Furtonix question

[Earthworm Jim]

I have a question regarding the lighing set up I am going to put into my house, I am planning on having Futronix hopefully, but I have a few questions that maybe one of you can answer for me. In the main living room I want to have one of these:

Dimmers, Lighting Controls, Home Automation - (P100 Dimmer) - Futronix - the leading dimmer manufacturer

Now in the dining room that joins onto the living room has its own lighing circuit I am just wondering if I can get one of these:

Dimmers, Lighting Controls, Home Automation - (P50 Dimmer) - Futronix - the leading dimmer manufacturer

To controll the lights in the dining room, but, is it going to be possible to have the one in the main living room control the one in the dining room, but still be able to have the one in the dining room operate by itself if I want to.

For Example: I walk in a hit the button on the wall of the living room and both lights turn on, but if I want to only have the lights on in the living room and not the dining room I can just hit the button in the dining room turning it off. Or is this not going to be possible. Both rooms are on a seperate lighting circuit and its going to be too difficult and expensive to get it joined onto the same. As it used to be 2 seperate rooms but I have now opened it up into one room.

[Earthworm Jim]

There are also lights on the walls on the dining room that are controlled by a switch on next to the plug sockets, is there a way I can remove the switch and add a wireless device to so I can turn on all lights at the same time? I can always just get rid of the lights on the wall and just have a ceiling light, its not a very big room so can easily get away with it.

[patrober]

you wont be able to control the p50 circuit from the p100 circuit - if you want a secondary switch for the diningroom circuit you would need to install the p800, with the outstation wall switch if i remember rightly (its been a while since ive looked at the futronix stuff).

This will be a huge jump in cost of course!

You could use the p100 or p400 and use one circuit for the dining room, the rest in the sitting room and have a scene with both on, and another with just the sitting room on - you wont be able to have a 2nd wall switch just for the dining room though. You could control this with the remote of course.

Remember when wiring these that they will need a neutral feed to the switch which isnt usual. Dont think you need it for the p50. I tried the p50 and didnt like it - it was a bit noisy (buzzy) but that was a while ago - they may have improved that now.

On the second question (wall lights)- What i would do is have that as another circuit and have all controlled by a p400. Say 2 circuits in the sitting room, 1 for main lights in dining room ,and one for the wall lights. You can then setup some nice scenes with combinations of circuits on/off/dimmed etc. You would remove the switch from the wall and bring the circuit for hte wall lights back to the p400 which may be quite a task depending on your wiring etc. It works nice though - I have 2 p400s , 1 in sitting room , and one in dining room - the one in the dining room has wall lights as a separate circuit and depending on the scene they are on or off, or dimmed along with the other lights.

P

[Earthworm Jim]

Thanks Pat, that does sound like quite a good idea but no idea how I could go about doing it as the wall lights in the dining room are wired to the plug sockets at the bottom (really really stupid I know but blame the people who lived there before me haha)

What I might just do it get a P50 for the dining room anyway, and just get one of those halogen spotlight lights, its a pretty small room so doesnt need alot of light, one bright ceiling light should do it more than enough justice so I'll take off the wall lights.

As for the living room there is currently one plate with two old style turn dimmers, one for the wall lights in the living room and one for the ceiling lights (two circuits) so one P100 will do for that am I correct?

I could do the whole P800 as you mentioned but that I think is too much effort for what its worth as I will need a sparky to come in and connect the circuits and would cost too much.

[neilball]

If you want full control of all circuits then you could go wireless - you could use Rako (PIL dimmers could be fitted in the back boxes as long as there are no low-voltage lamps on the circuits) with Rako wireless keypads.

[patrober]

the p100 would work - 2 circuits are in that one - remember you will need a neutral which wont normally be at the wall switch so you will need to run an extra wire from neutral to the switch point - straight forward(ish) if your wiring is in conduit but not so straight forward if its embedded in the wall for example.

Rako as mentioned elsewhere is possibly an option - ive not used them so cant comment.


P

[Earthworm Jim]

hmm, my wiring is embedded into the wall, what is the neutral switch? Is that hte earth wire that is connected to the back box?

[patrober]

Originally Posted by Earthworm Jim

hmm, my wiring is embedded into the wall, what is the neutral switch? Is that hte earth wire that is connected to the back box?

In a normal plug/socket (ignore lighting for the moment) there is live (used to be red, now brown i think), earth (yellow striped) and neutral (blue or black)

In a light switch there is usually only the live and live return ie the switch routes the live to the light. At the light there will be this switched live, a neutral, and sometimes an earth if it needs it.

The back box as you said, can be connected (should be?!) to earth - this is not the neutral alas.

because the futronix box is powered, it needs a neutral to complete the circuit hence the need for neutral. Its a pain as you cant just retrofit these easily unless you are doing a major redecorate or rewiring.

P

[Earthworm Jim]

Originally Posted by patrober

In a normal plug/socket (ignore lighting for the moment) there is live (used to be red, now brown i think), earth (yellow striped) and neutral (blue or black)

In a light switch there is usually only the live and live return ie the switch routes the live to the light. At the light there will be this switched live, a neutral, and sometimes an earth if it needs it.

The back box as you said, can be connected (should be?!) to earth - this is not the neutral alas.

because the futronix box is powered, it needs a neutral to complete the circuit hence the need for neutral. Its a pain as you cant just retrofit these easily unless you are doing a major redecorate or rewiring.

P

Dam, looks like I'll have to discount Futronix then, since I am doing a renovation but am not moving electrics or anything, how about the Lutron System will that suite my needs, I would have 3 boxes, 1 in the lounge, 1 in the dining room and 1 in the kitchen.

I like the idea of the timing system in the Futronix that will slowly fade lighter in the mornings that got to be awesome

[Earthworm Jim]

Hmmm, looks like Rako can do that too just need another box, might be worth looking into Rako

[patrober]

Originally Posted by Earthworm Jim

Hmmm, looks like Rako can do that too just need another box, might be worth looking into Rako

theres also x10 as well - that may be worthwhile looking at. letsautomate.com stock that kit i think.

When i started all this (few years ago now) x10 was a little unreliable, and rako was just coming out - or certainly more basic than it seems to be now. Im probably going to stick to the futronix route for my next project (cinema room) as it matches the other rooms, and I know how to install it!

P

[Earthworm Jim]

Originally Posted by patrober

theres also x10 as well - that may be worthwhile looking at. letsautomate.com stock that kit i think.

When i started all this (few years ago now) x10 was a little unreliable, and rako was just coming out - or certainly more basic than it seems to be now. Im probably going to stick to the futronix route for my next project (cinema room) as it matches the other rooms, and I know how to install it!

P

Yeah I'd really like to go the Futronix route but after looking into it a bit more its not going to be worth it for me as I would need to re wire my light circuits so thats gonna just be way to much, I'll look into the X10, thanks again for all your advice so far

[Earthworm Jim]

OK so on doing tons of research last night I have setteled on the Rako system, now if someone can help me out with what I would need to purchase

In the living room I have 1 ceiling light and 3 wall lights all currently controlled via an old 2 dial dimmer, I take it I just buy the RDT PILL and stick it in the current back box and connect the new Rako face plate to it and that will then take care of the that? But am I right in thinking that I can put a faceplate anywhere and it doesnt need to be in the current back box, as that would be a great help because the current light controller is in a really stupid place

In the dining room there is another ceiling light, I take it I that is just another RDT PILL and a 1 circuit face plate? Each of the current light switched are currently only 2 wires (live and neutral) and an earth wire connected to the back box, will I need to add more cabling?

I am getting electric blinds in the dining room and I read somewhere that I can control the blinds using the Rako system, how would I go about doing this as that would be something quite usefull.

Sorry for all the questions but its really helping