[notnormal1969]

Hi there,

I am looking for a good HD camcorder and are looking at both the HDR-TG3 or HDR CK6EK products, I like Sony products but if there are other brands that have comparable performance/quality then I would consider them.

My criteria is that I am looking for a good camcorder up to around £1k, and would prefer the memory stick option all though that is not a shop stopper. Size and weight of the camera are not as important as quality of the picture....

Any help of suggestios are much appreciated. Thanks for everyone's help in advance.

Kr,
Richard

[rhubarbe]

When you say you prefer the Memory Stick option do you mean that you prefer memory Stick to say, a Canon that takes SDHC cards?

You'll also not get a viewfinder with any card based camcorder...

[notnormal1969]

not fussed on card format...

are you saying you cannot view filming as you take it or during playback?

[redsox_mark]

You can view it, just on the LCD screen, not a viewfinder.

[redsox_mark]

The CX6 is good, but it is an older model, and with each generation the AVCHD implementation has improved.

If you aren't bothered about size, and given your budget, I would look at the Canon HF10.
If you want the ultra small size, the TG3.

[rhubarbe]

No, I'm not saying either of those things. On all of the cams you get an LCD screen, but in some you also get an electronic viewfinder, like you used to get on a camera. Some people like them, others don't care.

I'd go for the Canon HF10 if I were you with your budget. Sony CX6 is due for replacement (although personally I do love it to bits). TG3 is an upright format which some people love and others don't. There are compromises in going with the TG3. Some people are prepared to make them, others aren't.

[redsox_mark]

Snap - beat you by 1 minute.

[notnormal1969]

Is the HF10 comparable quality wise to the Sony(s)?

The HF10 also seems less pixels wise to the Sony or am I reading this incorrectly?

[rhubarbe]

Originally Posted by redsox_mark

Snap - beat you by 1 minute.

Grr!

The Canon is at least as good as any Sony. Better than the CX6 and the TG3 (if all you care about is image quality).

Try to forget about pixels. In this instance they aren't relevant.

[notnormal1969]

easy....ok, probably dont know what I am talking about but happy to be educated!

why would the canon be a good choice vs. the sony?

[rhubarbe]

Because the HF10/100 is brand new and the Sony card camera, the CX6 is due for replacement.

Pricewise there isn't a lot between them.

All the other Sony AVCHD cams are HDD (hard drive based) and you said you wanted a card cam.

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by notnormal1969

easy....ok, probably dont know what I am talking about but happy to be educated!

why would the canon be a good choice vs. the sony?

if i was getting a new cam the sony sr11/12 wins hands down on the canons,i may be biased in that i could not film without a viewfinder outdoors in sun[have you ever seen pros filming with lcds.the sonys may be a bit more epensive and not quite as small[thats better for me]with there bionze face detection very good still pictures and video performance that a fx-7 owner said was better than the fx-7 it cant be bad,there are points i would not like no proper sound control[what consumer cam does]the sound is surround and most say it gives good sound for a consumer cam.

[rhubarbe]

Sure, but he said he wanted the memory stick option and with so little to go on we had to start somewhere.

We were building up slowly to the complete mental torture that buying a camcorder on the specs inevitably becomes.

Don't spoil the fun.

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by rhubarbe

Sure, but he said he wanted the memory stick option and with so little to go on we had to start somewhere.

We were building up slowly to the complete mental torture that buying a camcorder on the specs inevitably becomes.

Don't spoil the fun.

sure but you have both options and he said 1k max

[rhubarbe]

Quite, but I hoped that by close and very intensive questioning to extract what he really wants to do with it and his attitude to various other stumbling blocks we've yet to traverse.

[dejongj]

If size wasn't the deciding factor I'd compromise on the memorystick bit as well and would go for the Sony SR12 personally...

But as I am biased I would get the TG3, in fact I would get two...I don't get to use it anymore as my wife now has got it with her wherever she goes.....Should just about fit within a £1k budget if you give it another month or 2 ;-)

[rhubarbe]

If size weren't the deciding factor I'd go for the Sony HDR-HC9. Trouble is that size is always the deciding factor for me.

Take that footage that Solid took on Market Street in Manchester for instance. If he'd used a bigger cam he'd have had kids jumping up and down and making faces in front of him, and the whole thing would have been very unnatural.

But then the SR12 doesn't have a viewfinder.

You realise that we've all argued the toss over these issues many times over the last year?

What about the Canon HG10? CCI loved it, once upon a time.

[notnormal1969]

So, regardless of recording format e.g. memory stick, hard disk or recordable cd what would be the best camcorder for under £2k?

The reason I originally kept the limit at £1k was because technology changes so fast that's all, and I am a bit anti hard disk as I have been in IT for 20yrs so I know alot about failures.

The filming I intend doing would be mainly social events/holidays plus some general filming. I would rather spend a little extra for a decent quality camcorder as I always think if you buy cheap you buy twice!

Does that help you guys help me in my camcorder quest?

Kr,
Richard

[redsox_mark]

Originally Posted by rhubarbe

I
But then the SR12 doesn't have a viewfinder.

The SR12 (and SR11) has a viewfinder. The SR10 does not.

[redsox_mark]

Originally Posted by notnormal1969

So, regardless of recording format e.g. memory stick, hard disk or recordable cd what would be the best camcorder for under £2k?

Richard,

It depends... and going to £2000 doesn't help all that much. There are several excellent (in my opinion, and backed up by reviews e.g. camcorderinfo.com) sub £1000 comsumer models. Between £1000 and £2000 there aren't that many choices; and they tend to be physically larger models (like the Sony FX7).

Sub £1000, all these models are very good, and very similar in overall performance:

HDV tape models: Canon HV30, Sony HC9.
Flash Memory AVCHD models: Canon HF10/HF100
HDD AVCHD: Sony SR11/SR12

Or if you want ultra compact, the Sony TG3 (flash memory AVCHD).

Between £1000 and £2000 - HDV tape models the Sony FX1 or FX7; but they are both discontinued. Canon XH A1 is just over £2000.

[rhubarbe]

What is noticeably absent of course is a high quality, sub £1000, card based HD cam with a viewfinder.

If you don't want HDD you lose out on the viewfinder.

If you want a viewfinder and no HDD you have to go back to HDV.

[notnormal1969]

Thanks everyone, your input is much appreciated.


So, if we take into account my decision making criteria what 3 models of camcorders should I consider? To recap I am looking to spend circa £1-2k and I would like the best possible picture camcorder possible for all possible recording scenarios, so filming quality/reproduction are the priority not weight and size of camcorder....

So, which three?

kr,
Richard

[rhubarbe]

Because they seem to have changed, please list the criteria again.

[redsox_mark]

There is very little difference in overall video quality between these 5 sub £1000 models

HDV tape models: Canon HV30, Sony HC9.
Flash Memory AVCHD models: Canon HF10/HF100
HDD AVCHD: Sony SR11/SR12

I would give the slight edge on quality to the HV30. The HDV format is also easier to edit.

If you can stretch to a £2000 ish; I like the Canon XH A1. It is also HDV format. 3 large CCDs, excellent lens... but quite a bit larger.

Third choice? Probably the Sony SR12.

[chrishull3]

unless a person has used the cameras they can not realy comment on performence,i have the hc-1 still a great cam but my fx-7 does have the edge color and sharpness wise www.camcorderinfo.com have tests and comparisons but they do not always agree with users views.

[rhubarbe]

Originally Posted by redsox_mark

If you can stretch to a £2000 ish; I like the Canon XH A1. It is also HDV format. 3 large CCDs, excellent lens... but quite a bit larger.

Sycophant.

[redsox_mark]

[redsox_mark]

Originally Posted by chrishull3

unless a person has used the cameras they can not realy comment on performence,i have the hc-1 still a great cam but my fx-7 does have the edge color and sharpness wise www.camcorderinfo.com have tests and comparisons but they do not always agree with users views.

Chris,

I agree; I would recommend the FX7 (which I have used; a friend has one), but it is discontinued, right?

I've only used the XH A1 in a shop....but from recommendations and specs (and what else is there in the £2000 range now?) I can't think of anything else to recommend.

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by redsox_mark

Chris,

I agree; I would recommend the FX7 (which I have used; a friend has one), but it is discontinued, right?

I've only used the XH A1 in a shop....but from recommendations and specs (and what else is there in the £2000 range now?) I can't think of anything else to recommend.

yes mark it is discontinued but i was surprised they are stll around over here
http://www.calumetphoto.co.uk/ they soon sold out in the states.the only fault i would say is it is perhaps not as sturdy as the 2100 or the canon a1 but for me now the a1 is too lumpy to lug around and even a cam the size of the fx-7 everyone seems to stare at you.by the way rhubarb the sr11/12 does have a viewfinder,leaving off viewfinders and not even giving straps now is as tight as it gets.

[rhubarbe]

I know that the SR12 has a viewfinder. Having read my post again I can't think what one earth I even meant to say....