issue. I've used up both RF outs on the sky box already. Again, HDMI baluns seem to be a possibility.. Sky HD is needed first! I'm actually thinking of leaving out sky tv to be honest. I've got it available in 5 rooms in the house as it stands.. Thanks for raising it though Mark.

Ps. Suffering from insomnia at the mo. Lying in bed dreaming about the project!

Aargh!!!

[Andy104]

Liking the designs, don't know if this has been mentioned before or not but could you not solve both the problems of the distracting lights and also the long run of hdmi cable by moving the equipment rack to the back of the room?

Good luck with all!

Andy

[albriscoe]

Originally Posted by jagdeepp

Another issue of greater concern to me appears to be how i'm going to stretch a HDMI cable or 2 from that AV unit to the projector at the other end of the room at much greater height! I understand that 10metres is the maximum to avoid distortion. I'll require at least 15-20 metres me thinks. Dammit.. I think HDMI baluns are an option but definitely NOT a cheap one.. Aargh!!!

I got my HDMI baluns from Keene and they were 30 quid at the time, we ran about 20 mts of cat5 just to test them and it was perfect and that without using the power supply, Gotta be cheaper than decent cables.

As Andy says could you not move the rack to the back as well so shorter cables runs.

By the way whats insomn....................

[jagdeepp]

insomn? I didnt' spell it like that did i? lol.. its a rare sleep disorder. AV treatment is normally prescribed.

Quite true i could put the equipment at the back and thats what i've actually considered. However that would mean transferring 3 loads of speaker cable to the front. Screed floor it'll be now. It'll have to go under the underlay or something. One issue after the next but we'll get there! Think i should start the project first.

Foundation excavation begins on monday

[albriscoe]

Originally Posted by jagdeepp

insomn? I didnt' spell it like that did i?

no, I just fell asleep typing it

if its gonna be a screed floor then its crying out for under floor heating

and speaker cables are cheaper than good HDMI`s

you know I`m right

looking forward to the construction pics

[DJMALLZ]

hey bud
may i ask, which software did you use to do the sketches?

regards

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by DJMALLZ

hey bud
may i ask, which software did you use to do the sketches?

regards

Hello mate. I used Google Sketchup. It's brilliant. Has the ability to do plans to scale. So good in fact i used it to prepare my building regs application! There are some good tutorials available via google. I prefer google sketchup 6 to 7.

This question was actually asked earlier. I apologise for not responding earlier.
Kick off with foundation work tomorrow. First dig pics will follow tomorrow. I'll try and keep this up to date. Can get lazy when you fall behind and don't have the time to upload..My other thread still hasnt had its final pics!

[albriscoe]

Come on its 9.22am

[Jamz]

Originally Posted by marshallp

Hi Jagdeepp,

Just as a matter of interest what software did you create this picture with??

Phil

Looks like google sketchup to me

Edit: woops didnt see post above

[jagdeepp]

Ok. So its begun!

Builders were here at 9am. Marked out the area. Dug in a few sharpened pieces of wood which then had tied to the some rope to highlight the areas to be dug and away they went. 2 guys were at it from 9 till I arrived home at 6pm. I understand the main chap joined them later in the afternoon.

I've been on the phone to the council who have been asked to arrange a visit on Friday. The plan is to get the concrete poured in on Saturday when 4-5 guys will be working on site. Weekend to dry out then monday should see the brick work to DPC level ready for another inspection. This is all part of the plan anyway. Of course the Council could put a spanner in the works on friday and insist on the foundations being dug deeper. Will just have to wait and see.

Had an annoying issue on day one in that the builder stated that a breaker would be needed. Off i went during the lunch break to hire one from HSS. When i arrived back home having forked out £108 for 2 days he tells me he's managed to get a massive industrial one from a friend so it wont be needed! I've called HSS and have been told by customer services that i could get a refund if i take it back first thing tomorrow unused. That means therefore i need to be there at 730am! The builder offered his apologies and even contributed £40 if i have to pay for a day or part of. NIce gesture but a 100% refund would be nice and the builder would never need to know i got that. Let it rest on his conscience... I can get him to chase in a few extra cables

Anway, here are the pics i ran out and took straight after the builder and team left. Foundation pictures certainly aren't the most interesting so i wont bore you with more till they're done and concrete is ready to go in.


Look out for the tall pieces of wood dug into the ground. These give you a rough idea as to the dimensions of the building.

This pic shows the access way to the air raid shelter. It's been filled out with some of the soil from the excavation. Over by the black bag is the massive concrete slab which covers the shelter. This'll be smashed tomorrow and the hollow 10-12 ft wide hole will be filled with more excavated soil again to save on disposal costs. Before they do that, i've instructed the builder to dig into the hole when uncovered to see if he could locate the door to the chamber which i'm told contains 3 underground rooms. This information was passed to me by the last owner who'd heard it from the previous. True or false i dont know but only one way to find out!!

Next plan is to go out and place an order for the windows and doors.

I've given up on the velux windows in the pitched roof. If i'm to use the room as a home cinema i need to control light, not flood the room with it! Plus the money saved could be put towards a HTPC that i'll be building for the room.

[MarkP80]

Hi,

I've given up on the velux windows in the pitched roof. If i'm to use the room as a home cinema i need to control light, not flood the room with it!

- don't be too hasty here. If you use genuine Velux windows, they make blackout blinds which fit perfectly, and they work a treat. I've got these, and believe me, they really do work. Also, on hot days you really feel the benefit of having these windows, they are very effective in giving you ventilation.

With regard to HDMI cables, I think I'm firmly in the camp of cable sceptic. I don't spend any more than I need to. However (you knew there was a however coming!), your cables to the projector are going to be relatively inaccessible, and even if they are in trunking it will be a pain to have to change one if it develops say a loose connection over time. For that reason, I would recommend not that you buy a cable with spurious claims about picture quality, but buy one that you know is well put together, with good quality connectors, well protected outer etc. I'm sure there are many different potential types, but I personally would recommend those made by Mark Grant, available here on the cable forum.

Don't worry about long speaker runs, provided the cable has decent cross sectional area. My old favourite is Van damme blue, not very expensive at all.

Cheers,
MarkP

[jagdeepp]

Originally Posted by MarkP80

Hi,

Also, on hot days you really feel the benefit of having these windows, they are very effective in giving you ventilation.

We have around 30 days or so of sun a year Mark! French doors plus 2 opening windows should be enough? I take your point though..

HDMI cables. I'm not a beleiver in expensive cable. Once connected the hdmi cable wont be disconnected until the next pj upgrade, so thats once every 5-10 years.. again, i'll take your point on board. Food for thought. Cheers mate!

[DaveChester]

Looking good.

What is the idea of locating the door to the underground chambers? Are you thinking you might get a tasty little basement to your garden room?


Watching with interest - wish I had the space to get something like this going!