What's the best HD camcorder under £1000?

dangermain · 25-03-2007, 9:23 PM

I've been doing my research and am close to parting with up to £1000 for an HD camcorder. I think I've whittled it down to three models:

Sony HDR-HC7
JVC GZ HD7
Canon HV20

These are all relatively new models, and the JVC and Canon camcorders are only just about to appear in shops, so I can't find loads of info on the three of them, or at least not enough to make a fair comparison.

I need a mic input, which rules out some of the cheaper HD camcorders, and am also intererested in a harddrive as opposed to tape. And I'll be using a Mac (iMovie) to edit with.

If you have any strong opinions on which of these machines is worth investing in, I'd love to hear from you.

redsox_mark · 25-03-2007, 9:46 PM

If you are interested in a hard drive based camcorder, then of course the JVC will be of interest; it's the only HDD based model (of the 3). It is a very interesting model, as it is unique in format - it records MPEG2 to HDD; different from both HDV (tape) and AVCHD. It records in 1920x1080 rather than 1440x1080 for HDV (which includes the HC7 and HV20).

Whilst they are all new (the HC7 has been out a month or so, the others arent out yet), with the HC7 and HV20 they are an evolution of previous HDV models, so you kind of know what you are going to get. camcorderinfo.com recently released a review of the HC7, and will release a HV20 one soon. The HC series have been excellent; I own the HC1, I've used the HC3, and both are very, very good. Strangly camcorderinfo.com didn't think the low light performance of the HC7 was as good as the HC3; this conficts what I've heard from others who have used it.

The JVC HD7 is more of an unknown.... but on paper looks great.

All have mic inputs.

If you can I'd wait for the HV20 and HD7 to be released and see what the reviews are like.

SIP · 26-03-2007, 10:32 AM

Hi Dangermain.

Your post caught my eye, not because I use HD, but because I have just switched to a MAC after a few years editing on a PC.
One thing that I have noticed being posted a lot regarding iMovie, is that it cannot work with MPEG2 files. This type of file is not supported by quicktime as standard. I have read loads of post from people who have HDD camcorders, but cannot import the footage to iMovie. Personally, I think iMovie is poor - its the only thing about the Mac that I dont like - but it comes free with iLife, so I suppose I can't complain.

Again, I am not sure if you will need to upgrade quicktime (at a cost) in order to make iMovie accept MPEG2, but it will accept AVI as standard, so this may alter your choice of either tape or drive camcorder.

Sorry if I have confused the matter.

Cheers

Philip.

dangermain · 26-03-2007, 11:58 AM

Redsox_Mark

Thanks for the reply. Do you use iMovie to edit your HC1 footage i.e. do the HC family of Sony cams work OK with Macs?

I have read about some compatibility issues, as hinted at in other areas by SIP (above)

redsox_mark · 26-03-2007, 12:22 PM

Sorry, can't help there as I edit under Windows...

But iMovie HD supports HDV, so there shouldn't be a problem.

http://www.apple.com/ilife/imovie/

redsox_mark · 26-03-2007, 12:32 PM

This site has some interesting comments about editing with the JVC HD7. Also it comments on the AVCHD format (e.g. the Sony SR1), not on your short list
http://digitalcontentproducer.com/hd...ameras_022607/

"JVC has not yet given a marketing name to its version of MPEG-2. By using generic MPEG-2, JVC is free to implement any data rates it chooses. According to JVC, iMovie HD (and likely FCE) will rescale 1920 to 1440 during transcoding to Apple Intermediate Codec, while FCP will capture 1920x1080 but require rendering before preview. Those NLEs that have from day one implemented full MPEG-2 support should automatically support the GZ-HD7.

The same cannot be said about Full HD camcorders that will use a new codec: AVCHD. Not only will NLEs need to be enhanced, editors will need to accept decoding times 3X slower than HDV. Slow decoding will limit realtime, multi-stream native AVCHD editing. Editors will also need to live with encoding times that are 8X longer than for MPEG-2. "

SIP · 26-03-2007, 12:34 PM

Hi

Sorry to stick my neb in again, but as Mark has just said, iMovie supports High Def video no problem, but iMovie does not support MPEG2 files as standard.

I have an intel iMAC, and I switch into Windows, in order to use my prefered editor for my Sony camera as both iMovie & iDVD will not use MPeg 2. If you have an MPEG 2 file, then you need to export it as a DVfile in order for iMovie to use it. It does use other file types as well, but you would need to check which verson of iMovie you have in order to use the right encoders.
The next step for me will be to check out "Final Cut", and see if that is any better than iMovie, but as I say iMovie is not the worlds best editor, and in this day, you would expect most editors to be able to handle MPEG 2....until then I will stay with my Windows editor which is great.

Philip

redsox_mark · 26-03-2007, 1:47 PM

Windows Movie Maker (at least under XP) doesn't support MPEG either, so in that way you are no worse off; either way you need editing software.

As I'm not a Mac user I only know Final Cut by reputation, which is good - Final Cut Pro is somewhat of a standard against which other editors as judged. There are also the more affordable Final Cut Express.

mmace · 26-03-2007, 2:45 PM

Premiere Pro is about to be updated, this time they are back on the Mac again as well as Windows, this supports all the formats except AVCHD
http://www.adobe.com/products/produc...video_mac.html

Goose74 · 26-03-2007, 5:20 PM

in my view the HV20 is by far the best option - just my 2p's worth

True 25p for £800!

Townie16 · 27-03-2007, 12:45 AM

The original question was my own personal quandry up until today. I had not intended to go down the HDV route but having learned from these forums and reviews elswhere too, how this years offerings of DV models seem at best a sideways move compared to last years models, almost like the top end models were dropped and the efforts focused elswhere like HDD and DVD models.
As HDD and DVD does not appeal to me for the same variety of reasons already posted in other threads, I felt almost like their was no other option but to go down the HD route.
My only doubt was whether to wait for the HV20 as early reviews seem positive. But time became a big issue (I fly to Disneyland on Wednesday) and as the Canon will only be released next month I decided to bite the bullet and purchased an HC7e this morning and have to say after playing with it all day I am impressed by the results so far. The picture Quality is stunning once the saturation is turned down a notch, low light picture seems ok to me, but as I have nothing to compare it too that is purely subjective.
Small niggle is the cam wheel, like other reviews have said it could be better, but overall first impressions I am more than happy with it. It was also cheaper than what the HV20 will cost too.

Edit: Even happier now I have just read the comparison of HC7 and HV20 on CCI, it seems both have their flaws and the overall difference between the two is not that big, other than the 24p of course.

dangermain · 28-03-2007, 1:33 AM

As pointed out above, this review http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content...der-Review.htm does a great job of comparing the Sony HDR HC7 and the Canon HV20. The Canon just shades it, but it's worth reading the whole thing.

Sony is better on build quality and options, Canon better on picture and useability. That's how it came across to me.