[The News Bot]

Reviewed by Phil Hinton
The LG 50PS8000 offers extremely good HD images with the most extensive calibration tools on the market. Plus it has an accurate enough THX preset for those who decide that ISF is not quite for them yet. And finally, all this comes with a screen measuring 50 inches for less than £1100. Even with the minor problems found with image retention and freeview lip sync, I still think this is a bit of a bargain and would recommend you get a demo if you’re in this end of the TV market. It’s a big screen best buy in my opinion and you have money left over to get it calibrated to its very best performance levels.
Read the full review...

[gorman]

Thanks for the review Phil!

Some questions:

1) Black levels. You don't offer instrumental measurements. To me "they are certainly improved slightly on last years PG7000 TV" is not very useful, as I have no experience with those panels. "but not quite up there with the Pioneer and indeed, the latest Panasonic’s are probably a smidge better here as well." is even more confusing. 9G Kuros are capable of displaying blacks an order of magnitude blacker than 12G Panasonics. What you write really is not answering the main question I had with this panel.

2) I am confused about the grayscale calibration process. From reading the manual I gathered that you had R,G,B cut and drive controls (brightess and contrast) for every point along the IRE scale, in steps of 5%. You mention "To correct the greyscale high and low points, you select 2 point for the white fields and as you move between the contrast and brightness controls in the menu, it changes the field to the appropriate level." and I'm really lost here. What 2 points? Are you saying that you can assing RGB correction levels only on two points along the IRE scale? Two points of your choosing, selected from the 20 available?
From reading the manual (page 108) I was expecting something along the lines of what Lumagen offers in their video processor but I could be mistaken or you just described method a) from the manual and failed to mention method b). I can't understand how with a 20 point correction system this could provide worst grayscale tracking when compared to the P42G10 you previously reviewed. Unless it's a gimmick, that is.

3) With the CMS available, how was it not possible to hit all the points in the triangle. I understand it's not 3D, hence the deltaE for luminance... but at least on the triangle everything should be perfect, shouldn't it?

Finally... would you say this is a better performer than last year's Panasonics?

[pwood]

The blue light running through the bottom edge can it be turned off, if not is this annoying when watching in the dark? Phil during testing how did the overall noise of the screen (fan/buzz) compare with the G10 and other plasma screens?

Image retention is a concern but if thats all it is then fair enough. Would I be having to worry if I left News 24 on for an hour or so on a regular basis?

I was considering a PS6000 but from the review the THX mode seems a good feature to have as it means the picture will be close to spot on from day one.

Thanks for the review Phil

[Welsh Whirlwind]

Originally Posted by pwood

The blue light running through the bottom edge can it be turned off, if not is this annoying when watching in the dark? Phil during testing how did the overall noise of the screen (fan/buzz) compare with the G10 and other plasma screens?

Image retention is a concern but if thats all it is then fair enough. Would I be having to worry if I left News 24 on for an hour or so on a regular basis?

I'd like to echo these questions, particularly about image retention as my TV is mainly tuned in to News 24/ Sky Sports News channels for a number of hours (4-6hrs +).

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by pwood

The blue light running through the bottom edge can it be turned off, if not is this annoying when watching in the dark? Phil during testing how did the overall noise of the screen (fan/buzz) compare with the G10 and other plasma screens?

Image retention is a concern but if thats all it is then fair enough. Would I be having to worry if I left News 24 on for an hour or so on a regular basis?

I was considering a PS6000 but from the review the THX mode seems a good feature to have as it means the picture will be close to spot on from day one.

Thanks for the review Phil

The blue light only comes on when you power the set up, it is off for normal viewing (You can switch it off completely in the menus).

Image retention is there and watching something like Sky news will leave shadows of the logos on screen when you change channels. There will stay there for up to 20 minutes depending on what kind of image you change to, if its bright then you will only notice the shadow now and again until it goes.

THX mode is certainly the best out of the box setting we found during reviewing. It is not perfect and I would always recommend a calibration, but for every day viewing, it is certainly better than the other presets.

[Warrior668]

Thanks for the review Phil!

Can you post a measured Black Level in cd/m² or ftL please?


Sincerely,

Warrior668

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by gorman

Thanks for the review Phil!

Some questions:

1) Black levels. You don't offer instrumental measurements. To me "they are certainly improved slightly on last years PG7000 TV" is not very useful, as I have no experience with those panels. "but not quite up there with the Pioneer and indeed, the latest Panasonic’s are probably a smidge better here as well." is even more confusing. 9G Kuros are capable of displaying blacks an order of magnitude blacker than 12G Panasonics. What you write really is not answering the main question I had with this panel.

2) I am confused about the grayscale calibration process. From reading the manual I gathered that you had R,G,B cut and drive controls (brightess and contrast) for every point along the IRE scale, in steps of 5%. You mention "To correct the greyscale high and low points, you select 2 point for the white fields and as you move between the contrast and brightness controls in the menu, it changes the field to the appropriate level." and I'm really lost here. What 2 points? Are you saying that you can assing RGB correction levels only on two points along the IRE scale? Two points of your choosing, selected from the 20 available?
From reading the manual (page 108) I was expecting something along the lines of what Lumagen offers in their video processor but I could be mistaken or you just described method a) from the manual and failed to mention method b). I can't understand how with a 20 point correction system this could provide worst grayscale tracking when compared to the P42G10 you previously reviewed. Unless it's a gimmick, that is.

3) With the CMS available, how was it not possible to hit all the points in the triangle. I understand it's not 3D, hence the deltaE for luminance... but at least on the triangle everything should be perfect, shouldn't it?

Finally... would you say this is a better performer than last year's Panasonics?

1) Black levels are difficult to measure and to do so consitantly accross differing screen technologies. Because of this we do not quote readings at 0ire as its such a difficult thing to do correctly (plus some technologies cheat at this level, such as LED and some LCDs). We are talking with our technical advisors and looking at a possible test we could bring in, but we will only do this when it can be done consistantly and accurately. (obviously our measures are there to see in the charts, but again thats only accurate to our i1 pro, which is not great under 15 ire).

2) Yes, this LG does allow 20 point calibration of the greyscale, I have made this point clearer in the review. I looked at this and it uses grey fields built into the TV, but I was not entirely happy using them as you just don't know where it is brought in within the video chain. As such I used the sencore and did a normal two point calibration initially for the review. However, when I was looking at this again today, I found an option where you can by-pass the in-built patterns and we could use our pattern generator. So, I have updated our calibration results in the review to take this into account. Its just a pity I cannot add another point to the calibration scores for the LG as this kind fo flexibility is stunning for a consumer TV. Obviously people can calibrate using the in-built patterns, I just felt there was no control point that we knew was accurate, like our Sencore for the review. BTW, there was no instruction manual with this review TV, so I cannot comment on what it says in there.

3) The CMS controls are just 2D and not 3D, so we have to balance the accuracy of the points for x,y and then Y. Plus its important to keep an eye on your DeltaE errors. The Gamut produced by the LG is actually limited - as noted in the review - for the blue point. It cannot extend to meet this point so we cannot add in what is not there. because of this we have to balance the other points against this built in error, and of course try to keep the other colours as accurate as possible while also watching our luminace and DeltaE errors. As you can see luminance is the most difficult area to keep right and the DeltaE for blue and cyan are as issue with the LG's restricted gamut, but overall, it not that bad and only the most accurate of eyes would actually see these errors in normal materials. If we had a 3D system, we could get even more accurate, or with this 2D system we could be slightly inaccurate against Rec709 and get the luminance and deltaEs more accurate, its a balancing act with a 2D system.

In terms of last years Panasonics I reviewed, from memory I would say this LG is certainly about the same for black levels and contrast. It's only in the most dynamic of black scenes where you will notice the lack of absolute black with the LG, or in a very bright room with spill on the screen surface.

Hope that answers your questions and thanks for prompting me to look again at the IRE fields in the TV as I wouldn't have found the by pass mode. Cheers!

[gorman]

Originally Posted by Phil Hinton

Hope that answers your questions and thanks for prompting me to look again at the IRE fields in the TV as I wouldn't have found the by pass mode. Cheers!

Thanks for all the answers! And thanks for the... thanks in the review!

Too bad for the image retention thing. That is really painful to read. Did you allow for the set to break in somehow? I would guess yes, but I ask anyway. For me it's kind of a deal breaker. For the rest the TV, for what it costs, it's really good. But image retention... I could not live with it.

One last thing: the screenshots from Calman are still the ones from the previous calibration, right? Any chance of updating them in case they are?

Cheers!

Edit: also, what's with the ISF password? Is it really something they don't give to regular buyers? Many hobbyists would hate that.

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by gorman

Thanks for all the answers! And thanks for the... thanks in the review!

Too bad for the image retention thing. That is really painful to read. Did you allow for the set to break in somehow? I would guess yes, but I ask anyway. For me it's kind of a deal breaker. For the rest the TV, for what it costs, it's really good. But image retention... I could not live with it.

One last thing: the screenshots from Calman are still the ones from the previous calibration, right? Any chance of updating them in case they are?

Cheers!

Edit: also, what's with the ISF password? Is it really something they don't give to regular buyers? Many hobbyists would hate that.

You're welcome, if you hadn't prompted me to look, I wouldn't have found the hidden option.
The test panel I have here has seemingly been on the road with most of the Magazines and was a replacment for one that turned up smashed and has been running non-stop here for two weeks, so well run in.. The retention is one of those things you will either live with and not really see, or you will see it and it will annoy the hell out of you. You really have to see one I guess and check.
Screenshots were updated.
The ISF password will remain hidden from consumers, calibrators have to get it direct from LG.

[gorman]

Originally Posted by Phil Hinton

The ISF password will remain hidden from consumers, calibrators have to get it direct from LG.

Hmmm... as a Calman user I would not be so happy about this.

Thanks for everything!

PS
Any chance of an upcoming Samsung plasma review (B series I mean)?

Originally Posted by Phil Hinton

The Gamut produced by the LG is actually limited - as noted in the review - for the blue point. It cannot extend to meet this point so we cannot add in what is not there.

A quick look at the User Manual for the 50PS80 references a function under Expert Picture Control/Advanced called "Color Gamut - Wide," which says:

Standard: Displays standard color area.
Wide: Mode to use and set the rich color area of the display.
■ Maximize the utilization of color to increase color quality.
■ In Advanced Control mode, this feature is enabled in “Color Temperature - Warm

Is this true also of the 50PS8000? If so, wouldn't "Wide Mode" allow gamut expansion to include the default Blue x,y points?

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by NextTime

A quick look at the User Manual for the 50PS80 references a function under Expert Picture Control/Advanced called "Color Gamut - Wide," which says:

Standard: Displays standard color area.
Wide: Mode to use and set the rich color area of the display.
■ Maximize the utilization of color to increase color quality.
■ In Advanced Control mode, this feature is enabled in “Color Temperature - Warm

Is this true also of the 50PS8000? If so, wouldn't "Wide Mode" allow gamut expansion to include the default Blue x,y points?

It was measured in both, even in wide mode the blue point is still off in the gamut. Infact it measures exactly the same as in standard as the gamut cannot extend to cover the blue point. It is an issue with this set and we can do nothing to add back what is not there.

[Warrior668]

Thanks, for sharing the reason, why you don´t post a measured black level.

But i still have one question.

You got a 0.0000 reading at 0 IRE.
Did the panel switch off, or is the black level below the i1Pro reading ablilities?


I am shocked, that the i1 Pro measurement range is :0.2 to 300 cd/m2.
Even the i1 Display 2 goes down to 0.05 cd/m2.

But maybe you can get a Konica Minolta CS-2000, Introduction-CS-2000 | KONICA MINOLTA, or a Minolta LS-100, http://www.konicaminolta.com/instrum...110/index.html, for black level measurement.

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Warrior668

Thanks, for sharing the reason, why you don´t post a measured black level.

But i still have one question.

You got a 0.0000 reading at 0 IRE.
Did the panel switch off, or is the black level below the i1Pro reading ablilities?


I am shocked, that the i1 Pro measurment range is :0.2 to 300 cd/m2.
Even the i1 Display 2 goes down to 0.05 cd/m2.

But maybe you can get a Konica Minolta CS-2000, Introduction-CS-2000 | KONICA MINOLTA, for black level measurement.

The problem you have with most meters is that they are not accurate at such low levels. The reason we don't meaure is that you simply cannot get repeatable and consistant results with the majority of meters under £5k. Light levels are usually at or below what that meter is sensitive at. Even if its specifications say it can do so, it is never consistant and repeatable, we have looked at this and decided its better not to publish results. Some other reviewers do so, but you should be looking at what tools they are using to see if it is consistant, repeatable and accurate.
Saying that, reviewing by eye and side by side, the human eye is quite sensitive in a dark room to see the differences in black levels. And remember that although the Kuro does absolute black very well, it is certainly not the be all and end all, even though desirable. The actual black performance with the dynamic range of the set within the actual picture is more important in my opinion than a cheat such as those used by some displays which just switch off the backlight.

[Warrior668]

Thank you, for the clarification.

Now i hope, that you get a Samsung B Series Plasma for a review.


THANK YOU!

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Warrior668

Thank you, for the clarification.

Now i hope, that you get a Samsung B Series Plasma for a review.


THANK YOU!

The request has gone in!

[gorman]

Originally Posted by Phil Hinton

The request has gone in!

Thanks! Much appreciated.

[namuk]

Very good Review . I do like the Screen set-up features nice touch that i do like the look of this in General ..

Between this and the PDP-LX5090 which would be the better pick?

[Pecker]

Another great review of one of the most interesting products I've seen.

A quick question on the THX mode. Whilst you can't adjust brightness & contrast (or anything else) can you see what levels these are set to? If so, couldn't you just programme the 'User' option to identical values and adjust brightness/contrast there?

Sorry, I've probably not worded that very well...

Steve W

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Pecker

Another great review of one of the most interesting products I've seen.

A quick question on the THX mode. Whilst you can't adjust brightness & contrast (or anything else) can you see what levels these are set to? If so, couldn't you just programme the 'User' option to identical values and adjust brightness/contrast there?

Sorry, I've probably not worded that very well...

Steve W

No you can't do that Steve, as the menu is greyed out and you cannot access anything past the main menu page, i.e. the advanced menus are not seen and you're unable to access.

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by namuk

Very good Review . I do like the Screen set-up features nice touch that i do like the look of this in General ..

Between this and the PDP-LX5090 which would be the better pick?

Obviously the LX5090 (if you can find one) is the better screen in terms of performance (it is still our reference screen that every TV is put up against here), but then again it should be at twice the price of this LG. However, as I said in the review in terms of in picture blacks and colour balance, the LG does an excellent job of trying to keep up. Hope that helps.

[Spetz-natz]

Thanks for the great review i'm really keen to get this TV but the image retention issue is scaring me off a bit

Can you please tell me if the image retention is so bad that i'll risk permanently damaging this screen if I play my xbox or PS3 on it for a few hours?
Thanks in advance

Paul

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Spetz-natz

Thanks for the great review i'm really keen to get this TV but the image retention issue is scaring me off a bit

Can you please tell me if the image retention is so bad that i'll risk permanently damaging this screen if I play my xbox or PS3 on it for a few hours?
Thanks in advance

Paul

I had Sky news running for about four hours one day and once I switched channels and had watched about 20 minutes of other content, the retention had gone. Obviously, as with any display device it is recommended that you don't push things like watching this material in really bright picture modes such as vivid or you could cause permanent damage.

[Spetz-natz]

Thanks
Were you able to test if there was any noticeable lag between the TV and a games console? if not would you be able to do this
what was the game mode like? is it bright? will this setting assist in reducing the risk caused by the image retention?

would you recommend that i get this set over lets say the panasonic G10 (or v10 when it is released)? as I will be watching blurays but most of my time will be spent playing on my gaming consoles.

Thanks again
Paul

[Phil Hinton]

Originally Posted by Spetz-natz

Thanks
Were you able to test if there was any noticeable[FONT=&quot]e [/FONT]lag between the TV and a games console? if not would you be able to do this
what was the game mode like? is it bright? will this setting assist in reducing the risk caused by the image retention?

would you recommend that i get this set over lets say the panasonic G10 (or v10 when it is released)? as I will be watching blurays but most of my time will be spent playing on my gaming consoles.

Thanks again
Paul

No I didn't test the lag time, but there is a dedicated games mode.

Games mode was overblown and had cartoon like colour balance, but then again its a games mode.

If you were to play hour after hour of games, I would think it possible you may cause some damage. It might be best to set up the preset so it is not as bright and bold, hense reducing any chance of screen burn - same advice for any plasma really.

I really can't recommend what you buy, that I am afraid has to be your choice, but hopefully I have given you enough information to know what to look for when you demo this TV. David has also reviewed the G10 so why not have a quick read of that review. We can't say anything about the V10 yet (we have seen them but only pre-production models), however we will review it as soon as we can. But again, the final choice will have to be yours!

[namuk]

Originally Posted by Phil Hinton

Obviously the LX5090 (if you can find one) is the better screen in terms of performance (it is still our reference screen that every TV is put up against here), but then again it should be at twice the price of this LG. However, as I said in the review in terms of in picture blacks and colour balance, the LG does an excellent job of trying to keep up. Hope that helps.

it does Phil .
Nice one thanks ,,

[Monarch]

Originally Posted by Spetz-natz

Thanks for the great review i'm really keen to get this TV but the image retention issue is scaring me off a bit

Can you please tell me if the image retention is so bad that i'll risk permanently damaging this screen if I play my xbox or PS3 on it for a few hours?
Thanks in advance

Paul

I use a PG6000 for gaming and there is image retention (obviously) but I can still play on the PS3 for a few hours with no worries other than IR which will wash away after 20-30 minutes (no more than 10 minutes until it reaches the point where you have to go up really close to see it). I've played on a few games with fairly bright HUDs for up to 3 and a half hours or so and so far no permanent damage .

As long as you keep the settings off vivid and the like and take the necessary steps to reduce it (orbitter on etc...) then you should be ok, just take it easy in the early hours. Obviously if you have a habit of gaming all day (or all night) on occasions then you could be walking into trouble. As mentioned though, demo it next to the G10 or V10 and see which you like best

hope that was of some help (although not specific to the PS8000 exactly!)

[Spetz-natz]

Originally Posted by Monarch08

I use a PG6000 for gaming and there is image retention (obviously) but I can still play on the PS3 for a few hours with no worries other than IR which will wash away after 20-30 minutes (no more than 10 minutes until it reaches the point where you have to go up really close to see it). I've played on a few games with fairly bright HUDs for up to 3 and a half hours or so and so far no permanent damage .

As long as you keep the settings off vivid and the like and take the necessary steps to reduce it (orbitter on etc...) then you should be ok, just take it easy in the early hours. Obviously if you have a habit of gaming all day (or all night) on occasions then you could be walking into trouble. As mentioned though, demo it next to the G10 or V10 and see which you like best

hope that was of some help (although not specific to the PS8000 exactly!)

Thanks for that info and advice. Your gamming habits seem very similar to mine
When you take the setting of vivid etc does it impact the look of your games? what does the game setting look like on the PG6000? as i will assume the PS8000 will be vey similar.
do you notice much of a lag on the PG6000?
Thanks

[Monarch]

I personlly don't put it on vivid in any cases, it looks terrible even with gaming on! it looks far too bright and I do like a sense of relism in the games, I have my settings set to roughly calibrated settings but with a few tweaks to bring the colours out a little more (just a little) and I think they're perfect.

The game setting looks overly bright, as with the PS8000 (I would assume and going from Phils comments) but I tweaked away to reduce that scary look. The picture is great, especially for £400 (32" version), the blacks are poor but from what I've gathered that has vastly improved in the new models like the PS8000. I can't say I've noticed any input lag on mine, but I never really look out for it and it doesn't seem to affect me as much as it does some others.

Phil very good review !!!

I already ordered it, but still have some doubts because I am also looking LCD Sony KDL-52V5500 for cca £1,600 (no IR, DLNA).
KDL-52V5500 (KDL52V5500) : Overview : BRAVIA TV : Sony

Any suggestions ?