What is your AVCHD workflow?

G

Gasman2

Guest
OK - so I've just ordered an HF100... now got to think about what to do with the files / footage!! :eek:

My own set up is a Quad 6600 / 8800 GT PC (ie not Apple) and to start with I'll be backing up for data security and editing then outputting to standard DVD for viewing on a non-HD TV. I will probably also make an HD version for later use - but mo immediate plans to buy an HDTV.

But interested to know what everyone's personal workflow is.

What programs / procedures do you use to download / back up / process / edit / out-put etc?

Thanks
 
Hello

I would give serious consideration to trying the software that comes with the HF100 - Pixela ImageMixer - first.

I know few people mention it for editing but it has its advantages for straightforward editing / tranferring to DVD - mainly that it supports full smart rendering as far as I can tell - ie it doesn't re-encode your files unless it has to.

It does have an annoying documented "feature" where DVDs created pause between scenes (you can get around this by joining the scenes together first before transferring to DVD).

I also use Premiere Elements 7 which has native AVCHD support but it doesn't support any smart rendering. However for any serious editing or frame accurate cuts you'll need something like this.

So my workflow at the minute it too use Pixela for import / simple edits / simple DVDs. Premiere Elements for anything else (and Movie Maker too which works fine once you have the codec installed - which you will after you install Pixela!) For backup I have an external drive and use M/soft Synctoy.

Also since I don't have any Blu-ray player I also use Pixela for transferring clips back to a spare SD card for connecting directly via the camcorder and HDMI to my Panasonic TV (quality is gobsmacking!) This needs to be done with the camcorder connected to the PC directly. Otherwise I whip the SD card out and use a card reader - with Pixela's Browsing and Authoring feature (just select the SD card slot).

Cheers

Gidon
 
Hi - thanks for that. Suggestions much appreciated.

Anyone else - how do you do it?
 
It really depends on the OS architecture you have.
More RAM is always good, but to make full use of it (more than 3.5 GB) you need an x64 OS.

Problem is, Pixela does not work on x64. I tried it and it failed horribly...it installs ok but doesn't work properly, can't even recognize the original MTS format. Strange things happen.

This means, once you go x64, forget Pixela with its smart rendering, simple editing and everything.

I use (for now) the trial version of Vegas 9.0b and it works perfectly. I also use Powerdirector 7 which is also good. Both do the job when editing of any kind is involved.

For straight transcoding, i use Badaboom which converts 1080 input to lower resolutions faster than realtime. I expect more CUDA/GPGPU enabled software in 2009, it's about time they hit the mainstream with something useful at last (well, besides folding@home).
The new ATI drivers should have a GPGPU accelerated converter shortly. From previews, seems a bit faster than NV's solution and it's for free.
 
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OK, simple question, simple answer:
plug in my camcorder (Sony SR10), drag the files onto my PC
Edit in Premiere CS4, save out in same format/bitrate
if a menu's needed then I use Encore CS4 (does Blu-ray pop up menu's), otherwise I use TSMuxer to create Blu-ray files & folders
burn the resulting files to either Blu-ray (if it has a menu or over 8Gb without) or DVD (if no menu AND under 8Gb - AVCHD disc)
burn to disc with imgburn
I also keep most stuff backed up on my PC for future use, but not too fussed about that as I can just get it back off the disc if needed
 
It really depends on the OS architecture you have.

Vista 64 + 4GB RAM

Problem is, Pixela does not work on x64. I tried it and it failed horribly...

Ah! That's not great. I presume you've got Image Mixer 3 SE v1.1?

I use (for now) the trial version of Vegas 9.0b and it works perfectly. I also use Powerdirector 7 which is also good. Both do the job when editing of any kind is involved.

Do you have a preference? Or do you use each for different things? or is it fairly random? ;)

For straight transcoding, i use Badaboom which converts 1080 input to lower resolutions faster than realtime.

Is this before or after editing etc?

Thanks for your input.
 
OK, simple question, simple answer

Always a good start - thanks!

Edit in Premiere CS4

So does that mean you're editing the AVCHD file, not converting it in any way?

if a menu's needed then I use Encore CS4 otherwise I use TSMuxer

Does that mean you actually prefer TSMuxer? Otherwise, presumably you'd use Encore always?

DVD (... - AVCHD disc)

Is that a DVD with an AVCHD file? Is it playable? If so, what in? If it is just for back up / storage - how do you play the footage?

Many thanks
 
i have a HG20 and got Imagemixer 3 SE v3 with it.
same poison i guess :)

right now i prefer Vegas 9.0b for some reason, even if it's got a steeper learning curve than PD7.
 
Different workflow here -- what with the credit crunch and the central heating boiler packing up, no extra money to buy a new computer at this time! :)

So,I had to find way to work with AVCHD footage on my old P4.

Convert the original AVCHD .MTS files to Canopus HQ, using the free AVCHD to Canopus HQ converter, edit those files in Premiere 6.5, export as uncompressed AVI (BIG temporary files!) import into Virtualdub and export as XVid or H.264 for playback via my Western digital HD Media player, as HD.

Good quality Edited HD footage, for replay to my HD TV, without having to but either a new computer, or a Blu ray burner.

Just a different approach!
 
i have a HG20 and got Imagemixer 3 SE v3 with it.
same poison i guess :)

Would seem so. There is an upgrade for the v1.1 supplied with the HF100 - but Pixela don't list Vista 64 (or XP 64) on their compatibility page.
 
Q: Do you have a preference between Vegas 9 and Power Director 7?

A: If PD7 would have all the output options of Vegas, i would choose it straight away...rendering AVCHD with PD7 is somewhat strange. I output my 1080i AVCHD to WMV11 720 with Vegas and it looks amazing. I can't find the "corresponding" output quality/type in PD7 yet.

My trials run for another 3 weeks or so, i need to squeeze both properly before i decide where to dish my money at ;)
EDit: Downloaded the Quickstart Guide for Vegas 9...always a good place to start
http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/download/manuals/moviestudiope
 
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Convert the original AVCHD .MTS files to Canopus HQ, using the free AVCHD to Canopus HQ converter

Downloaded the Canopus converter but couldn't find the encoding version of the Canopus HQ codec it requires anywhere. Is the codec really free? Grateful for any advice on how to obtain it, free or otherwise. Cheers :)

Simon
 
There seems to be some debate as to whether the encoding version of the Canopus HQ codec is supposed to be freeware.
It's not difficult to find a version described as freeware - try googling 'canopus hq codec download' or 'canopus hq codec v1.4'.
Whether they're supposed to be freeware, I don't know -you'll have to make your own decision on that point :)
 
So does that mean you're editing the AVCHD file, not converting it in any way?
No, why would I want to convert and lose quality?
I keep it in it's original format

Does that mean you actually prefer TSMuxer? Otherwise, presumably you'd use Encore always?
TSMuxeR is tiny, takes a second to load and just remuxes it, it does a 1 hour piece of footage in about the time it takes Encore to start-up and let me choose a profile!
They are ocmpletely different, one authors a disc with some high end menu's and options, the other remuxes

Is that a DVD with an AVCHD file? Is it playable? If so, what in? If it is just for back up / storage - how do you play the footage?
An AVCHD disc is a Blu-ray structure (BDMV and CERTIFICATE folders & subfolders) written to a DVD but the footage has to be in AVCHD/h.264 format, this works in the majority of Blu-ray players, I use a PS3 personally.
 
There seems to be some debate as to whether the encoding version of the Canopus HQ codec is supposed to be freeware.
It's not difficult to find a version described as freeware - try googling 'canopus hq codec download' or 'canopus hq codec v1.4'.
Whether they're supposed to be freeware, I don't know -you'll have to make your own decision on that point :)

Thanks for your interest and for the tip rogs. Tried with no luck to find a 'safe' freebie but eventually got the Canopus HQ codec by installing Edius Neo eval. The AVCHD-Canopus HQ Converter manual states the converter doesn't work without one of their products/dongles installed btw. Maybe suggests Canopus don't intend this to be free to non-paying customers(?) Have also seen comments elsewhere to back this up :-|

I've done the most basic AVCHD tests - all hopeless using 'full HD' footage from Panny SD9 and newish DELL XPS M1530 latop (Core Duo @ 2.4GHz and 4GB RAM, Vista 32-bit). Even basic MTS file preview is generally poor quality and jerky at best. I've tried Premiere Elements 7 and Pro CS4 and others.

In fairness, my system's technically under spec for full HD AVCHD editing using Premiere etc (please, before anyone thinks I'm being stupid, my beef is that even basic playback is awful - haven't tried any rendering of effects etc).

Anyway... my newly produced test Canopus HQ avi plays back better in Premiere, though still not good. However... gasp... its smooth as silk in Edius Neo. How do you find performance using the Canopus HQ encloded files in Prem 6.5 btw? And are you using 1920 x 1080?

Considerably more testing to do as you can see and still haven't figured complete workflow. But beginning to think Edius family may be the way forward, for now at least - like you won't shell out for a new system, at least not until I know processing power can comfortably cope with AVCHD native editing (I simply don't believe that if I had the Adobe advised minimum 2 x 2.8GHz rather than my 2 x 2.4GHz it'd make much difference). OK, so I'd have to learn Edius new... oh, and the Canopus HQ encoded avi is 9 x the size of the input MTS file. I can live with both.

Tomorrow I will mostly be looking at Edius Neo output possibilities and returning to that annoying pastime - trying to figure out how I can write completed movies back to SD flash cards for playback in my SD9, or any other camera come to that!

Grateful for any (polite) comments :)

Simon
 
How do you find performance using the Canopus HQ encloded files in Prem 6.5 btw? And are you using 1920 x 1080?

I'm not using 1920 x 1080 at the moment, although I do record in that format. To make the files easier to handle on my old computer, I use Virtualdub to resize them as 1280 x 720, and also deinterlace at the same time. Then the files work pretty smoothly in Premiere 6.5
I'm not bothered at the moment, because I only have a 22" widescreen monitor, and the highest DVI output resolution from my video card is 1280 x 720. So it's an ideal size for my current requirements. (It also allows the original square pixels to be kept square!).

Exporting the edited files from Premiere is more of an adventure. The best solution I've found so far, quality wise, is to export the video as .bmp bitmaps, and the audio as a separate wave file. Then import those files into Virtualdub, and encode as Xvid. Looks pretty good.
Main problem is HUGE temporary files (at about 2.6MB per frame, it soon adds up!), but I have an external 750GB HDD, so I've plenty of room.

I have no interest in Blu ray -I really don't want to do the whole 'disc' thing all over again - and I don't like being essentially 'locked into' what ever Sony tell me to do -so I bought one of the new Western Digital HD media players, and use that to play back my footage from a USB stick.
It also plays the original AVCHD files completely smoothly as well, so I gave up on trying to find a way of getting the edited filed back onto the SD card, for camera replay.
(I believe it can be done, but needs you to author and burn a Blu ray disc first -no thanks! :))
 
Thanks all for your input and suggestions.

God, this is all so complicated!!

Codecs, muxes, blu-ray, separate video and audio, importing, exporting, encoding, etc etc etc!!!

I'm reasonably techie, but only just beginning to get my head round video and editing... Give me a copy of photoshop and a picture to edit and I'm away, but this is so much more involved.

Given that I have a Quad Core 2.4 Ghz Q6600, an 8800GT graphics, 4 Gb RAM and Vista 64 - is that enough grunt to avoid some of the steps some of you seem to be going through?

If so, is something like Vegas a good place to start? Or do you recommend something else?

I really want to edit the footage and then:

a) store a HD copy for future use / display at some point when I get something that will play it and a TV worth playing it on.

b) create something that is an adequate standard, can be stored on a normal DVD and played on a normal DVD player to a non-HD TV.

What is the best way of doing this?

Thanks
 
by the way, does anyone know of a free Vegas plugin for video stabilization?
 
It all depends on the final requirements but generally, I transcode to mpg or avi with Handbrake or mts2avi first, changing the resolution if the final use is at lower res (e.g. dvd) as my HG10 only outputs HD. Then use KDEnlive 0.7 NLVE to edit and finally render the video. KDENlive will eventually be able to edit AVCHD directly removing the need to transcode first.

p.s. Handbrake transcoder is free and available for Windoze.

HandBrake

TMPGenc 4 xpress also works well transcoding AVCHD.

I prefer Sony Vegas for editing AVCHD directly on XP but with one caveat. V8.1 of Vegas won't edit the pf25 AVCHD output from my HG10, in fact it crashes it, interlaced is ok but not as good. :mad:

p.p.s. I do the work on a Q6600 based system running at 3.1GHz and find that it runs nicely, especially with MP capable apps such as those mentioned above.
 
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It all depends on the final requirements but generally, I transcode to mpg or avi with Handbrake or mts2avi first, changing the resolution if the final use is at lower res (e.g. dvd) as my HG10 only outputs HD. Then use KDEnlive 0.7 NLVE to edit and finally render the video. KDENlive will eventually be able to edit AVCHD directly removing the need to transcode first.

Sorry to bump an old thread but I have a question on Ikki's post. I'm looking at purchasing an AVCHD camcorder but am worried about editing on my laptop - it's a Core2Duo 1.83ghz with 2gb RAM, the GPU I think is a X1400 so nothing to write home about. From what I've gathered, I'm kidding myself if I'm thinking of editing AVCHD on this PC. However, the first few projects I have lined up are either for the web or at most DVD, so the final output resolution is obviously not HD. Could I therefore transcode down to a 720x576 avi and just edit that, which is what I think you were saying Ikki? If / when I got projects in future that require the end output to be HD, I'll obviously need to consider upgrading (unless there are other workarounds for underpowered PCs to be able to edit in HD...).
 
If the camcorder won't record at lower resolution than HD (and mine won't) and the end result is DVD or web as you say, then I would definitely suggest that you transcode to a lower resolution (720x576 for DVD) and into another file format such as mp4. Your laptop will handle this much better.

The application that you use to do the video editing will also make difference, I find that Adobe Premiere Elements is very resource hungry. Try a few as there are many free trials.
 
Hi,

I have a Canon HFS10 and trying to export movie so I can watch on my HD TV using WD media player.

I use Premiere Elements for editing native AVCHD files but have a problem when it comes to export.

My final result plays in "slow motion", no sound and horizontal lines when subject is moving on the screen.

Any suggestions ????

Thanks.
 
Hi, I have a Canon HFS10 and trying to export movie so I can watch on my HD TV using WD media player. I use Premiere Elements for editing native AVCHD files but have a problem when it comes to export. My final result plays in "slow motion", no sound and horizontal lines when subject is moving on the screen. Any suggestions ???? Thanks.
I'm no moderator, but I think it would be a good idea to keep responses in one thread, to limit duplication:

Link to your original post:http://www.avforums.com/forums/camcorders-video-editing/1024831-avchd-export-problems.html
 

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