[Mr Incredible]

Although I have voiced my concerns about the apparent intrusion of religious beliefs onto non-believers day-to-day lives, equally I am of the opinion that as long as anyone's beliefs don't interfere or harm other's lives, then they can do as they like.

So with that in mind, I was surprised at the recent cause brought by a Hindu who wanted to be cremated on an open-air pyre.

AFP: Newcastle Hindu loses fight for open-air cremation

If the pyre was managed sensitively and away from public eyes, on what grounds would the ban be justified other than that of potentially offending sensibilities of those with a different outlook on death? I think they should accommodate the guys wishes.

We Brits like to think of ourselves as a tolerant country and baulk at the less-tolerant regimes/religions etc who seek to repress and control. I think the ruling upholding the ban has no basis in the context of a multi-cultural nation.

Besides, burning of a renewable fuel would be better than burning natural gas wouldn't it? Joking aside, I hope the guy wins his appeal to the House of Lords.

[Sporran]

not being funny but with maccy d, KFC, dominoes and the local curry house there are enough meaty smells around at the moment.

[William YZF-R1]

Firstly I would like to say I am not a rascist but I do wonder if permission had been granted the floodgates would have to open for others.

Before you know it local open spaces everywhere would be covered in prepared & used funeral pyres.

Most of us would be unlikely to have sufficient space in our own back gardens to conduct this sort of thing, so I would assume the deceased families would usually be in the same position.

I can put up with the neighbours BBQ's but this would be something else.

[Mr Incredible]

If the pyre was managed sensitively and away from public eyes...

I very much doubt that an organised / approved pyre would be allowed in a back garden or an open public space.

I could imagine several dedicated places where open air pyres could be managed just like crematoriums are built for "traditional" cremations. I don't the see the difference myself. Just like my local crematorium, I don't see it, I don't smell it and it doesn't bother me the practice happens. It wouldn't bother me if there was an open air pyre either.

[William YZF-R1]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

I very much doubt that an organised / approved pyre would be allowed in a back garden or an open public space.

I could imagine several dedicated places where open air pyres could be managed just like crematoriums are built for "traditional" cremations. I don't the see the difference myself. Just like my local crematorium, I don't see it, I don't smell it and it doesn't bother me the practice happens. It wouldn't bother me if there was an open air pyre either.

When you put it like that it sounds fine. Was a suitable place suggested in the proposal?

I can't help but think that the design of "traditional" crems (gas burners/ tall chimneys etc) are designed to prevent smoke, smells etc.

[Mr Incredible]

Other than near water, I couldn't find any reference to a specifc locale.

But I don't think the ruling was necessarily just about locale...

"The government, named as an interested party in the case, had argued that "others in the community would be upset and offended... and would find it abhorrent that human remains were being burned in this way," the judgement said."

[Mr Incredible]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

When you put it like that it sounds fine. Was a suitable place suggested in the proposal?

I can't help but think that the design of "traditional" crems (gas burners/ tall chimneys etc) are designed to prevent smoke, smells etc.

Maybe that's the case. But there's a sewerage works a mile or two from me and I've never smelt it! Even on a day with the wind in the right direction! But get close to it and you can smell it.

Perhaps we could ask that the bodies are stored up until the 5th November.

Properly planned and located, I can't see why open-air pyres cannot co-exist.

[hufartd]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

Before you know it local open spaces everywhere would be covered in prepared & used funeral pyres.

If some clown comes up with the idea of burying people, one on top of the other in wooden boxes, maybe with a big granite block sticking out the ground.
Before you know it parks and football pitches would be littered with them.

I see no reason why not, we keep hiding death away maybe we should be more open about it all

[William YZF-R1]

Originally Posted by hufartd

If some clown comes up with the idea of burying people, one on top of the other in wooden boxes, maybe with a big granite block sticking out the ground.
Before you know it parks and football pitches would be littered with them.

I see no reason why not, we keep hiding death away maybe we should be more open about it all

My ex wife was buried on top of her mothers coffin in a cemetary. I am sorry but I don't understand your point. People are not buried on football pitches or parks.

[Miyazaki]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

I am not a rascist... floodgates would open

Ah, two traditional calling cards of the racist.

[William YZF-R1]

Originally Posted by Miyazaki

Ah, two traditional calling cards of the racist.

You could at least spell RASCIST properly, and no I'm not. When in Rome do as the Romans do is what I adhere too.

I wouldn't walk around in Saudi swigging from a bottle of beer.

[Ed Selley]

Many years ago, when my partner and I were looking for a home we looked at a suspiciously great house that was in budget. Throughout the viewing, there was a curious "sweet" smell both outside and inside parts of the house as well. This smell it transpired was the crematorium.

With this in mind, I can't say I am falling over myself for open air pyres to be allowed as precedent is precedent and what has been allowed once, is likely to be allowed again.

Personally- I want to be composted .

[Ed Selley]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

You could at least spell RASCIST properly, and no I'm not. When in Rome do as the Romans do is what I adhere too.

He did.

[William YZF-R1]

Apologies - .

Put it down to my own ignorance about racism

[Miyazaki]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

You could at least spell RASCIST properly, and no I'm not. When in Rome do as the Romans do is what I adhere too.

I wouldn't walk around in Saudi swigging from a bottle of beer.

Sorry but whenever anyone uses the term "floodgates" I feel the long scratching fingernails of Enoch Powell or his cronies at the Daily Mail.

Using the term "I am not a racist but" doesn't ever justify any kind of racist comment, yet plenty of racists think it does.

BTW what is a rascist?

[Saldawop]

What does this have to do with race? Isnt it about religion?

[dBrowne]

Originally Posted by Mr Incredible

We Brits like to think of ourselves as a tolerant country and baulk at the less-tolerant regimes/religions etc who seek to repress and control. I think the ruling upholding the ban has no basis in the context of a multi-cultural nation.

Besides, burning of a renewable fuel would be better than burning natural gas wouldn't it? Joking aside, I hope the guy wins his appeal to the House of Lords.

I do too. Also looking forward to the day that a resident Tibetan Buddhist insists upon a sky burial. Even more ecologically sound as no burning is involved. Smell lingers a little longer though.

[krish]

I was born a Hindu, though have been atheist for as long as I can remember ... my folks, like many, are a bit wishy-washy on the god thing but are still Hindus

When it comes to their funerals they already have planned this out with a crematorium, and most certainly are not hoping for an open pyre (nor that their bodies should be flown to India for such a cremation) - and that is the case with everyone they know around the country from the same background and age group (60/70 somethings like this chap in the news).

I asked my dad (74 this July) just this evening what he thought of this chap, and he just laughed and said it was a load of (= testes) and this bloke would be laughed at in India for what he's trying to do; and on a less pee-taking note just said culturally Hindus wherever they are usually adapt to their surroundings rather than force their very mild religious practices on others. Anyway I thought it was worth sharing this view of a septuagenarian Hindu born in India who moved to the UK 43 years ago (unlike this chap who came from Kenya ... my old man has a bit more to say about Indians born and bred in Africa, but best leave that for now ).

[Sonic67]

What happens when all those who are following the jedi religion die?

[Codehead]

I followed the story on the Beeb, and I was of the same opinion as the OP. I don't have a problem with it.

As for those who say that 'they'll be doing it everywhere', a funeral is a private ceremony for a grieving family. We Brits don't dig a hole just anywhere and throw the body in. I imagine the pyres would be held in out of the way areas, free of gawpers and those who might want to interfere.

Interesting bit from Krish, I'll hold my hand up to not knowing a great deal about Hinduism, but I have seen the old 'poke 'em with a stick to keep e'm lying flat' videos of funeral pyres near the Gangees.

Ona tangent, my family has Nordic history, and we have always had a bit of a Viking thing going on, especially my Dad. I'd love to do the whole firing flaming arrows into a boat thing when his time comes.

[Ethics Gradient]

The only issue I have is that it is currently against the law.

If they petition for a change in the law, and then a registered and regulated pyre cremation service is set up, then I don't really see much problem.
.... and tbh - I don't see any real reason why a change in the law with regulation should be an issue.

They'd have to cover health and saftey, and other usual red tape, but if specific areas were set up for such events, and they were only handled by regulated services, I doubt many would worry too much, since it's no real difference to any other form of cremation ..... we burn field loads of cows and sheep when there is an epidemic.

As peeps know, I am not very fond of religious practices , but regardless of that, if done correctly, it should not harm anyone else and as I mentioned and I can't see it having any different environmental or public health impacts over normal cremation at a crematorium (again if regulated).

[mij]

I strongly believe in accommodating all religious practices, as long as it does not interfere with or offend or impose it's beliefs or practises on me or any one else that is not interested.

[Decadence]

I wouldn't mind as long as it was out of the way and not next to Bowfer's house...it's better than those people who throw bodies on the rocks for birds to eat, that would not be nice.

[krish]

Originally Posted by Codehead

Interesting bit from Krish, I'll hold my hand up to not knowing a great deal about Hinduism, but I have seen the old 'poke 'em with a stick to keep e'm lying flat' videos of funeral pyres near the Gangees.

They would like their ashes to be scattered in the Ganges at some point before I pop my clogs .... though would most probably be shortly after cremation.

Originally Posted by Decadence

I wouldn't mind as long as it was out of the way and not next to Bowfer's house...it's better than those people who throw bodies on the rocks for birds to eat, that would not be nice.

You're probably thinking of Zoroastrianism (Zoroastrianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia).
Freddie Mercury (born Farrokh Bulsara) was a Parsi Indian (Persian origin) and therefore Zoroastrian - his funeral was conducted by a Zoroastrian priest, and he had a standard cremation.

Disposal of the dead: In Zoroastrian scripture and tradition, a corpse is a host for decay, i.e. of druj. Consequently, scripture enjoins the "safe" disposal of the dead in a manner such that a corpse does not pollute the "good" creation. These injunctions are the doctrinal basis of the fast-fading traditional practice of ritual exposure, most commonly identified with the so-called "Towers of Silence" for which there is no standard technical term in either scripture or tradition. The practice of ritual exposure is only practised by Zoroastrian communities of the Indian subcontinent, where it is not illegal, but where alternative disposal methods are desperately sought after diclofenac poisoning has led to the virtual extinction of scavenger birds. Other Zoroastrian communities either cremate their dead, or bury them in graves that are cased with lime mortar.

... EDIT: I'm sure I've also read that rather than a whole body on the rocks for the vultures, a priest might first chop it up into a few pieces

[Noggin1980]

Originally Posted by William YZF-R1

You could at least spell RASCIST properly, and no I'm not. When in Rome do as the Romans do is what I adhere too.

I wouldn't walk around in Saudi swigging from a bottle of beer.

gotta regret that one.

Personally I can't see where the goverment are coming from with "others in the community would be upset and offended... and would find it abhorrent that human remains were being burned in this way," It's no buisness to the rest of us what others do with their body and I can't see how it is more abhorrent that anything we do now Leaving bodys to rot in posh boxes or incinerating them.

If this is something that would cause significantly more harm (smells) etc than normal cremation then it probably shouldn't be allowed, but it shouldn't be stopped because others think (for no good reason) that it's abhorrent.

[Wild Weasel]

So it'd be alright to just tip dead people & babies into the nearest river, like they do in India then?

[dBrowne]

Originally Posted by Decadence

I wouldn't mind as long as it was out of the way and not next to Bowfer's house...it's better than those people who throw bodies on the rocks for birds to eat, that would not be nice.

Sky burial - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[johntheexpat]

I rather fancy the concept of being cremated on a pyre. I find burials and cremations terribly formulaic, ie they run to a script and are humourless affairs totally lacking any sense of spectacle.
I want my final fling to be memorable, spectacular and to be talked about in awe for years after I'm gone. A funeral pyre would do it, but a Viking funeral type thing where a small boat is filled with wood, sent off and burnt at sea would be even better.

A burial at sea could also fit the bill, being launched off the side of a ship in the middle of the ocean so that I could genuinely 'sleep with the fish' and the cruise back to Terra Firma would be a booze cruise and a half.

Still, if swine flu comes back bigger and better in the autumn, perhaps the only way to deal with the flood of corpses will be massive funeral pyres, so he may yet get his wish.

[Noggin1980]

Originally Posted by Wild Weasel

So it'd be alright to just tip dead people & babies into the nearest river, like they do in India then?

Was that directed at me? if so its a completly stupid and ludicrous way to extend what I said especially as I said the way of disposal shouldn't be allowed if it causes significantly more harm to others than normal cremation.

[dBrowne]

If the Australians hadn't been so culturally insensitive as to suppress it in Papua New Guinea back in the '50s, there might still be a call for funerary cannibalism. I'll pre-empt the consumed by grief puns.