Choosing Family 1080 Camcorder

DPRichards · 30-09-2009, 5:09 PM

Greets to all!
We've got a baby on the way

And now I've got to choose a camcorder.
Got a Panasonic 1080p TV so heading towards the same brand
Got £600 to play with, maybe more, if I can sell my train set...
Wanting to avoid a HDD, heading towards internal Flash mem + SD card
Really like SSD - but Samsung's HMX-H106BP doesn't quite impress - could
you convince me?
Liking the Pana TM20, but not liking the small 1/6" MOS
Wanting good all round performance, easy controls for Sarah to use
Do you know of any upcoming releases I could wait another month for?

All opinions, tips or advice gratefully received.

Happy listening & viewing,
Dan

**senu** · 30-09-2009, 6:33 PM

Not the Samsung.. but is the 1/6th CMOS the only reason the Panny doesn't appeal?

DPRichards · 30-09-2009, 6:55 PM

Yeah, I'm thinking maybe a larger CMOS would give better images and be more of a benefit than the image features of the panasonic. But really, for taking video of a baby, for posterity, for distant parents etc. would I see much benefit?
You like the TM20?

**senu** · 30-09-2009, 7:03 PM

I think there is little to chose from between today's camcorders in image quality , more in features

With Panasonic the HD9 is what Ive used ( low light not fantastic)
Canon HG 10 and Sony SR12
Im currently trialling Sony HDR XR200 and it is awesome in good light but indoors , not as great
This seems to be thier achilles heel mainly

loz · 30-09-2009, 8:26 PM

The Panasonic HDC-SD200 would seem to fit your bill
Camcorders - HD Camcorders - HDC-SD200 - Overview - UK & Ireland

SD Card
3x 1/4" full HD CMOS sensors

Basically the same as their top of the range TM300, but without the full manual controls.

So the same review as this picture quality wise
Panasonic HDC-TM300 Review - Camcorder Reviews - TrustedReviews

£598 at amazon.

**senu** · 30-09-2009, 8:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loz

The Panasonic HDC-SD200 would seem to fit your bill
Camcorders - HD Camcorders - HDC-SD200 - Overview - UK & Ireland

SD Card
3x 1/4" full HD CMOS sensors

Basically the same as their top of the range TM300, but without the full manual controls.

So the same review as this picture quality wise
Panasonic HDC-TM300 Review - Camcorder Reviews - TrustedReviews

£598 at amazon.

Looks very good
Glad to see Mic in Headphone in a viewfinder and manual zoom ring.. as well as independent iris and shutterspeed controls.. for less than £600 , and a 3 chip model
In that Panasonic really have the crown where Sony is cutting features tha matter , keeping prices high and offering gps and face detection..

loz · 30-09-2009, 9:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by senu

Looks very good
Glad to see Mic in Headphone in a viewfinder and manual zoom ring.. as well as independent iris and shutterspeed controls.. for less than £600 , and a 3 chip model
In that Panasonic really have the crown where Sony is cutting features tha matter , keeping prices high and offering gps and face detection..

I think you were mixing up the specs from the two cameras I referenced.

The £600 SD200 doesn't have the manual zoom or mic in.
But internally it is the same as the £850 TM300 I linked to, ao PQ wise that review should still be the same

**senu** · 01-10-2009, 12:58 AM

Thanks,
Still looks great though!

DPRichards · 01-10-2009, 6:42 AM

Superb contributions!

Thanks for the tips. I will investigate and report back.

Muchas gracias!

DPRichards · 01-10-2009, 5:49 PM

Ordered the sd200 today.
good CMOS.
v good stills
v good features
pixmania offering a good deal @ £515 (01/10/09)
Due to be delivered in the next 5 days. V. excited.

Am getting a verbatim HD video class6 32Gb card from amazon to go with it.
Good choice, y'think?

Am also looking at spare batteries - not much choice out there, ridiculously expensive Panny spares
3rd party batteries requiring their own chargers. Don't much like 'em from experience with cameras but any tips on brands would be v. welcome.
Ciao!
Dan

Tinderbox (UK) · 01-10-2009, 7:32 PM

Does the sd200 have an external mic and headphone socket?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DPRichards

Ordered the sd200 today.
good CMOS.
v good stills
v good features
pixmania offering a good deal @ £515 (01/10/09)
Due to be delivered in the next 5 days. V. excited.

Am getting a verbatim HD video class6 32Gb card from amazon to go with it.
Good choice, y'think?

Am also looking at spare batteries - not much choice out there, ridiculously expensive Panny spares
3rd party batteries requiring their own chargers. Don't much like 'em from experience with cameras but any tips on brands would be v. welcome.
Ciao!
Dan

DPRichards · 02-10-2009, 2:16 PM

Will report back when it arrives, no mention in the Panasonic website specs . . .

Tinderbox (UK) · 02-10-2009, 2:28 PM

According to the spec it does not, only the more expensive HDC-HS300 and HDC-TM300 in the current range on the UK website.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DPRichards

Will report back when it arrives, no mention in the Panasonic website specs . . .

hutch · 02-10-2009, 11:43 PM

Im based in Australia and am in the same position wanting a HD camcorder to film an upcoming baby for friends and family to see back in the UK.

I think this is the comparable Australian model can someone confirm please, it seems to be the same apart from the fact it has an SD card and 16GB built in memory.

HDC-TM200-K - Twin Memory Full HD Camcorder [HDC-TM200-K] - Panasonic Australia

Are you able to shoot in lower resolutions that FullHD? Its nice to have the option but for most videos SD or 720p would be more than adequate and im mindful that storage of a load of 1080p video is going to take some serious room

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 4:47 AM

Most of them can shoot in SD as well but Im not sure of 720p , maybe full HD but at varying bitrates
The Sony Im curently trialling cannot do 720p but it can do different 1080 AVC bitrates from "LP" , SQ, HQ FQ each biggr in filesize but bettr in quality
SD mpg2 is of course much smaller

chrishull3 · 03-10-2009, 6:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by senu

Most of them can shoot in SD as well but Im not sure of 720p , maybe full HD but at varying bitrates
The Sony Im curently trialling cannot do 720p but it can do different 1080 AVC bitrates from "LP" , SQ, HQ FQ each biggr in filesize but bettr in quality
SD mpg2 is of course much smaller

Have you tried the Sony HDR-XR 500/20s the low light filming on these is supposed to be the best for any consumer cam, far better than the SRs ? .

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 1:24 PM

Im trialling the XR200V, for a few day more..

In Easy Auto mode it isnt that great in low light ( Im being fussy. TBH). It does well indoors if lit with more than 2x 60W tugsten bulbs

The Manual modes are better ( all ltouchscreen)
I have used the manual exposure mode / WB and also to vary shooting quality
Upping the exposure in darker interiors. ups the gain but adds grain and then slows the shutter down

I much prefer Panasonics independent iris /shutter method before needing to up the gain
Also AF hunts in low light and exposure lock i not as fast as Id like it to be
Im not sure how much of all this JP will notice but cant help wondering why these were not better implemented in preference to face recognition and GPS and the much loved dolby 5.1

Also i have not found a massive difference in the SP and FH hi def modes which implement 7 an 16 mbps encoding
The high bitrate encoding does look crisper a bit but you can fill up that 120Gb HDD with less than 2 hrs footage..

Ok Im being fussy:Its build quality is great, Battery life OK and In 1/2 decent light not bad at all . I shot fat moving traffic on the M4 from a bridge at 7 in the evening and the playback is good.
YouTube - Sony Handycam HDRXR200V HD Camcorder

Tinderbox (UK) · 03-10-2009, 3:09 PM

I cannot seem to post photo`s from photobucket , all it shows is the links , is it blocked on this site?

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 3:13 PM

Not really but leave the links
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3304/...c33a277cbe.jpg

Tinderbox (UK) · 03-10-2009, 3:16 PM

Just every other forum i am on 10+, they shows the photo`s not just the links , I saw you linked video above and it shows.

So they allow you to link a video, but not a photo?

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 3:19 PM

This is a video camcorder forum

Lets see
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3304/...c33a277cbe.jpg

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 3:24 PM

Nope you can embed in the photography forums though.. and merely attach to posts here: this ~I saved to my local HDD

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 3:29 PM

and from flickr direct

Tinderbox (UK) · 03-10-2009, 3:34 PM

thanks

chrishull3 · 03-10-2009, 4:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by senu

Im trialling the XR200V, for a few day more..

In Easy Auto mode it isnt that great in low light ( Im being fussy. TBH). It does well indoors if lit with more than 2x 60W tugsten bulbs

The Manual modes are better ( all ltouchscreen)
I have used the manual exposure mode / WB and also to vary shooting quality
Upping the exposure in darker interiors. ups the gain but adds grain and then slows the shutter down

I much prefer Panasonics independent iris /shutter method before needing to up the gain
Also AF hunts in low light and exposure lock i not as fast as Id like it to be
Im not sure how much of all this JP will notice but cant help wondering why these were not better implemented in preference to face recognition and GPS and the much loved dolby 5.1

Also i have not found a massive difference in the SP and FH hi def modes which implement 7 an 16 mbps encoding
The high bitrate encoding does look crisper a bit but you can fill up that 120Gb HDD with less than 2 hrs footage..

Ok Im being fussy:Its build quality is great, Battery life OK and In 1/2 decent light not bad at all . I shot fat moving traffic on the M4 from a bridge at 7 in the evening and the playback is good.
YouTube - Sony Handycam HDRXR200V HD Camcorder

Sony Handycam HDR-XR200V Review - Camcorders
The HDR-XR 500/20 is the cam i meant, i am not sure if this lower spec cam has the the same low light ability, they bring models out like for a past time now, exept tape ones

**senu** · 03-10-2009, 4:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrishull3

Sony Handycam HDR-XR200V Review - Camcorders
The HDR-XR 500/20 is the cam i meant, i am not sure if this lower spec cam has the the same low light ability, they bring models out like for a past time now, exept tape ones

I know
Im not sure the actual sensor specs are that different though this model costs £ 700 +

dapex · 03-10-2009, 4:36 PM

Great thread and thanks for the info so far. I do like the look of the panny 200 as well although its a bit more than I was planning on spending......

chrishull3 · 04-10-2009, 6:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by senu

I know
Im not sure the actual sensor specs are that different though this model costs £ 700 +

Sony HDR-XR520V review

http://www.motionbox.com/videos/7a9ed9b01818e5c4f5

It does look good in low light.

**senu** · 04-10-2009, 1:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrishull3

Sony HDR-XR520V review

empire state2.wmv from romediaproductions on Motionbox

It does look good in low light.

Its sensor is larger than the 200 ( 1/5 inch) but then it also cost abut double the price or at least 1/3rd more

dapex · 05-10-2009, 1:55 PM

please report back and if possibel show us some footage. really liking the look of this one and need to see what its like in low light

Cheers

Also, can you advise if the sd200 can be set to record in lower quality? only asking as I did oringally want a camcorder with a youtube upload facility on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DPRichards

Ordered the sd200 today.
good CMOS.
v good stills
v good features
pixmania offering a good deal @ £515 (01/10/09)
Due to be delivered in the next 5 days. V. excited.

Am getting a verbatim HD video class6 32Gb card from amazon to go with it.
Good choice, y'think?

Am also looking at spare batteries - not much choice out there, ridiculously expensive Panny spares
3rd party batteries requiring their own chargers. Don't much like 'em from experience with cameras but any tips on brands would be v. welcome.
Ciao!
Dan