[Robmgti]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

Also 262 stock of the PF40

I wonder if they're all linked through to Belkin's supply chain and they all quoting the same stock and then any orders are just netted off.

Strange indeed.

Originally Posted by Ianfromnotts

Drop shipping at a reduced price to clear old discontinued stock - sounds very plausable - but also presents the worry that they all will show the same problems

Agreed and Agreed.

Now worried as its coming from the same source we will receive units with the same faults back. Belkin have been great so far so at the moment im not going to push for a PF50 as a replacement, i will wait for the new unit and see what happens.

Rob

[Robmgti]

Just got callback from Belkin, replacement on its way now. The guy had spoken to a number of people this morning with the same fault - they have passed to the R&D team to investigate.

Rob

[Mr Incredible]

Well I'm getting one from here. But my daughter bought it at the "old" price. Not sure why they would now increase it to £156

If it's the swapped live/neutral issue on the cable, I'll sort it myself.

[Ianfromnotts]

a quick check on most of the suplliers who were selling at the £40 mark shows the same thing - My conclusion would be that the £40 price was as suggested before a drop shipment price direct from Belkin that has now been stopped because of the quality issues so the sellers have reverted back to the last retail price and are selling physical stock

[Flimber]

It's a shame no-one has been inside theirs as I'd love to know if there's a wire which could be detached to kill the backlight on the LCD display

[jwyg]

gonna give it a whirl from the ebay store... even at £6 more than the ballicom website it's probably worth it

[Mr Incredible]

I must be lucky then. She deffo bought it for £38.41 + £5.99 delivery!

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by Flimber

It's a shame no-one has been inside theirs as I'd love to know if there's a wire which could be detached to kill the backlight on the LCD display

I'll have look if and when mine proves to have the swapped live/neutral.

[Peridot]

I had one of these delivered yesterday (from Ballicom). I've just plugged it in and it's displaying the polarity error on the LCD display.

Serial number is O0606C00312WM

Details on the box are LOT# 29492 061226.

I'll whip the casing open in the morning and see what I find.

[mjbtin]

The listing from Ballicom on ebay has now ended early so must nhave been from the same stock as their website.

Regards Martin

[n.simpson]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

I'll have look if and when mine proves to have the swapped live/neutral.

I've been thinking a little more about the safety aspect of the swap. If the unit develops a live to earth fault then the even if the breaker popped there would still be 240V through the chassis. The likelihood of the fault is minimal but it still exists.

[n.simpson]

Originally Posted by Flimber

It's a shame no-one has been inside theirs as I'd love to know if there's a wire which could be detached to kill the backlight on the LCD display

From memory it's a ribbon cable that connects the LCD to the main board. I can double check tomorrow if you're keen to know.

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by n.simpson

I've been thinking a little more about the safety aspect of the swap. If the unit develops a live to earth fault then the even if the breaker popped there would still be 240V through the chassis. The likelihood of the fault is minimal but it still exists.

I've got an earth leakage on my main board anyway.

Even so, if the moulded plug is wired with neutral/live reversed, I am not sure why swapping the incoming wires around on the terminal block in the unit would make any difference to the operation/safety of it.

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by n.simpson

From memory it's a ribbon cable that connects the LCD to the main board. I can double check tomorrow if you're keen to know.

I think Flimber just wants the back light to be off. Perhaps the entire ribbon will remove all the info as well?

[n.simpson]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

I think Flimber just wants the back light to be off. Perhaps the entire ribbon will remove all the info as well?

I'd suspect so but you could simply bend a pin on the connector if you knew which one controlled the back light. It probably wouldn't be too difficult to work out with a multimeter.

[n.simpson]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

I've got an earth leakage on my main board anyway.

Even so, if the moulded plug is wired with neutral/live reversed, I am not sure why swapping the incoming wires around on the terminal block in the unit would make any difference to the operation/safety of it.

The only difference is that the circuit breaker is no longer on the incoming live feed. It will still be in the overall path and therefore should operate as expected but there may be a small number of possible faults that could leave the unit in a potentially dangerous state. However, you ought to have protection elsewhere in your wiring for these faults and so it's not likely to be of any major concern. Let's face it, most electrical appliances don't have additional circuit breakers and nobody loses any sleep over the same potential faults with them. I think too much time dealing with broken/faulty hardware makes me look at things from a negative view first.

[Ianfromnotts]

I have an old school retail back ground the days when customer service was paramount - I am very impressed by Ballicom but less so with belkin right now.

Yesterday when I hadnt heard back on the questions I posed via email/web site I phoned them. But today I notice a RMA isnt listed on my account details and the technical representative has updated my contact details - the only problem being he struggled with my accent and despite spelling my name and address for him one character at a time and using the police type alpha bravo phonetics he got it all wrong - I struggle to understand why he updated it any way - probably some standard call centre procedure - check and update customer address details

Other than that my account shows no record of the conversation or the promise that they would sent replacment units.

When I tag on that. The customer service number in the manual looked like a USA number so I used the UK local call rate one on the Belkin web site. It took a very long while to get through to a customer services representive who then transferred me to a Technical Assistance Representative who struggled to understand the problem at even a basic level.

I will wait till close on Monday and if I havent heard anything phone Rushden direct on 01933 352000

[Peridot]

Not surprisingly I've confirmed that mine also has the live and neutral incorrectly connected within the moulded plug.

Swapping the wires at the PCB connection within the unit gets the correct indication on the display.

However, as discussed above, this is not correcting the problem and leaves the potential for unsafe fault conditions.

I had intended to cut the moulded plug off anyway and connect the cable via a fused connection unit (spur) so I have returned the internal wiring to its original condition and will keep the unit.

It's very disappointing that a reputable company like Belkin can let this one through and somewhat ironic that they provide a unit with the unusual feature of being able to detect wiring faults and then supply it with a wiring fault

Some pics attached, including one of the display connector which is 'all in one' unfortunately.

[jwyg]

Originally Posted by pdbmjb

The listing from Ballicom on ebay has now ended early so must nhave been from the same stock as their website.

Regards Martin

yeah i ordered one from ebay and paid last night - this morning it's been refunded.

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by n.simpson

The only difference is that the circuit breaker is no longer on the incoming live feed. It will still be in the overall path and therefore should operate as expected but there may be a small number of possible faults that could leave the unit in a potentially dangerous state. However, you ought to have protection elsewhere in your wiring for these faults and so it's not likely to be of any major concern. Let's face it, most electrical appliances don't have additional circuit breakers and nobody loses any sleep over the same potential faults with them. I think too much time dealing with broken/faulty hardware makes me look at things from a negative view first.

Is the circuit breaker built into the moulded plug that plugs into the mains? If not, where does it sit in the scheme of the circuit?

If the circuit breaker is internal to the unit and if the only "fault" is the incorrectly wired live/neutral in the plug, then swapping of the live-neutral on the unit terminal block would revert the breaker's position to what it should have been if the plug had been wired correctly in the first place.

.... unless of course my assumptions are wrong!!

[Peridot]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

Is the circuit breaker built into the moulded plug that plugs into the mains? If not, where does it sit in the scheme of the circuit?

The circuit breaker is mounted on the back panel of the unit.

If you look at my first picture above - the mains cable comes in on the far left bottom corner. You can just about see a slightly darker brown wire which is the incoming supply that goes immediately to the circuit breaker. The more easily visible brown wire goes from the circuit breaker to the PCB connection.

Reversing the connections at the PCB basically means that you are using the blue wire as the Live and the brown wire as the Neutral to match the connections in the moulded plug.

Because the circuit breaker is wired in advance of the PCB connections it remains in the Neutral circuit.

Should there be an Live to Earth fault in something connected to the unit then the circuit breaker will not trip. It is then dependent on the speed of response of the next protective device in the chain to operate to protect the Power Console and the connected equipment/cable.

One risk is that the PCB tracks carrying the mains current to the various internal filters will burn out before any other protective device operates.

[Mr Incredible]

Cheers, that confirms my assumptions were indeed wrong. I'll probably just cut off the moulded plug and put my own on!

Because the circuit breaker is wired in advance of the PCB connections it remains in the Neutral circuit.

Is there a way to change the connection at the breaker rather than the PCB?

Easiest thing is probably for me to look at it once I get it! I'm having trouble visualising the connections!

[Hasnath]

Just wanted to add that the two I purchased show no sign of the fault described, so maybe a sign that the whole batch Ballicom aren't faulty but a few perhaps are.

[Mr Incredible]

It will be interesting to see if the one I get from another supplier exhibits the same problem or not. I'll just have to wait!

[Peridot]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

Is there a way to change the connection at the breaker rather than the PCB?

Easiest thing is probably for me to look at it once I get it! I'm having trouble visualising the connections!

Oddly, the incoming wire is soldered to the circuit breaker, while the internal link from the circuit breaker to the PCB uses a 'Faston' push on connector. From a production point of view this wouldn't seem to be the easiest way of making the connections

I agree that the right way to sort out the problem is to replace the plug top. Although bear in mind that the cable to the unit is 4mm2 so it won't be the easiest job to wire. It'll certainly need a high quality plug top - personally I'd recommend the MK Tough-Plug. (Much cheaper from B&Q though )

[n.simpson]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

Is there a way to change the connection at the breaker rather than the PCB?

It's possible but it would require some cutting of wires and some joining of wires. All in all, not terribly difficult BUT if Belkin will replace the units promptly then there's probably no need.

[Mr Incredible]

Much depends as well in the margin in the sales at the ±£40 and whether it's worth Belkin/distributor checking existing stock for the fault and then rectifying. They may just take it on the chin and bin the lot; it could be cheaper than any remedial work and a full refund offered to the buyer. I think I'd rather lop off the plug and replace it. Any fault which may occur in the main unit during the warranty period can be dealt with by Belkin; a plug replacement is hardly going to void any warranty IMO!

[carlymart]

Hi I have just got one and is showing a fault one both the wiring and earth.
I have swoped the live and neutral over on the pcb and the fault goes away.
I don't see the point is sending it back along as I can fix it. From reading here replacing the mains plug will do the trick. Am I correct ??????????

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by carlymart

Hi I have just got one and is showing a fault one both the wiring and earth.
I have swoped the live and neutral over on the pcb and the fault goes away.
I don't see the point is sending it back along as I can fix it. From reading here replacing the mains plug will do the trick. Am I correct ??????????

Correct, provided you swap back the neutral/live on the PCB

[carlymart]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

Correct, provided you swap back the neutral/live on the PCB

Thanks
, swapped it back straight away