Do you sell using Paypal? ... beware!

Visualquality · 10-12-2006, 11:49 AM

I just wanted to warn anyone who sells on ebay or anywhere who uses a Paypal account. I sold something using Paypal in November.

I sold on ebay, was paid by paypal, had recieved the money so sent the goods. All sorted.

2 weeks later I got an e-mail from Paypal saying they were clawing the money back becuase of a fraudulent transaction!!!

So I lost my money and had NO SELLER PROTECTION. Most of my friends and work colleagues were totally shocked that Paypal can do this - but according to their terms they can!!!

Beware - make sure you understand how you get seller protection - it is not always straightforward or easy. If you sell on Amazon - beware they can also "chargback" the money!!!

I have reported it a as crime to the police - we'll see if they catch the thieving criminal!

Meanwhile I am £150 worse off - and it could have been so much worse if it was a larger value item!

neilmcl · 10-12-2006, 12:08 PM

What explanation did they give for it being fraudulent?

fourfoot · 10-12-2006, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilmcl

What explanation did they give for it being fraudulent?

They don't have to give any.

Never used paypal m'self, and never will. That's what I have a merchent account for.

Oddbodd · 10-12-2006, 2:02 PM

Got that "T shirt", I should have known better sending a new K800i to Lithuania but the guy had excellant feedback and I fell for it! I had no sooner e-mailed him confirming it was in the post when an e-mail arrived from paypal saying that his account had been used fraudulently. They quickly withdrew the money and I didn't have a leg to stand on! I didn't bother telling the police as I know they wouldn't be interested.
Cheers,
Oddbodd.

neilmcl · 10-12-2006, 2:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fourfoot

They don't have to give any.

Never used paypal m'self, and never will. That's what I have a merchent account for.

Surely if the OP is accused of making a fraudulent transaction and having the money taken of him then would get an explanation, or at least he should have demanded one.

pjclark1 · 10-12-2006, 4:07 PM

Banks do the same thing, it's not just paypal.

Visualquality · 10-12-2006, 5:11 PM

Paypal said they do not have to give info out and can't because of the data protection act.

I told the police and as I have proof of posting and a name and address and signnature of hte guy in Oxfordshire, and copies of emails to him after the event! - they have logged it as a crime and are investigating.

they are not exactly busting a gut but at least they appear to be investigating.

I have complained to the financial ombudsmen as I feel Paypal do not make their rules clear enough in their terms and conditions...

Joe90sDad · 10-12-2006, 5:31 PM

Quote:

Never used paypal m'self, and never will. That's what I have a merchent account for.

Other merchant accounts will do exactly the same when there is a CNP sale. The retailer takes the loss.

Btw, to the op, I believe Paypal will compensate you if the goods are sent to a verified address and you have postal proof of that.

Joe90sDad · 10-12-2006, 5:32 PM

Don't expect the coppers to do squat, mate. But if they do, let us know.

Accylad · 10-12-2006, 5:43 PM

I reported a similar crime to the police only to be told they would need to double their staff if they were to investigate every report on PayPal/eBay scams

Visualquality · 10-12-2006, 5:47 PM

well I will chase this with the police as they have given it a crime reference.

Paypal told me they can do nothing - the verified address is only relevant if you have a qualifying account with them AND if you sell to a verified paypal buyer.

Visualquality · 10-12-2006, 5:50 PM

perhaps I can ask here - I am selling more things on e-bay.

what is the best way to protect myself?

are postal orders, once they are cleared, guaranteed?

what rules should I put in place as stipulations for the feedback of the buyer, etc?

pjclark1 · 10-12-2006, 5:54 PM

Paying cash into your bank account is the only safe way.
Postal Orders are also pretty safe.

Cheque, Credit card, Paypal can all be reversed by anyone reporting lost/stolen items.

Joe90sDad · 10-12-2006, 5:56 PM

Cheques postal orders etc are all just as bad. When you're not dealing with customers face to face it's always tricky.

I use Paypal all the time and to date I've not lost anything but you do have to be very vigilant. I think twice I've had trouble with fraudsters on Ebay and both times I sniffed them out before Paypal or Ebay knew.

If you're concerned:

Check the feedback on the bidders to see that they haven't just accumulated it with 99p or less sales.
Then do a search on the bidders to see what other items they have been bidding on.
If you're still suspicious ask them to provide a landline that you can call.

Visualquality · 10-12-2006, 7:00 PM

this is excellent advice - thank you Joe90sDad.

Perhaps I can ask though, with postal orders, once they cleared I thought there was no way of reversing this - am I wrong?

Joe90sDad · 10-12-2006, 7:13 PM

You'd really have to quiz the Post Office about that. I do know someone who was sent a dodgy PO. I believe it was a fake or made from a nicked blank.

But on the whole these cases are very rare, it's just when you get bitten you get very paranoid.

fourfoot · 10-12-2006, 8:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe90sDad

Other merchant accounts will do exactly the same when there is a CNP sale. The retailer takes the loss.

My bank threw in free insurance on my account, so I only lose the first £20

Confucius · 10-12-2006, 11:02 PM

I only sell to people with a UK address. Can't trust johnny foreigner, y'know.

Visualquality · 12-12-2006, 12:30 AM

thanks for the feedback!

sore napper · 12-12-2006, 7:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Visualquality

this is excellent advice - thank you Joe90sDad.

Perhaps I can ask though, with postal orders, once they cleared I thought there was no way of reversing this - am I wrong?

If a postal order isn't crossed, you can cash it on the spot in the post office.

Reign-Mack · 12-12-2006, 2:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oddbodd

Got that "T shirt", I should have known better sending a new K800i to Lithuania but the guy had excellant feedback and I fell for it! I had no sooner e-mailed him confirming it was in the post when an e-mail arrived from paypal saying that his account had been used fraudulently. They quickly withdrew the money and I didn't have a leg to stand on! I didn't bother telling the police as I know they wouldn't be interested.
Cheers,
Oddbodd.

Damn you mean your goods were still in transit with the delivery people when the whole scam got revealed

.