1 analogue tuner!!! this sounds crazy

[cygnusx04]

I come from a media center background, but my dad has finally decided to ditch his VCR and go digital. He has an old 21" sony CRT with 1 scart connection. I'd originally planned to get him a PVR with twin digital tuner. But he said he wants a DVD/HD based solution so he can archive good stuff to DVD.

Having looked at the DVD/HD recorder solutions I was horrified to find they only come with 1 digital tuner and 1 analogue tuner!! ***!!! So basically in 2 years time the device will be obsolete due to the digital switch over..... sounds crazy!

What are his options? He doesn't really want multiple remote controls for lots of different devices and only has 1 SCART connection on the TV.

[Gavtech]

Originally Posted by cygnusx04

I come from a media center background, but my dad has finally decided to ditch his VCR and go digital. He has an old 21" sony CRT with 1 scart connection. I'd originally planned to get him a PVR with twin digital tuner. But he said he wants a DVD/HD based solution so he can archive good stuff to DVD.

Having looked at the DVD/HD recorder solutions I was horrified to find they only come with 1 digital tuner and 1 analogue tuner!! ***!!! So basically in 2 years time the device will be obsolete due to the digital switch over..... sounds crazy!

What are his options? He doesn't really want multiple remote controls for lots of different devices and only has 1 SCART connection on the TV.

There are few options.... unless he wants to consider getting a new TV which includes an integrated digital tuner.

DVDR's always have only one digital tuner [... and those with analogue and digital tuners can still be considered as having one tuner : They cannot be used independently ]

So if he wants to stick with his current TV... but wants DVD facilities and also wants record one channel / watch another facility then the only option is to also have another digital STB.... but that means another remote.


Another option which goes to what we tend to regard as the ideal is to have both a PVR and a DVDR ... It does mean having two remotes but is very flexible in use, providing 3 recordable channels and disc playing and archiving facilities.
Obviously there is expense in that .. but it could be a phased development... Getting one machine now and another later.

[ramjet]

no dvdr has twin tuners like a pvr , so if you want twin digital tuners then you need to buy a twin tuner pvr , simple as that

the dvdr recorders on the market usually have one digital tuner inside them , and the sony and pioneer models also have a single analogue tuner as well , so any of those units will not become obsolete in 2 years time , but the analogue tuner inside them will have little use , and if you bought one now you may not couple up the analogue tuner anyway so that part may be instantly redundant right now , and the panasonic are digital only anyway

so no these units wont become obsolete , but he wont have the option of watching one freeview channel while recording another , which is why he needs an alternative system on his tv , and so the ideal solution is a freeview tv and a dvdr , with a digital tuner in each

buying a twin tuner pvr solves the above issues but does not address the fact he hasnt got a dvd player/recorder , and the lack of scarts would hold him back there too. but that is a tv issue and not these recorders at fault

1 scart is 1 scart , period

so from the above you need to decide what to do next , and the best answer is a new freeview tv with multiple inputs and a dvdr freeview recorder, but its your choice based on budget

nb:- my region changes to digital in november this year , but I can assure you that my sony x70 recorder dual tuner dvdr`s wont be obsolete when that happens , only my analogue vcr and any analogue tv`s , unless I add a freeview stb to the mix

[Geofbob]

It's always very annoying when manufacturers & suppliers don't market goods as we personally want them, but according to their own assessment of the market.* Your dad's personal wishes seem to be (a) to archive programmes etc to DVD; and (b) to retain his analogue-only, one Scart TV.

Manufacturers/suppliers probably estimate that he is a rare breed, and most people will have switched to Freeview TVs (with 2 Scarts) by the time analogue is switched off, and those who haven't will probably NOT be interested in recording to DVDs, and will be content with Freeview/Freesat recorders with 2 tuners - or won't want to record at all, and will make do with a Freeview/sat box.

One way or another, your dad will probably have to compromise, either on the archiving issue (and get a PVR) or on retaining his CRT (and get a Freeview TV & a HDD/DVD recorder with digital tuner).

*Eg I would very much like to buy white Scart leads, but they seem to be as rare as hen's teeth!

[cygnusx04]

thanks for the quick informative responses.

I agree his setup is archaic - but I suspect there are many in his boat. Not sure he is ready for TV upgrade yet.

still very suprised there isn;t a PVR (dual dig tuner) + DVD combo available.

With the current DVD recorders with 1 analog and 1 digital tuner, does this enable you to record freeview and watch channels 1-5 on analog signal?

am i right in thinking due to 1 scart limit on TV he can't have DVD recorder + seperate PVR? Wasn't sure if PVR could connect to DVD recorder in some way.

will have a chat with him - thanks again.

[ramjet]

there are no dvdr recorders on the market with twin digital tuners , be nice if there were but there arent

as for these units like mine with one of each in them , no you cannot watch one thing and record another within the unit itself , it switches between the inputs and locks the others out , so it can only watch or record freeview , or watch or record analogue , not both at the same time , and neither can any other dvdr either

there are methods of daisy chaining the scarts and pressing buttons that can allow both to be connected to your tv , and other methods like a freeview stb with rf modulator built in so he can watch a different channel on a tuned in station ( say analogue channel 6 for instance ) not as good as scart but will work , or even a scart switcher

as I said earlier , its the lack of scarts and lack of a freeview tuner in his current tv causing your problems , not the dvdr recorders on the current market

with the current dvdr,s like my sony , you wouldnt actually try to watch analogue channels on it whilst recording digital , you would use the tuner in his current tv for that option. so if you added a sky box , freesat box , virgin box , or freeview stb , all with rf outputs on the coax , you could extend the life of his tv by having alternative viewing , but you then add more boxes and more remotes , which you didnt want

so the simplest answer is a dvdr with freeview , and a newer tv with freeview , job done

[Gavtech]

Originally Posted by cygnusx04

am i right in thinking due to 1 scart limit on TV he can't have DVD recorder + seperate PVR? Wasn't sure if PVR could connect to DVD recorder in some way.

To an extent it depends on the equipment used and the kind of switching employed in the DVDR unit. Automatic switching is obviously more convenient for anyone aged.

My own father has used a PVR fed through a DVDR into one scart for some years now with no problems. [ Analogue only TV]

All units are accessible anytime.

[Gavtech]

Originally Posted by cygnusx04

With the current DVD recorders with 1 analog and 1 digital tuner, does this enable you to record freeview and watch channels 1-5 on analog signal?

Further clarification on this point.

He could not use the DVD recorders tuner to do this as the analogue section is never independently accessible... however he would be able to watch analogue using the TV's tuner as always , whilst the digital tuner in the DVDR was recording... but only up to the analogue switch-off of course.

[Broadz]

Originally Posted by cygnusx04

Having looked at the DVD/HD recorder solutions I was horrified to find they only come with 1 digital tuner and 1 analogue tuner!! So basically in 2 years time the device will be obsolete due to the digital switch over..... sounds crazy!

How will it be obsolete if it has a digital tuner? Surely the presence of both a digital and an analogue tuner is perfect - it will work now for somebody who can't get Freeview, and it will work in the future after the digital switch over? Isn't that the best of both worlds - far better than only having a digital tuner (meaning you can't feed anything to it via RF except Freeview, which may not yet be accessible) and far better than only having an analogue tuner (which would mean that digital TV would have to be fed to it from an external box such as a PVR, STB, Sky box, cable etc etc etc)?

What exactly are you complaining about?

[cygnusx04]

ok calm down Broadz. My lack of understanding and requirement for 2 digital tuners + DVD archive combo was why I was complaining.

thanks for the information guys. Will need to look into this furthur.

[Kevo]

I think a lot of people upgrading from a VCR set up to a PVR set up don't always understand or realise the capabilities of the hdd. Some are big enough to act as a small 'archive' in itself and are more convenient than storing stuff onto DVDs.
I think because we were so used to putting stuff onto physical, portable VHS tapes for so long but it is no longer necessary these days, rather like not having the need for hard prints of photographs any more.

I know someone who has a PVR but STILL only uses it as a secondary recording device like a VCR rather than have it as their main viewing/recording source. They would rather use the TV's built in freeview instead

[stiffmeister]

I too have been looking for a DVD/HDD recorder with twin digital tuners. A bit strange that no-one makes them.

[bxd]

Originally Posted by stiffmeister

I too have been looking for a DVD/HDD recorder with twin digital tuners. A bit strange that no-one makes them.

It's not strange at all ... the dvd recorder can only record one thing at a time and you have another tv tuner in your tv (analog or digital) to watch. That's no different from a vhs machine. With a HDD-dvd recorder you can watch something from the HDD while you are recording something else ... you'd need a second vcr to do that.

Since you can only record one thing at a time, a second tuner on a dvd recorder would be a bit pointless. OK, you could use it to "pass thru" a signal to your tv, but you're just duplicating the tuner that's already on the tv (or Freeview box) and it would be an additional expense to the manufacturer.

Brian

[Geofbob]

Originally Posted by bxd

It's not strange at all ... the dvd recorder can only record one thing at a time and you have another tv tuner in your tv (analog or digital) to watch. That's no different from a vhs machine. With a HDD-dvd recorder you can watch something from the HDD while you are recording something else ... you'd need a second vcr to do that.

Since you can only record one thing at a time, a second tuner on a dvd recorder would be a bit pointless. OK, you could use it to "pass thru" a signal to your tv, but you're just duplicating the tuner that's already on the tv (or Freeview box) and it would be an additional expense to the manufacturer.

Brian

The point I think you're missing, Brian, is that people are simply comparing HDD/DVD recorders with PVRs. On your logic, there is also no reason for putting twin tuners in PVRs either. Imo the nub of the matter is that lots of people still have non-digital TVs, and quite understandably want to watch one Freeview programme while recording another and be able to record/dub onto DVDs, without needing three pieces of equipment.

[bxd]

Hi,

I was rather making the point that people don't actually understand the difference between a PVR and a DVD-recorder. It's not a simple matter of adding another tuner ... you'd need a second encoder section as well.

Many people wouldn't understand how to operate such a device properly, so let's not overcomplicate things.

From a manufacturers point of view, it's probably not expensive to include a second tuner in a PVR. If you've only got an analog tv then a twin tuner PVR makes perfect sense as you can record one and watch another freeview channels at the same time. That 'duplicates' what you could do with your old vcr and gives you 'digital' tv on your old telly.

If you want to do anything else (play dvds/ record things from your pvr) then you need another device. If you're looking to record 3 or more things at the same time, then you're in the same (geeky) boat as the rest of us and you probably wouldn't be stuck with a single scart crt tv anyway.

Brian