Heating control advice

[StephenR]

I have recently moved into a new house and am finding a few issues with controlling the temperature in each room. I find that despite my fiddling with the TRVs on the radiators some rooms stay much cooler than the rest, particularly the top floor bedroom as the house is three stories. There is a single thermostat in the hall, and I think what tends to happen is the thermostat will switch off the heating because it has reached the desired temperature but the top room will still be too cold.

In order to resolve this problem I have thought about installing more intelligent TRVs on the radiators, perhaps something like the Hometronic system. If I understand correctly, I think this should ensure the heating stays on until each room has reached the correct temperature. I would be interested to hear from someone who has experience with these types of systems as to whether they think this would be a good way to resolve the issues I am having with room temperature, as clearly I don't want to spend money on such a system and find it hasn't helped very much! Any advice would be much appreciated.

[neilball]

Assuming that the underheating is not due to system problems - air in rads, rads undersized, inadequate flow to the top floor etc, then intelligent zone control should resolve the problem. You are right that the radiator controllers used by Hometronic have built-in local temperature measurement and all feed back their heating demand to the boiler relay module. Therefore if any radiator controller requires heat then the boiler, pump & any heating valves are switched on.

The other benefit of Hometronic will be that you can operate just the rooms that you want heated at that particular time rather than heating the entire house which can potentially save large amounts of energy if you only occupy a few rooms at any given time of day.

[StephenR]

I'm quite confident there are no fundamental problems with the system - and I would hope not because it is a new build! I have bled all radiators and the radiator in the top room does get very hot and in many cases does heat the room enough, its just that sometimes the system will turn off before the room has reached my preferred temperature.

The Hometronic system does sound good, but it may also be a bit pricey. Are there any other similar systems that have these electronic radiator values? In my searches I have only seen the ones from Hometronic, but it seems like such an obvious solution that I'm sure others must offer similar systems.

[neilball]

There is a simpler, self-install system that uses the same radiator controllers, CM Zone. It uses 2-channel programmers rather than a central unit like Hometronic. Take a look at the CM Zone website for more info. If you want to control lots of zones/rooms (i.e. control most radiators) then it can be more cost effective to go to Hometronic, the Hometronic Manager controls upto 16 rooms plus hot water and only needs 1 wireless boiler relay whereas in a CM zone system you need 1 boiler relay for every 4 CM67/CM927 units and a separate conventional timeclock for hot water.

[StephenR]

Just thought I would follow up on my post from a while ago in case anyone is looking into intelligent heating controls for their home. I ended up purchasing a Hometronic system from Sensible Heat and I am delighted with the result. It was simple to install and I have now set it up to give varying temperatures across the rooms in my house depending on usage. For example, I have set the temperature in my bedroom to increase later in the evening so that it is nice and warm when I go to bed. I now no longer have the problem of rooms being too hot or too cold because they all have their own temperature settings.

The chaps at Sensible Heat were very helpful and were able to answer all my queries promptly. I think the Hometronic system is a great investment as it should save me money by not heating rooms unnecessarily, whilst at the same time keeping the rooms heated properly when needed

[Isco 3]

Ι have the same system myself, great kit.
I have their web interface too which is a nice add on.

[sjj84]

Very interested in this as my lounge never gets up to temperature before the thermostat in the hall turns the heating off. Obviously every installation is different, but can you guys give me an indication of price please? Did you install yourself and setup yourself, or did you use the suppliers to do this?
Cheers

[Fulltopuk]

Originally Posted by StephenR

Just thought I would follow up on my post from a while ago in case anyone is looking into intelligent heating controls for their home. I ended up purchasing a Hometronic system from Sensible Heat and I am delighted with the result. It was simple to install and I have now set it up to give varying temperatures across the rooms in my house depending on usage. For example, I have set the temperature in my bedroom to increase later in the evening so that it is nice and warm when I go to bed. I now no longer have the problem of rooms being too hot or too cold because they all have their own temperature settings.

The chaps at Sensible Heat were very helpful and were able to answer all my queries promptly. I think the Hometronic system is a great investment as it should save me money by not heating rooms unnecessarily, whilst at the same time keeping the rooms heated properly when needed

Hope you don't mind me asking but how much was the system? Have you had it long enough to notice a reduction in heating bills? ie boiler on less etc.

Thanks

[owain_thomas]

Originally Posted by sjj84

Very interested in this as my lounge never gets up to temperature before the thermostat in the hall turns the heating off. Obviously every installation is different, but can you guys give me an indication of price please? Did you install yourself and setup yourself, or did you use the suppliers to do this?
Cheers

the cheaper version of this system mentioned earlier (CM Zone rather than hometronic) can cost from about £500: Honeywell YZ667A1060 CM Zone Pack [YZ667A1060] - £482.66 : UK Plumbing, online shop . This gives two zone control but can be easily upgraded to offer more zones by adding extra CM67z room units at about £60 a go (upto a maximum of 8 zones using 4 room units). If you already have honeywell TRVs on your radiators then fitting is very simple and doesn't require any plumbing work or need you to drain the system (though you may want an electrician to connect up the relay to the boiler).

It works superbly and as it is modular you can start off with a simple system for not much money and add more bits as time goes by.

[Fulltopuk]

Originally Posted by owain_thomas

the cheaper version of this system mentioned earlier (CM Zone rather than hometronic) can cost from about £500: Honeywell YZ667A1060 CM Zone Pack [YZ667A1060] - £482.66 : UK Plumbing, online shop . This gives two zone control but can be easily upgraded to offer more zones by adding extra CM67z room units at about £60 a go (upto a maximum of 8 zones using 4 room units). If you already have honeywell TRVs on your radiators then fitting is very simple and doesn't require any plumbing work or need you to drain the system (though you may want an electrician to connect up the relay to the boiler).

It works superbly and as it is modular you can start off with a simple system for not much money and add more bits as time goes by.

Quick question - How is the zone two temperature sensed if the controller always sits in zone one?

Also on the data sheets it states that the boiler controller is optional, is this because you can just control the TRVs and allow the boiler to work as though it is a conventional system?

Thanks

Fulltopuk

[owain_thomas]

Hi,

the temperature sensors are, by default, in the TRVs themselves so each room in the zone knows whether it is up to temp or not. this can be overridden so that zone one is sensed from the room unit itself but obviously the whole of that zone will then be controlled from one place. to give you an example of how it works for us we have the following zones:

1 - kitchen diner (this uses underfloor heating so the room unit is set as the sensor and there are no other TRVs bound to this zone. a single TRV controls flow into the UFH system)

2 - other downstairs rooms (so each has its own temp sensor in the TRV in that room, ensuring that all rooms stay at the set point for that zone)

3 - 1st floor rooms

4 - 2nd floor rooms

I'm pretty sure that for this system to work you need the boiler relay fitted as this is what receives the signals from the TRVs/Room Unit and then tells the boiler when it needs to come on.

HTH
owain

[Fulltopuk]

Originally Posted by owain_thomas

Hi,

the temperature sensors are, by default, in the TRVs themselves so each room in the zone knows whether it is up to temp or not. this can be overridden so that zone one is sensed from the room unit itself but obviously the whole of that zone will then be controlled from one place. to give you an example of how it works for us we have the following zones:

1 - kitchen diner (this uses underfloor heating so the room unit is set as the sensor and there are no other TRVs bound to this zone. a single TRV controls flow into the UFH system)

2 - other downstairs rooms (so each has its own temp sensor in the TRV in that room, ensuring that all rooms stay at the set point for that zone)

3 - 1st floor rooms

4 - 2nd floor rooms

I'm pretty sure that for this system to work you need the boiler relay fitted as this is what receives the signals from the TRVs/Room Unit and then tells the boiler when it needs to come on.

HTH
owain

Owain - Thanks for the information, plenty of food for thought.

Cheers

Fulltopuk