Hello all,

i've been looking for a good hi-def digital camera and seemed to narrow it down to the sony cx11 or canon hf10.

what will make me choose one of the two will probably be how they behave in low light and sound quality (it doesn't bother me that the canon is stereo over the 5.1 sony - and I almost certainly will not be using a extra mic).


i'm a first time camcorder buyer and know very little so any input on these cameras, or any other one, will be very apreciated

thanks

[spanna]

I had that decision this week (although I was thinking cx11e v hf11)

I went with the cx11e. Just because of the better build quality and the adjustment dial at the front. I didnt fancy the manual focusing system of the hf10/11

[A n d r e w]

Originally Posted by dartagnain

Hello all,

i've been looking for a good hi-def digital camera and seemed to narrow it down to the sony cx11 or canon hf10.

what will make me choose one of the two will probably be how they behave in low light and sound quality (it doesn't bother me that the canon is stereo over the 5.1 sony - and I almost certainly will not be using a extra mic).


i'm a first time camcorder buyer and know very little so any input on these cameras, or any other one, will be very apreciated

thanks

I suggest you pick up a couple of small capacity SD cards, track both cameras down in a store near you, and shoot sample clips. You'll be hard-pressed to find someone who's been lucky enough to use both cameras to give you a balanced response to your question - especially as the Sony is so hot off the press (is it even on the shelf in the UK yet?).

Andrew.

[vib ribbon]

Originally Posted by spanna

I had that decision this week (although I was thinking cx11e v hf11)

I went with the cx11e. Just because of the better build quality and the adjustment dial at the front. I didn't fancy the manual focusing system of the HF/11

Still waiting for an in-depth review of the CX11 to surface before i make my decision.

So far I am leaning toward the HF11, what with the 24Mbps compression and the decent storage it comes with. The SD cards the HF11 takes are a damn site cheaper than the Pro Duo cards the Sony takes - and I think the 4GB card the cx11 ships with is shockingly small!

That said, the cx11 has that cool adjustment dial, which i reallly, really like.........decisions, decisions eh?

I haven't heart much about the hf11 that's why I didn't consider it. I prefer the why sony feels in my hand however its the low light performance that really worries me.

whats the diference between the hf10 and the hf11 (apart from the 32GB memory)??

[vib ribbon]

Originally Posted by dartagnain

I haven't heart much about the hf11 that's why I didn't consider it. I prefer the why sony feels in my hand however its the low light performance that really worries me.

whats the diference between the hf10 and the hf11 (apart from the 32GB memory)??

Not much, as you have already noted, the one main addition is the extra on board memory, but the other big thing to note is this now offers the abilty to record at 24Mbps (The HF10 got up to 17 Mbps?)

I also think the shell is a slightly different colour, but thats about it. Certainly enough reason to consider the HF11 over the HF10 for me (even if the HF10 has dropped a bit in price since the announcement/release of the HF11)

[spanna]

camcorderinfo has a review of the hf11. I was going to wait for the 24mbps too but the review said you cant see the difference to the hf10s 17mbps really.

my cx11e came and its actually a cx12e so im chuffed with that. (not sure what the difference is really .. but its 1 number better )

first impressions are the build quality is unreal. Feels so solid. None of those rubber covers for the ports here. I thought the touch screen might annoy me but ive managed to get round it all without looking at the manual.
Ive only took a few tiny vids so far but played it back on my 46x2000 at 1920x1080i and i was blown away by the quality. I havent had a camcorder for about 5 years tho so I think any of the hd cams would get the same reaction from me tbh.
Its really small as well. Im very pleased i cancelled my sr12 order now as this is about the size I wanted a camcorder.

The only negative is the 4gig ms. I turned the quality up to max and its saying it will take 28 minutes .. doh... but the place i got mine from put a hi capacity battery in for free so I saved like 60 quid there. Ill just have to put that money towards a 16 gig ms.

The bundled software says it doesnt work with vista 64bit tho. So im just about to try out the sony vegas 9 trial.

Overall tho really really pleased. Im slightly addicted to the slowmo record as well.. My dog is getting very bored chasing a ball round the room

[vib ribbon]

Originally Posted by spanna

camcorderinfo has a review of the hf11. I was going to wait for the 24mbps too but the review said you cant see the difference to the hf10s 17mbps really.

Yeah, i noticed they said that. However, most people have said that they are disappointed the reviewer did not test the camcorder in the two types of shooting that a higher bit rate would impact most: panoramic scenery and motion.

The tests they ran were only of shooting a single stationary subject - where you wouldn't expect 24Mbps (over 17Mbps) to make much difference

As one reader pointed out: "The real test for this change is in shooting a back yard, a field full of grass and flowers, a race track, a lake with lots of ripples, a street scene on a rainy day... anything like that would be a much better test. "

I managed to find a website that also reviewed the HF11, but ran some better tests and even made video clips available to download (including a few at the top end 24Mbps)

http://www.dvinfo.net/articles/camco...comparison.php

I downloaded a couple of the clips and watched them back on my 40" W2000 and can say they looked stunning. Wish i could get hold of some CX11 clips to compare...

[tbear]

Hi all,
I lost my Sony SR7 HD camera two months ago, and now i'm about to get a similar one.
It was an excellent camera except for some focusing problem and a bit noisy image in low light.
I think i will go for the Canon HF10/HF100 or the Sony cx11.
Has anyone tested the cx11 in low light?

[tbear]

By the way, what is the differens between CX11 and CX12 ?

[spanna]

I have the cx12e. When you say lowlight what do you mean, indoor? dusk?
Cus I could have a go?
I havent had any other hd camcorders so cant tell you if its noiser than other cameras tho.

[tbear]

Yes, mostly indoor.

[spanna]

ok ill get some stuff. Ill try and get some stuff up on vimeo (not that i have got much of an idea how to compress to a good quality for vimeo yet. )

[performance6]

In Thailand we have the cx12 in uk you have cx 11 , so its the same, they're just for different countries...... and the e would specify European model!


The sony is much better as an overall product then the canon having tried both. The ONLY disappointment is high price for ms stick but get over this and you cant go wrong , the sony is hands down better in lowlight, has more features, and is built better sturdier in the hand.

That said the canon is still very good and in respects cheaper, so its an easy choice you will get a good camcorder either way, but you will get a better one at more cost.

hope this helps

it's the first time I heard someone saying the sony is better in low light (i've read otherwise) I was leaning towards the sony. it feels so much better in my hand although the memory sticks are more expensive and seems to be less pro' then the canon...dilema...it's a sony...i've never been a big fan...

what about the bitrate of one over the other? the canon is 17 and sony 13 I think, if I shot some complex images what will I lose?

Are these cameras future proof? I don't think i'll but one in the next 4/5 years as least

thanks all

[skaeley]

Folks,
I have had the CX12E for about three weeks now, taken it on holiday to New York, filmed busy street scenes running at the HQ setting (9Mbps) and the playback on a 46X3500 Sony LCD of the footage via a PS3 is fantastic.

I shot some video in Madam Tussauds, very low lighting levels and some of the footage did suffer, but after a little tweeking in the menu I got some very good footage.

In terms of Duo Pro memory, I bought a 80gb portable media drive that pulls everything off the card and onto the 2.5" drive in about 3 minutes. The unit cost about £70, and will do 10 hours of the highest quality footage from the camcorder.

Camcorderbuyer magazine has reviewed the SR12E and it got a very good review, as I understad it the CX12E/CX11E is based around this unit with some enhancements.

Hope this helps...

[spanna]

Originally Posted by dartagnain

it's the first time I heard someone saying the sony is better in low light (i've read otherwise) I was leaning towards the sony. it feels so much better in my hand although the memory sticks are more expensive and seems to be less pro' then the canon...dilema...it's a sony...i've never been a big fan...

what about the bitrate of one over the other? the canon is 17 and sony 13 I think, if I shot some complex images what will I lose?

Are these cameras future proof? I don't think i'll but one in the next 4/5 years as least

thanks all

The canon hf10 is 17 , the sony cx11/12 is 16.

(the canon hf11 is 24.)

[spanna]

Originally Posted by tbear

Hi all,
I lost my Sony SR7 HD camera two months ago, and now i'm about to get a similar one.
It was an excellent camera except for some focusing problem and a bit noisy image in low light.
I think i will go for the Canon HF10/HF100 or the Sony cx11.
Has anyone tested the cx11 in low light?

http://www.vimeo.com/1575680

but note. I dont know what im doing with the cam yet and i have the camera on -1 exposure compensation at all times. Which is why it is so dark.
I also dont think im compressing to vimeo at the best quality but the main thing u wanted to see was an indoor shot.. so there it is.

not that i'm an expert but apart from being a little too dark the short filme seemed pretty good. I thought it would be alot noisier (but I did only see it as a small 'youtube type' size.

thanks

[spanna]

Well I can say ive never looked at any poor light shot and gone woah look at the noise.
But being a still photographer, noise is something im accustomed too so maybe im not as picky as people who have had other hd camcorders and can do a direct comparison?

Did u click "hd on" on vimeo? as the window is wayy bigger than youtube. Vimeo is for hd clips.

[A n d r e w]

Originally Posted by dartagnain

I did only see it as a small 'youtube type' size.

See attachment below: the HD button at middle right can be toggled on and off; to see the video in full-screen mode, click on the four-arrowed icon in the bottom-right corner. HD clips play better if you click play and then click pause straightaway, allowing the clip to load fully before clicking play again.

for some reason I only was able to watch it once, it then said the video no longer exists.

I too am a still photographer and i have a panasonic fx9 and nikon d200. the noise created by the small sensor panasonic is terrible compared to the nikon. that's why i'm so worried with this issue