best true 1080p Hard Disc camcorder

[jeanlucpicard]

what options have we now and upcoming during last Qrt?

[gritstone]

What and why is there such a drive for the highest technical video quality - it's just not that important, is it? We still watch video footage from the early days, and no-one criticizes it's quality.

It's quality content that really counts.

[senu]

The content is important.. but it is perhaps not out of place to seek knowledge about newer technologies

Whether these then translate to a "better " Audio/Visual experience is debatable. The marketing depts of the major consumer electronics dept always have a different agenda to anyone seeking "better " goods

FWIW I think hammering down 1080p as "true HD" is a marketing dream. Apart from a PS3 with 1080p games Im unconvinced that 1080i in its current implementaion lacks much compared to 1080p

[redsox_mark]

The only 1080 HDD model with a progressive mode I'm aware of is the Canon HG10.

There is no need to choose between good content and good technical quality. Of course content is important. But when choosing a new camcorder, it is also reasonable to want to get the best technical quality you can for your money. (Whether that means it must be 1080p or not is another matter).

I have precious content shot on one of the early 8mm analogue camcorders. Sure I watch it, and it would be pointless to criticise the technical quality, as it was due to limitations of the time. But given the choice today would I want to shoot with the old analogue camcorder when I have a high def HDV cam? Of course not. There are many classic films in black and white worth watching, but would I want to buy a camcorder which didn’t support colour?

[senu]

Originally Posted by redsox_mark

There is no need to choose between good content and good technical quality. Of course content is important. But when choosing a new camcorder, it is also reasonable to want to get the best technical quality you can for your money. (Whether that means it must be 1080p or not is another matter).

Agree entirely..I have a friend who has held off buying a Hi def Display till the 1080p ones became more commonplace..I have no problem with that, but I certainly feel buying a non "HD Ready" ( at least 720p) TV display now is a bit ill advised.
However I would not nessesarily lust after a 1080p camcorder in the same way..for now

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by senu

Agree entirely..I have a friend who has held off buying a Hi def Display till the 1080p ones became more commonplace..I have no problem with that, but I certainly feel buying a non "HD Ready" ( at least 720p) TV display now is a bit ill advised.
However I would not nessesarily lust after a 1080p camcorder in the same way..for now

senu have you seen much stuff recorded in progessive,apart from some bits sent in to sites i have not ie on hi def tv.i know sony i recording cams will not play back canon hv20 recorded in p mode.chris

[senu]

Originally Posted by chrishull3

senu have you seen much stuff recorded in progessive,apart from some bits sent in to sites i have not ie on hi def tv.i know sony i recording cams will not play back canon hv20 recorded in p mode.chris

Yes Chris, I have , but only from Bluray Movies played off a PS3 and on a 1080p display. They look fantastic but not enough to make the whole thing a "must have" for me!
I havent really seen any Camcorder progressive recording outside the short clips available for online download .

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by senu

Yes Chris, I have , but only from Bluray Movies played off a PS3 and on a 1080p display. They look fantastic but not enough to make the whole thing a "must have" for me!
I havent really seen any Camcorder progressive recording outside the short clips available for online download .

the blue ray movies you mention are they proper cinema films or camcorder stuff.my son has a ps3 and my standard dvd,s look fairly good on my 1080i set.what i realy want to do is put my hdv tapes onto blue ray disc,i know it means coverting them to p format first before burning blue ray disc,s i am not sure it is possible at present.chris

[senu]

Originally Posted by chrishull3

the blue ray movies you mention are they proper cinema films or camcorder stuff.my son has a ps3 and my standard dvd,s look fairly good on my 1080i set.what i realy want to do is put my hdv tapes onto blue ray disc,i know it means coverting them to p format first before burning blue ray disc,s i am not sure it is possible at present.chris

Not camcorder stuff..Camcorder stuff has been 1080i recorded, 1080p displayed.. by the Display
As such I suspect you can put your HDV footage on Blu ray without converting them to P.
Let the Display deal with all that. The difference you achieve by converting to p ( if any) may not be worth the effort
FWIW ,I have also seen Blu ray movie discs which were not 1080p encoded and they looked great
TBH Im not very hot on BluRay media/ hardware but I know some Sony Vaio laptops have the burners, discs are available if scarce, and Software for authoring is slowly trickling in. Ive just got Ulead MovieFactory6 plus which is promising a whole lot...!

[hopthepond]

Originally Posted by senu

Not camcorder stuff..Camcorder stuff has been 1080i recorded, 1080p displayed.. by the Display
As such I suspect you can put your HDV footage on Blu ray without converting them to P.
Let the Display deal with all that. The difference you achieve by converting to p ( if any) may not be worth the effort
FWIW ,I have also seen Blu ray movie discs which were not 1080p encoded and they looked great
TBH Im not very hot on BluRay media/ hardware but I know some Sony Vaio laptops have the burners, discs are available if scarce, and Software for authoring is slowly trickling in. Ive just got Ulead MovieFactory6 plus which is promising a whole lot...!

If your playing them on a PS3 you dont need any blu ray hardware/software at all to play them back in HD!

The playstation 3 will play back the raw M2T file from a standard DVD! just burn the m2t file to a blank DVD as a data disc and throw it in your PS3, it'll pay back the HD file flawlessly. Obviously your limited to size but use dual layer discs and youll get about 40 minutes on, a single layer will be about 20 minutes. A single HD tape over 3 DVD discs costing a quid, (a couple of quid at most for decent media)


cheers

[senu]

Originally Posted by hopthepond

If your playing them on a PS3 you dont need any blu ray hardware/software at all to play them back in HD!

The playstation 3 will play back the raw M2T file from a standard DVD! just burn the m2t file to a blank DVD as a data disc and throw it in your PS3, it'll pay back the HD file flawlessly. Obviously your limited to size but use dual layer discs and youll get about 40 minutes on, a single layer will be about 20 minutes. A single HD tape over 3 DVD discs costing a quid, (a couple of quid at most for decent media)
cheers

This is correct, it is also true of AVCHD files .. In fact that you can copy any of these files to the PS3s HDD for playback ( if you want)
However the other (main) point of the post was to share with chris the fact that converting 1080i to 1080 p footage for playback via BD disc ( or not) on the PS3 is probably not nessesary

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by senu

This is correct, it is also true of AVCHD files .. In fact that you can copy any of these files to the PS3s HDD for playback ( if you want)
However the other (main) point of the post was to share with chris the fact that converting 1080i to 1080 p footage for playback via BD disc ( or not) on the PS3 is probably not nessesary

i doubt i will be getting a ps3 but a blue ray player or recorder sometime maybe, will the m2t dvd,s play on them the same as a ps3 i am a little vague on these points plus i am not sure if my pinnacle 10.5 will make them.the trouble is anyway m2t seems a temporary solution to storing my hdv tapes[i know they are fine stored on tape]for quick and easy playback.thanks chris

[senu]

Well, only time will tell. your m2t files on tape are more than a temporary solution. they are archive of your efforts and a playback medium
...Available .. here and now. In this way they are better than AVCHD even if Quality is similar. Not everybody owns or aspires to own a PS3

As for BD/ HD DVD recording, you are in the same situation as everybody else.. we are all waiting for commonplace solutions . If m2t file wont play on them as with the PS3, I'm sure they will be convert able to something which will be
There are certainly Network media players and some devices other than PS3 ect which allow you to stream media content from your PC to Display.
As for software , A the current time, Pinnacle 11 plus is already out and Ulead Movie Factory 6plus at £39 and lately Adobe Premiere Elements4 are able to Author BD video ( ironic considering the "virtual " non existence of media and affordable burners ) so I wouldnt worry too much

[chrishull3]

Originally Posted by senu

Well, only time will tell. your m2t files on tape are more than a temporary solution. they are archive of your efforts and a playback medium
...Available .. here and now. In this way they are better than AVCHD even if Quality is similar. Not everybody owns or aspires to own a PS3

As for BD/ HD DVD recording, you are in the same situation as everybody else.. we are all waiting for commonplace solutions . If m2t file wont play on them as with the PS3, I'm sure they will be convert able to something which will be
There are certainly Network media players and some devices other than PS3 ect which allow you to stream media content from your PC to Display.
As for software , A the current time, Pinnacle 11 plus is already out and Ulead Movie Factory 6plus at £39 and lately Adobe Premiere Elements4 are able to Author BD video ( ironic considering the "virtual " non existence of media and affordable burners ) so I wouldnt worry too much

cheers i must give it some thought.but i see some have problems with m2t doing this,i would not be too optimistic who knows though.

http://www.videoforums.co.uk/dvd-svc...onversion.html

[senu]

I would suggest the problem isnt m2t .. it is m2t and Adobe Premiere.

For whatever reason , software like Avid Liquid 7, Sony Vegas 6 7 and now 8 and Canopus Edius HD cottoned on to HDV and its peculiarities sooner than Adobe.
Even Ulead MovieFactory 5 and 6 plus , are able to manipulate m2t
The fact is that in this regard AVCHD is less well supported than HDV so i would be far less pessimistic
Also for simple creation of SD DVD.. from tape,HDV as you know , the camcorders do a very decent job downconvertng to DV AVI on the fly