Tax the Fat

Synchronicity · 07-06-2006, 11:32 AM

I know this is about a tv program,but thought it would be better suited to general chat....

Did anyone see this program on More 4 last night?I thought it was excellent,and although a lot of it was slightly tongue in cheek I found myself agreeing with nearly everything the presenter was saying.

I was shocked at the amount of money severely obese people cost the governemt/us a year

TAX THE FAT

Alan Westy · 07-06-2006, 11:52 AM

Although I did not see the programme, I read the article on it and do think it is bit extreme to think of taxing the fat, however one thing that does annoy me is being charged excess baggage on a flight. Where weight is obviously of concern then surely price should come into it and the passenger and their luggage should be weighed together to determine any excess charge.

Fluke · 07-06-2006, 11:53 AM

Totally wrong imo, cherry picking at its worst, we see it in education and insurance a lot. Writing people off for not being perfect is not on.

I'm a non smoker and 12 stone/ 5 ' 8" btw

Emulous · 07-06-2006, 12:02 PM

Its not about being perfect its about taking pride, looking after yourself and living a healthy life.

Being obese is about being lazy and if poor health isnt motivation enough then maybe hitting them in the wallets will do something cause Im damn sure something needs to be done.

Mindcrime · 07-06-2006, 12:10 PM

So, you take more money off the obese which means they can't afford to buy fresh healthy food which in turn means they start to eat cheaper and less healthy pre-packaged meals which in turn makes them larger

nice plan! Don't forget it tends to be the poorer end of the population scale that are obese so to make them poorer will just worsen their health and put an even greater strain on the health system.

James Ferrier · 07-06-2006, 12:19 PM

me and my girlfriend had a chat about this last night and both felt the programme was suitably unjustified.

why just tax the fat for the issues they cause, why not tax drug addicts, alcoholics, smokers, people with eating disorders, disabled people the list goes on and on, i'm not saying any of it's right or wrong, but i felt the programme was making an example of an easy target.

Ethics Gradient · 07-06-2006, 12:23 PM

Totally agree, we should put them in prison tbh - and anyone esle with deviant lifestyles that don't match our own. If they can't be fit and healthy then they deserve to be punished. Maybe we could clone Adolf Hitler and put him incharge to sort of these fat obsenities that are such a burden on our society - he sure new how to deal with 'different' people.

......... or maybe some of you posting here should have a SERIOUS think about exactly what you are saying !

Some people are born with genetic disorders or get diseases that mean they struggle with weight issues.
Some people don't want to live a rigid health regime lifestyle.
Some people are born with genes that mean they are perfectly health yet 7ft tall and 24st .... do you think we should charge them money ?

or is it purely an issue of lifestyle choice ? - well lets not accept peoples relegious holidays, or treat people with sports injuries, or anyone thats ever drunk alcohol.

Maybe we should all be perfect just like you, wouldn't the world be such a perfect place .............

neilneil · 07-06-2006, 12:37 PM

Why not just have a higher tax for the unhealthy foods?

Each product has to be submitted for an assessment before it goes on sale that determins the level of tax it will attract. Fresh fruit and veg starts at 0% and fast food burgers are say 20%.

-Neil

Mr Cat · 07-06-2006, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Westy

Where weight is obviously of concern then surely price should come into it and the passenger and their luggage should be weighed together to determine any excess charge.

would be a bit embarrassing wouldn't you not think..??

shodan · 07-06-2006, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Ferrier

me and my girlfriend had a chat about this last night and both felt the programme was suitably unjustified.

why just tax the fat for the issues they cause, why not tax drug addicts, alcoholics, smokers, people with eating disorders, disabled people the list goes on and on.

Absolutely right, we should be taxing them extra...

shahedz · 07-06-2006, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shodan

Absolutely right, we should be taxing them extra...

have you seen the TAX on cigarettes? they are taxed more, i think its ridiculous to tax obese people more, what next tax cancer sufferers more?

Nick_UK · 07-06-2006, 1:00 PM

Tax the fat ? I knew John Prescott would find a department for himself sooner or later

Fluke · 07-06-2006, 1:03 PM

This reminds me of a conversation I was having with my quite overweight sister in law who got all judgemental on smokers - saying that they shouldnt even be given jobs due to their disgusting habit (I'm an ex-smoker and she knows it). I then pointed out that pehaps fat people shouldnt be given jobs due to their disgusting sugar and fat addiction and how they are a burden on society.

She shut up then.

Mr Cat · 07-06-2006, 1:05 PM

they should tax unhealthy foods and stamp down on food companies who mislead consumers by packaging their food as healthy when it's now - especially when they say thing like 85% fat free (meaning it contains 15% fat!) and the amount of sugar in them too!!

even worse is shops like adsa (they seem to be the main culprit) as when they advertise offers on tv - it's always for the unhealthy processed sh*te...

overkill · 07-06-2006, 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Sumner

Why not just have a higher tax for the unhealthy foods?

Each product has to be submitted for an assessment before it goes on sale that determins the level of tax it will attract. Fresh fruit and veg starts at 0% and fast food burgers are say 20%.

-Neil

Sounds good Neil. One of the reasons people don't eat healthily is because quality fruit and veg is so expensive when compared to it's ready made, junk food equivalent.

I would love to eat fresh fruit and cook with fresh veg every day, but sadly my wallet disagrees! If you go on a diet you would think your food bill would go down, but every time we do it rockets. This is purely down to the fact you eat more fresh food (except Atkins).

EG, you broke the 'don't mention the small Austrian rule' - but you made a good point.

*Jammyb* · 07-06-2006, 1:19 PM

I actually watched the program and gave it some thought and he made some good points. I'm not keen on these knee jerk reactions "We might as well clone hitler and gas disabled people", not exactly the same. Also it doesn't cost any more to eat healthily than it does to eat crap.

I don't think a tax is actually workable though, but some motivation to stop us being the second most obese nation after america is definitely needed. Though getting this into people at an earlier age, like the Jamie Oliver school dinners thing is a better way to go, something has to be done about the ticking fat bomb we have at the moment.

Stop giving planning permission to Mc Donalds and Co would be another thing.

I don't have any real answers, but the issue needs to be taken seriously.

Synchronicity · 07-06-2006, 1:26 PM

lol,I thought the subject would be a good discussion point

As I said in the original post ,I think a lot of the program was tongue in cheek but they did make some very interesting points.

Obviously,people who are fat through no fault of their own,ie medical condition,etc would be exempt from the tax,the main target would be the people who are fat through laziness and greed

they did look into this last night and the majority of obese people were in that condition purely from over eating and lack of exercise and only a very small minority are obese through medical conditions or genetic orders,etc

Regarding the comments about taxing people who drink and smoke,errr,well obviously they already do that quite heavily and I imagine a large chunk of that tax is pumped back into the system to pay for their cancer treatment,liver transplants,etc Unfortunatley there is currently no system in place to help fund the problems caused by food abuse(lets be honest here,thats what it is

) If drugs were made legal,they would no doubt tax those heavily as well in the same way booze and fags are.

Fact is,the majority of obese people in this country are in that condition through poor diets and laziness and the problem is getting very serious,they are costing the government billions,one person they interviewed last night hadnt got out of bed for 8 years and his local authority had to have a special ambulance built for him at the cost of £100,000 and was having a special house built for him

and when asked why tax payers should have to pay for these things for him,his reply was"Im a human being ,Ive got rights,and its peoples responsibility to make sure I am taken care of" ***? It is each persons responsibility to take care of themselves!

I agree with a statement above-I think a step forward would be to try to lower the price on healthy food,such as fruit and veg and tax all the fatty proccessed crap,it would be a step in the right direction at least

Fluke · 07-06-2006, 1:33 PM

Mind you, I can see for my own eyes how fat we are becoming as a nation, last week was half-term and on the train platform on the way from work were a lot of teenage girls wearing crop tops

but anyway I digress

some of them had bigger bellies than me and I'm 40

, it was really wierd as they had small frames typical of teenagers but big bellies - has to be the result of sugary diets and no exercise.

Ultima · 07-06-2006, 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluke

This reminds me of a conversation I was having with my quite overweight sister in law who got all judgemental on smokers - saying that they shouldnt even be given jobs due to their disgusting habit (I'm an ex-smoker and she knows it). I then pointed out that pehaps fat people shouldnt be given jobs due to their disgusting sugar and fat addiction and how they are a burden on society.

She shut up then.

Fat people don't harm other people, but smokers do with passive smoking etc etc etc (sorry on my high horse but smoking is my pet hate)

Martin

**Steven** · 07-06-2006, 1:43 PM

I was revising last night and listening to the phone in on five live, (bear with me), and some good points made

Attitudes need to be changed. I'd say not more than 5% have medical reasons to be overweight. The rest need to take some personal responsiblity, and stop blaming things like a 'fat gene' or the government. Enviromental factors can have an affect, but at the end of the day, people need to look at themselves

And I remember a caller that said we still have the same digestive system as cave men. So it's obvious what a lot of modern sugary consumer food will do without exercise

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashworthacca

Fat people don't harm other people, but smokers do with passive smoking etc etc etc (sorry on my high horse but smoking is my pet hate)

Martin

Let's be honest, this is about the NHS. I agree with the stance that some weight should be lost before going in for a stomach operation. Got to show you're motivated

Ethics Gradient · 07-06-2006, 1:47 PM

For me, the only way forward in to promote healthy living and lifestyles and look at better educating parents in what children need - good food, excercise and socialisation .... and wheening them off the idea that the world is out to get thier kids.

Too much is made of how dangerous everything and everyone else is - so parents and people are trying to protect themselves ... which means they don't get out and about enough. How many people who are grossly overweight could have been helped simply by not feeling so isolated in their own homes.
The community and social spirit we seem to have washed down the plug hole means that more and more of us live lives cut off and insulated from other human beings .... as a result of which we are more likely to eat convienence foods and stay indoors watching TV and playing computer games.

I seriously think that negative campaigns are counter productive, we need to encourage people to look after themselves better for the benifits that brings rather than trying to shame people into changeing ..... because shaming someone who feels low and depressed already is not exactly going to make them get up and run a marathon with a smile on their face.
If someone chooses to eat unhealthy, they shouldn't be punished or made to feel ashamed - it is their choice.

It really calls for a gestalt shift the way we look at the world and our society.

The ignorant and the stupid cause more damage and cost more money to this country than an obese person.... lets charge people for being ill informed or just generally thick

mjn · 07-06-2006, 1:48 PM

I wouldn't tax fat people, but rather "fat food"

Ultima · 07-06-2006, 1:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Jason B

Fact is,the majority of obese people in this country are in that condition through poor diets and laziness and the problem is getting very serious,they are costing the government billions.:

Just take this scenario, the business man/woman who sits at their desk 15 hours a day, goes home does some more work, gets a couple of hours sleep and in between eats what they can. No excercise at all and unfortunately they put on weight and become fat/obese.

Only way to get any exercise is to slow down on his work, possibly earn less money and therefore pay less tax and unconsiously has become another burden on the country due to lower tax intake.

Just waffling a bit but my point is, who decides who's fault it is for being fat?

Some peoples attitude is "they are fat so they are lazy". Bit short sighted don't you think?

Martin

P.S. I am a businessman but not too fat.

Badlands · 07-06-2006, 1:54 PM

Yes, tax the fat, and tax the smokers even more.

Fluke · 07-06-2006, 1:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashworthacca

Fat people don't harm other people, but smokers do with passive smoking etc etc etc (sorry on my high horse but smoking is my pet hate)

Martin

So you advocate the notion that smokers should be barred from working?

**Steven** · 07-06-2006, 1:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashworthacca

P.S. I am a businessman but not too fat.

Good

I go to the gym at 6 in the morning, 4 hrs before college. It's just me, the gym staff and the suits

Whilst some can't, I'm sure most can make an effort. Even half an hour a day is better than nothing

la gran siete · 07-06-2006, 1:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil Sumner

Why not just have a higher tax for the unhealthy foods?

Each product has to be submitted for an assessment before it goes on sale that determins the level of tax it will attract. Fresh fruit and veg starts at 0% and fast food burgers are say 20%.

-Neil

In principle a very good idea and use the proceeds to subsidize healthy food thus making it very cheap which it should be.To be fair to the presenter he did suggest a fat/sugar food tax but was tiold by Sainsbury rep that it woud be very difficult to implement. He then went onto the thoroughly obscene suggestion of taxing the obese thus penalising them for having a food related problem as if they hadnt enough to make them feel miserable already

Bit like taxing smokers /drinkers for their habits as well as what they consume.

It goes to show that some people are just intolerent