[Risotto]

Has anyone got any experiences they can share yet on Premiere Elements 4.0? I need to invest in a video editing software pacakge soon and it's between this, Ulead and Vegas. Looks good on paper.

Risotto

[mjcairney]

I've just bought Photoshop Elements 5 and, whilst I am not familiar with it at all as yet, it's available here at a good price - don't know why you're thinking of Elements 4 other than perhaps you can get it cheaply. Anyway, as you'll see, the price on the link is rather good at £24.95 + £1.79 shipping.

Cheers,

Martin.

[Risotto]

Thanks Martin. Actually I was referring to Premiere Elements 4.0, the one released recently, rather than Photoshop Elements. I wish Abode had differentiated their names more!

Risotto

[senu]

Originally Posted by Risotto

Thanks Martin. Actually I was referring to Premiere Elements 4.0, the one released recently, rather than Photoshop Elements. I wish Abode had differentiated their names more!

Risotto

To be fair, they have kept Premiere and Photoshop names going side by side for a while.. the users tend to know the difference but it can be confusing

Photoshop Elements itself is now on Ver 6 ( Im still "learning vers 4 and 5)

I had mentioned it HERE

Premiere Elements 4 is rather new and yet to reach our "shops" so i wont be surprised that nobody has it yet. In the recent past I got complimetary copies but lately they just send a trial / Demo on a disc or an email to download the trial version
(Sometimes lasting up to 3 months)

As for wanting to shortlist the software, they all do the same things albeit in different ways
GUI, system requirements and how much you ecpect to achieve with each are the differences . Prices are broadly similar. Sony Vegas Movie Studio (8) is not yet in the shops here, neither is Premiere Elements4

A brief comparison

UleadVS 11 plus is more newbee friendly, but less so to you if you desire control over the produced "effects". it is more than capable though

Vegas is easy to use , but has hidden depths. Its GUI may not leap at you without a little perseverance but once you get past that it is great

Adobe Première Elements is a bit more traditional getting its roots from Premier. This advantage means it is written from ground up as a cut down version of an existing product. (in the same way as Vegas)
Disadvantage is that it is less newbee friendly than it could be .( Vegas doesn't have this disadvantage as its GUI and that of the Full ver of Vegas are pretty much the same)
This concern over being Newbee friendly is what ver 3 ( and now 4 which is IMHO only a gently evolution and not a "must have" over 3) are trying to address

Certainly you can post your queries nearer the time or try b4 you buy via downloadable trials

[LV426]

This assessment is based on my own experiences with Premiere Elements 2 and Ulead 10 so things may well have moved on, but with that caveat:

Adobe has a much more intuitive interface in my opinion and allows much greater control over all aspects of the editing process. I tend to use it exclusively for any "complex" editing. However I find that its MPEG encoder is nowhere as good as ULead's when squeezing bitrates. Even on a 2-pass encode it's much much more likely to create massive artefacts on complex scenes, doesn't raise the bitrate high enough - and also wastes data on simple scenes. In other words, the bitrate variation isn't great enough.

Premiere Elements 2 doesn't offer any analogue video capure (with suitable hardware), and always wants to re-render the entire stream whenever you've finished doing any editing or disc mastering. I don't see any satisfactory way to extract video data from video mode DVDs either - except to import the VOBs as individual files, and this causes gaps in the programme between files.

I find ULead 10 to be unstable. It fails to replay and encode audio when the source is a DVD from my tabletop recorder with DD2.0, but is OK when the soundtrack is LPCM. It also often fails to encode the entire file.

Where ULead does win is on the MPEG compressor (when you can coax it to work) which is able to vary the bitrate to greater degree and effect than Adobe; on the fact it will import video and audio from a DVD as a single MPEG file with no gaps; allows analogue capture, and, most importantly, has "smart render" whereby it does NOT re-encode when it doesn't need to. This last bit makes it faster and the end result less likely to contain encoding artefacts.

Where the Smart Render really helps is:
- when you've completed some editing, rather than proceeding straight to mastering a disc, you can first create a new MPEG of the edit and then test/watch it on your PC. When you then go on to mastering a disc, it won't re-encode unless you tell it to. Adobe always re-encodes.
- If your original source is an MPEG at a bitrate (file size) that will fit your finished DVD then when your editing is done, only those parts of the file that need re-encoding (i.e. the edits) are re-encoded. The rest is just copied, so there is no degradation.
- if you find a mistake in your edited/finished MPEG, you can insert the new MPEG into a new project, fix the mistake and re-render it. It will do this quickly and without further compression because it only re-renders the new edit, not the whole thing.
- if you make a mistake in your DVD mastering (such as, say, wrong behaviour in the menu or somesuch), if you've previously created an MPEG, then re-mastering the DVD is again a trivial process which doesn't involve re-rendering. Again, Adobe won't do this.

In fact, as you might gather, I tend to use both. Adobe to do any complex editing and create an MPEG, and then Ulead to master the disc. If the bitrate is squeezed, then I'll edit in Adobe, make an MPEG at the maximum bitrate throughout, and then use ULead to re-encode it at the required lower bitrate to fit the disc.

I have no experience of Vegas on which to base a comment

[senu]

Adobe Premiere Elements 3 has addressed many of the encoding issues. Also it is even more user friendly than ver 2
I find it stable in use but it often does better with higher than the reccomended hardware specifications
I didnt use Ver2 for more than a short while as I had too many others to use!
Regarding UleadVS10 (Im yet to get ver 11 ) I used it after ver 8 and found it to be a great improvement to that version but still felt an overhaul of the interface would win it many more friends.
A review
http://videoediting.digitalmedianet....jsp?id=45512-0

Brian110507 is an expert in its use and actually has a website dedicated to it HERE
I like it but because I tended Use Vegas and AVID LIQUID and Pinnacle Studio a bit more Im unable to say how I would feel if it was the main NLE I had
I very seldom edit mpeg ..for that I use Womble , As such Ulead Video studios "smart rendering" is lost on me

Saying that, I find its DVD authoring stablemates a pleasure to use: the ( now ageing) Ulead DVD Workshop2 , and Moviefactory (now on ver6)
While it would be cumbersome to say get them all, it is true to say no one ticks all the right boxes all the time and one can take advantage of the strenghts of each to achieve ones goal, YMMV
As such your needs may be simpler and youll find one that does it all for you

[Risotto]

Originally Posted by senu

Premiere Elements 4 is rather new and yet to reach our "shops" so i wont be surprised that nobody has it yet. In the recent past I got complimetary copies but lately they just send a trial / Demo on a disc or an email to download the trial version
(Sometimes lasting up to 3 months)

I noticed that Amazon UK had it on pre-order until 10 October so was wondering if anyone on this forum had ordered one for delivery next day and had had a chance to play with it. Noticed one or two grumbles from across the pond about it, one being about the Youtube feature not being up to scratch (not an issue for me though).

I'd love to have a play with a trial version first but I'm not sure how long these things take to appear after the main launch. I do like what I see on paper WRT ease of use and features.

One question - does Vegas have a scene line as well as timeline? I can't find it on the trial version. I tend to prefer the former being a newbie to this genre of software.

Risotto

[senu]

Originally Posted by Risotto

One question - does Vegas have a scene line as well as timeline? I can't find it on the trial version. I tend to prefer the former being a newbie to this genre of software.
Risotto

Did you download the Movie Studio? It should have "show me how" tutorials
Vegas does not do a story board view, but in its timeline view it is so easy to cut trim fade "events" ect that it is almost not worth bothering with a scene view, at any rate the "events" show on timeline as if they a thumbnail of scenes
Timelime is so much more easy to manipulate then Sceneline( storyboard) that it is worth persevering with this view in order to cut your learning time,
Pinnacle Studio ( and Ulead VS ) and lately Premiere Elements( ver 3 and later) switch between Story board view and time line but for more precise editing. Mastery of the timeline has a lot to commend it
Ironically Ulead VS is easier to use in storyboard view.

[mjcairney]

Originally Posted by Risotto

Thanks Martin. Actually I was referring to Premiere Elements 4.0, the one released recently, rather than Photoshop Elements. I wish Abode had differentiated their names more!

Risotto

Sorry Risotto, it's my fault for not reading your post correctly - you clearly stated Premiere and not Photoshop - teach me to read things properly.

All the best.

Cheers,

Martin.

I just purchased Elements 4 last week from the Adobe online store and am finding it pretty good although I'm new to video editing so I can't give you a definitive review.

So far, anything I've need it to do had been right there on front of me. Where a funtion has been tucked away under the UI, I just looked up the help notes which are very simple.

Over all the UI is very good. I find the zooming in and out a little tricky but again, thats because I'm new to this type of application. I do however use (professionally) most of the other Adobe applications for design work and I can tell that it's a solid application and will do anything I need it to do. The export to FLV was the main reason I chose this above some of the other apps. Also, it recognised my Canon HV20 no porblem and importing the footage was very simple.

Is there a trial available from the adobe.com site?

[joshua_bond]

Hello Forumers,


In PE4 (or PE3), after you import your avi into the timeline, can you extract the sound and video from your avi as separate entities and put them in another timeline?

Ta.

[senu]

You generally can .. with all NLE software, one way or another

I have tried it with Vegas although it often means opening more than one instance at a time.

Specifically with Elements, Im unsure if this will involve a similar: copy paste operation from one open instance of the program to another, or one might need to save the separated entities first

[Risotto]

Thanks Eladnova for your feedback on Premiere Elements 4.0. I'm new to this stuff like you so both ease of use and powerful features are very important to me but strictly in that order.

BTW, for others that might be interested, I found this review of Premiere Elements 4.0 very useful and thorough:

http://muvipix.com/phpBB3/articles/?p=1#more-1

Thanks also Senu for your recommendations and advice re Vegas Movie Studio. I have this funny feeling I won't be using any of the packages frequently enough to get used to their ways of working so really need something that assumes I'm a first time user each and every time.

So, Adobe are going to get my money this time. Shame Amazon in the UK are not (yet) offering the $20 rebate and 10% discount that their counterparts in the US are offering. Oh yes, we're being offered a staggering 1p off RRP here! Perhaps I'll wait a month.

Risotto

[joshua_bond]

Risotto,

If you are looking for use as a complete novice I would recommend u have a look at Ulead Videostudio 10+ (XP, Win2000) or 11+ for Vista. I have used it when as a complete novice. I am moving on to PE4 'cos I want do more complex stuff and I have moved from complete novice to just novice. In addition VS10+ is not vista compatable. Even when you apply the patch you still lose some features.

Here is a rough and ready cheapo video done with VS10+ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MuIm6gfzto


If you are willing to hang on a bit, I am looking to purchase PE4 - so I can give you the low down.

[Risotto]

Joshua,

Thanks - took a look. I've already got a trial version of Ulead 11 and it ticks all the right 'ease of use' boxes. I guess a lot of the bells and whilstles for titling etc aren't in the trial version.

I'm in no absolute hurry to get anything, mainly because I bought my camcorder only recently (Sony DCR-HC-96e) and so there's not much yet to edit anyway. But I do like the look of PE4 and hope that through it's ease of use I can get access to powerful features that otherwise I'd struggle to use properly.

Do let me know how you get on.

Risotto

[joshua_bond]

Hi Risotto,

Exactly 1 month later but as promised...here is a quick response. PS. Most of comparision is on VS10+ to whicj was my previous software.

In comparison, it is a more serious software. On one hand I like the UI, stability, and feature galore (vs 10+) but on the other hand there are annoyances. E.g. I can't work out how to vertical pan. ANYONE HELP HERE!!!
There is horizontal, vertical but no diagonal (unlike VS10+). There is not 5.1DD (or output HD). Help is minimal; except online forums. Quite at lot of interesting features I find by accident. I like themes (where you add your clips and a film is automatically generated) - but there isn't enough. Overall is probably better than VS10+. As a novice with occasional video-work VS10+ is better (if you use XP..forget using VS10+ Vista patch) anything above than then PE4.

If you need anymore stuff just holla!

[Risotto]

Thanks Joshau.

I've read a lot of scary stuff on the various forums about PE4 but many of these stories affect Vista or non Intel machines. Glad to hear it's stable for you... you appear to be one of a few . Titling seems to be creating a lot of crashes.

Have decided to take the plunge myself and will order a copy from Amazon tomorrow. Will report back.

Risotto

[joshua_bond]

As long as your processor is up to it then things should be fine.

I have E6750, 2gig mem, HD 500gig (plus 250gig from my previous upgrade).

The PC was built with Crysis in mind..but the PE4 is benefitting.

PS. If you qualify then give these a try..unless you have a purchase from Amazon already.


http://www.education-store.com/store....do?pubID=7409